Hi just a quickie. I have been speaking to different drivers re the use of retarders or exhaust brakes in the wet. Some some say never use them In the wet some say it’s okay because we have abs as standard now. Just wanted your opinions with winter approaching.
Cheers.
I would have thought it would have to be a very harsh exhaust brake/retarder to cause any lockups or skids in wet weather.
kreamo:
Hi just a quickie. I have been speaking to different drivers re the use of retarders or exhaust brakes in the wet. Some some say never use them In the wet some say it’s okay because we have abs as standard now. Just wanted your opinions with winter approaching.Cheers.
Its ok ,but not if your empty or bobtail ,volvo especially have a very keen 3 stage brake that if its on 3 will bring you to a standstill 
Only comment is that they can vary in effectiveness tremendously. My old volvo hardly does anything apart from make a decent noise, some new trucks can almost have you through the windscreen.
My 2001 iveco tipper locks up going down hill when empty but is OK when full
I don’t think ABS has any effect at all on an exhaust brake or retarder.
Ours are fine (DAF XF) whatever the load, or solo.
Currently wizzing about in a 63 plate FH 500 and tbh dont use the exhaust brake that much only a few clicks to stop it going over 60.
Different makes feel different if you stick to 1 make you should be ok but been driving FH’s the last 3 winters not had any bother traction wise or not using the exhaust brake that much.
i would say read your handbook if you have one. our volvo’s use the ABS system to sense a wheel skid and this instantly releases the exhaust brake, they therefore say its safe in all conditions and weather.
Also learn what you have fitted, is it a simple exhaust brake after the manifold, engine brake in the head or hydraulic retarder on the gearbox. They are all different and give greatly different performance levels.
Simple butterfly type exhaust brakes are fairly ineffective at low revs and not likely to cause harm. Can be used in all weather, even recommended on snow, but watch your engine speed and don’t leave it turned on all the time just in case you’re not ready for it. But really you have to be a double declutch master to get the revs high enough to cause issues. Modern trucks have made them idiot proof with abs system sensing drive wheels slowing compared to undriven wheels and its knocked off.
Engine brakes or jake brakes, popular on volvo’s, our FH’s both have them are much more powerful, you can demand how many cylinders it works on, 2,4 or 6. It works at a much higher compression ratio as its in the engine not the exhaust, but again they are idiot proof through the abs system, perhaps keep it on the first setting and don’t go past 1400 revs with it when running light. When loaded you will have a tremendous amount of grip with the drive wheels so just use what you need.
Retarders or hydraulic systems, not got any experience with these or telmars but they are the most powerful types available, use with care might be advised.
In the “good old days” I used Telma all the time. No problem in snow and ice.
Pete 
On Friday in the rain I had a brand new Actros running solo and the 3rd stage was pretty much useless as it was locking up instantly but the system disengages it for a second or so then reapplies it. Then cut it off again …
2nd stage was just about useable and all that was necessary just running solo. I did have a scary moment once when I used it going round a bend in the wet with a trailer on and I skidded into the side of the gutter but I was in the middle of nowhere luckily so no harm done.
As said previously, the exhaust/ engine brake varies from vehicle to vehicle, I found in Renault it’s not very effective and even less effective carrying weight. The Daf’s were better, although one or two were a bit sharp, each vehicle seems to be a bit different from the next , so its a case of getting used to how your vehicle handles.
Volvo ABS didn’t work on FM i drove, nearly caught me out on black ice one morning when i picked the vehicle up and didn’t realise it was on stage 3, empty… 
Use common sense, most exhaust brakes are near enough useless apart from making a noise, chances of lock up with one of those are slim.
Retarders or engine brakes are a different thing entirely, if the thing is capable of providing serious ■■■■■■ on a loaded vehicle without any braking whatsoever, then there’s every chance it’s powerful enough to lock the drive axle empty in lower gears empty(ish), so use loaf and turn it down a bit when conditions dictate.
Few people care any more anyway apart from a few small hauliers and owner drivers, most logistics operators wouldn’t have bloody clue about engine braking (if they did they’d specify vehicles properly with auxilliary brakes to suit the operation), they’ll be brainwashed in the brakes to slow gears to go mantra now taught, and the customer is paying for those annual brake disc and pad renewals so logistics mob not bothered either.
If you feel confident to independently use the auxilliary brake sensibly and effectively, do so, otherwise don’t worry about it the chances are the company arn’t bothered either, just set the thing to auto so it comes on when you brake and you won’t go wrong nor set off any overrev warnings on the spying electronics.
I drive a new Actros and use the engine brake all the time, ideally when coming up to a junction I’ll roll for a while then use stage 1 followed by stage 2 then near the end the more harsh stage 3, but I wouldn’t use stage 3 when solo and would be careful using it when empty and wet.
We do encourage our drivers to use it as obviously saves wear and tear on the brakes and generally better all round.
I use stage 3 in the Actros all the time when solo, no problems. In the wet is a waste of time obviously but on a dry road with plenty of grip stage 3 is fine.
Terry T:
On Friday in the rain I had a brand new Actros running solo and the 3rd stage was pretty much useless as it was locking up instantly but the system disengages it for a second or so then reapplies it. Then cut it off again …2nd stage was just about useable and all that was necessary just running solo. I did have a scary moment once when I used it going round a bend in the wet with a trailer on and I skidded into the side of the gutter but I was in the middle of nowhere luckily so no harm done.
Not sure if this is a troll post or he’s actually serious? Using exhaust brake in a solo tractor unit and then wonders why it’s “locking up instantly” on stage 3 and “just about useable[sic]” on stage 2.
No it’s not a troll post. I’ve never driven the MP4 in the wet until Friday so had no idea how bad it would be. I tried it, it locked up, so I stuck with stage 2. No problems.
We’re monitored on our footbrake usage unfortunately.
Terry T:
No it’s not a troll post. I’ve never driven the MP4 in the wet until Friday so had no idea how bad it would be. I tried it, it locked up, so I stuck with stage 2. No problems.We’re monitored on our footbrake usage unfortunately.
Use Fleetboard to monitor your own driving , anything over 80% is reasonable.
bald bloke:
Use Fleetboard to monitor your own driving , anything over 80% is reasonable.
Don’t care much for reasonable. Hovering just over 95% at the moment. Not quite number 1 in the table but not far off and I’d like to think I’m fairly competent when it comes to engine brake usage. Apart from 1 mishap many moons ago in the dark down a country lane I’ve had no issues.
Anyway LHD, my post was not to say “oh shock horror, I locked up in the wet, how did that happen”, it was aimed at the poster who said ABS doesn’t interact with the engine brake when it clearly does.
You can still use engine brakes in the wet, you just have to find the best way. To get the best of of your equipment you must find its limitations. Some road surfaces allow you to use the harsher settings even in the rain. On the more slippery surfaces you can still use stage 2 providing you don’t bounce the revs sky high. On the MP4 if you activate stage 3 it slams the revs up so is best left alone. In the dry I use it solo every time I drive it if it’s necessary.
Terry T:
bald bloke:
Use Fleetboard to monitor your own driving , anything over 80% is reasonable.Don’t care much for reasonable. Hovering just over 95% at the moment. Not quite number 1 in the table but not far off and I’d like to think I’m fairly competent when it comes to engine brake usage. Apart from 1 mishap many moons ago in the dark down a country lane I’ve had no issues.
Anyway LHD, my post was not to say “oh shock horror, I locked up in the wet, how did that happen”, it was aimed at the poster who said ABS doesn’t interact with the engine brake when it clearly does.
You can still use engine brakes in the wet, you just have to find the best way. To get the best of of your equipment you must find its limitations. Some road surfaces allow you to use the harsher settings even in the rain. On the more slippery surfaces you can still use stage 2 providing you don’t bounce the revs sky high. On the MP4 if you activate stage 3 it slams the revs up so is best left alone. In the dry I use it solo every time I drive it if it’s necessary.
Your truck must be broken then because even stage 1 is enough to put you through the windscreen on a solo Merc Actros. And why pander to what some office monkey tells about how to drive? He’s probably never even been in a truck. Using retarder (or exhaust brake) when running solo is, well, retarded. Don’t tell me, it’s one of these companies that wants you to use CC in 30mph zones as well right? Why do people work for these muppet companies? Tell them to go ■■■■ themselves!