It was a disaster waiting to happen, just look at the wage structure as a starter , most of the workers at Redcar work 4 days , 4 nights and then 4 days off, after so many of these shifts they then get 18 days off, i cant remember the exact maths of it but basically they only work 6 months of the year
is it me or could they drastically cut there wage bill if they made them do a proper weeks work, fair play to the lads that work there for getting away with it but surely they knew it couldnt last forever
It seems the unions negotiated( insisted) on the old British Steel way of working when the furnace fired up again but then British steel (Tata as it became) closed the plant because it was unprofitable, not much has changed…
chaversdad:
It was a disaster waiting to happen, just look at the wage structure as a starter , most of the workers at Redcar work 4 days , 4 nights and then 4 days off, after so many of these shifts they then get 18 days off, i cant remember the exact maths of it but basically they only work 6 months of the year
is it me or could they drastically cut there wage bill if they made them do a proper weeks work, fair play to the lads that work there for getting away with it but surely they knew it couldnt last forever
It seems the unions negotiated( insisted) on the old British Steel way of working when the furnace fired up again but then British steel (Tata as it became) closed the plant because it was unprofitable, not much has changed…
Tis often said that you should walk a mile in another man’s shoes etc. I’ve no personal experience of working in a blast furnace but from what I understand, for those at the “sharp end” it’s a dirty hot horrible job, and still in these days of Elf and Safety a pretty dangerous one too. I’m buggered if I’d do it.
Here’s the maths for the average five day a week worker; 52 weeks in a year, so that’s 260 working days. Take away 20 days holiday, plus eight bank holidays, and you’ve got 232 days working.
So even that bloke’s only working for less than two thirds of the year, and he gets to pick and choose when he has his holidays. If that steelworker is only working for 6 months then that’s about 182 days; they’re twelve hour shifts so if you work that out in terms of what the average five day worker’s on, he’d be working 8.4 hours per day to do the same number of hours as the steelworker. I’ve assumed for the purposes of the exercise that the steelworker has to take his annual leave in those 18 day blocks you mentioned. So it’s not quite the cushy number you might think, perhaps?
As for changing the hours; you can bet your bottom dollar that those workers’ contracts are tighter than water-tight, given the unions’ involvement with the industry.
chaversdad:
It was a disaster waiting to happen, just look at the wage structure as a starter , most of the workers at Redcar work 4 days , 4 nights and then 4 days off, after so many of these shifts they then get 18 days off, i cant remember the exact maths of it but basically they only work 6 months of the year
is it me or could they drastically cut there wage bill if they made them do a proper weeks work, fair play to the lads that work there for getting away with it but surely they knew it couldnt last forever
It seems the unions negotiated( insisted) on the old British Steel way of working when the furnace fired up again but then British steel (Tata as it became) closed the plant because it was unprofitable, not much has changed…
Tis often said that you should walk a mile in another man’s shoes etc. I’ve no personal experience of working in a blast furnace but from what I understand, for those at the “sharp end” it’s a dirty hot horrible job, and still in these days of Elf and Safety a pretty dangerous one too. I’m buggered if I’d do it.
Here’s the maths for the average five day a week worker; 52 weeks in a year, so that’s 260 working days. Take away 20 days holiday, plus eight bank holidays, and you’ve got 232 days working.
So even that bloke’s only working for less than two thirds of the year, and he gets to pick and choose when he has his holidays. If that steelworker is only working for 6 months then that’s about 182 days; they’re twelve hour shifts so if you work that out in terms of what the average five day worker’s on, he’d be working 8.4 hours per day to do the same number of hours as the steelworker. I’ve assumed for the purposes of the exercise that the steelworker has to take his annual leave in those 18 day blocks you mentioned. So it’s not quite the cushy number you might think, perhaps?
As for changing the hours; you can bet your bottom dollar that those workers’ contracts are tighter than water-tight, given the unions’ involvement with the industry.
If there’s one good thing that might come out of it it’s that the Union rank and file might start to realise that the bs idea of Socialism and workers of the world unite is as bad and the same thing as global free market economics.The only way to fix that is by going for a nationalist protectionist trade policy in which if it’s sold here it’s made here by Brit workers for Brit wages and Brit terms and conditions.That will take a Labour leader of the calibre of Shore and not zb Corbyn.
Just hope they can work something out for those that work there, it’s going to have a big impact on our company, these past weeks have been a nightmare, and I would imagine its been the same for all suppliers. Apparently, Newport docks is awash with cheap Chinese steel, that’s been imported, that’s why the steel industry is in a mess, and this is probably going to be the kiss of death for uk steel production,
" India to open 28 new collieries, and 3 new steel works."
As Britain turns its back on coal,India has announced that it is to more than double annual production 494 million tons , to 1 Billion tons !
The country’s Ministry of Coal plans to open 28 new collieries, construct new railways to serve the pits, and build 200 rakes of wagons ( that’s about 20 wagons a rake)
The move is in response to high demand for coal, including steel making plants and power stations… But is also aimed at reducing the country’s dependence on imported fuel.
In South Africa, a massive coal fired power station is under construction.
And we all keep being told that coal is dead, this neck of the world anyway, meanwhile our steel plants, and industry have to compete on energy generated on expensive, wind, gas, and biofuels.
perkibre:
Just hope they can work something out for those that work there, it’s going to have a big impact on our company, these past weeks have been a nightmare, and I would imagine its been the same for all suppliers. Apparently, Newport docks is awash with cheap Chinese steel, that’s been imported, that’s why the steel industry is in a mess, and this is probably going to be the kiss of death for uk steel production,
" India to open 28 new collieries, and 3 new steel works."
As Britain turns its back on coal,India has announced that it is to more than double annual production 494 million tons , to 1 Billion tons !
The country’s Ministry of Coal plans to open 28 new collieries, construct new railways to serve the pits, and build 200 rakes of wagons ( that’s about 20 wagons a rake)
The move is in response to high demand for coal, including steel making plants and power stations… But is also aimed at reducing the country’s dependence on imported fuel.
In South Africa, a massive coal fired power station is under construction.
And we all keep being told that coal is dead, this neck of the world anyway, meanwhile our steel plants, and industry have to compete on energy generated on expensive, wind, gas, and biofuels.
+1 Thatcher was warned in the 80’s that if the pits are closed they will be extremely expensive to open again. Most of them had concrete poured in Now the talk is of opening up our coal mines again so we can be Energy Self-Sufficient. and so the mis-management of Britain continues …
Deep mined coal is finished; quite simply, it’s far too expensive quite apart from the environmental impact; and furthermore, much of the coal sitting under this green and pleasant land is high-sulphur hard coal which isn’t particularly suitable for modern power stations. There’s also the problems with geological faults which is effectively what scuppered the state-of-the-art Vale of Belvoir coalfield in the late 1970’s; popular history of course puts it all down to Thatcher but there was a lot more to it than that.
Take a trip up the Heads of the Valleys road to see coal mining in today’s Britain; it’s all opencast. Cheaper to mine, which makes it cost competitive with imports. safer environment for the workforce and when it’s done you fill the hole up with landfill and grass it over. Trouble is the local residents don’t like the noise, dust etc. which is why so many similar projects never get off the ground. Half of South Africa’s coal is open-cast, with the local power station normally being next to the pit which cuts transport costs dramatically; and their environmental record is very poor, with many sub-surface fires burning for decades at abandoned mines.
India may indeed be opening 28 new collieries, but even Maggie wouldn’t expect our miners to work for a fiver a day. The availability of cheap (or even slave) labour in Asian and East European countries is what ultimately killed off our deep mined coal industry.
Sidevalve:
Deep mined coal is finished; quite simply, it’s far too expensive quite apart from the environmental impact; and furthermore, much of the coal sitting under this green and pleasant land is high-sulphur hard coal which isn’t particularly suitable for modern power stations. There’s also the problems with geological faults which is effectively what scuppered the state-of-the-art Vale of Belvoir coalfield in the late 1970’s; popular history of course puts it all down to Thatcher but there was a lot more to it than that.
Take a trip up the Heads of the Valleys road to see coal mining in today’s Britain; it’s all opencast. Cheaper to mine, which makes it cost competitive with imports. safer environment for the workforce and when it’s done you fill the hole up with landfill and grass it over. Trouble is the local residents don’t like the noise, dust etc. which is why so many similar projects never get off the ground. Half of South Africa’s coal is open-cast, with the local power station normally being next to the pit which cuts transport costs dramatically; and their environmental record is very poor, with many sub-surface fires burning for decades at abandoned mines.
India may indeed be opening 28 new collieries, but even Maggie wouldn’t expect our miners to work for a fiver a day. The availability of cheap (or even slave) labour in Asian and East European countries is what ultimately killed off our deep mined coal industry.
That reads like you’ve swallowed all the bs Con Party propaganda.Like all our other industries what’s killed/killing them is opening the domestic market to imports made in slave labour countries.The problem being a so called ‘post’ Fordist version of ‘capitalism’ which sees the minimising of wage levels as a good thing while conveniently forgetting the effects of that on demand and living standards.
As for the quality of UK coal it’s actually always been second to none.Welsh anthracite being one example.
perkibre:
And we all keep being told that coal is dead, this neck of the world anyway, meanwhile our steel plants, and industry have to compete on energy generated on expensive, wind, gas, and biofuels.
It’s the issue of having to ‘compete’ against third world slave labour economies which is doing the damage.When it’s obvious that if we don’t opt out of the global free market economy and change to a policy of protectionism we’ll be turned into a de industrialised banana republic.
Sidevalve:
Deep mined coal is finished; quite simply, it’s far too expensive quite apart from the environmental impact; and furthermore, much of the coal sitting under this green and pleasant land is high-sulphur hard coal which isn’t particularly suitable for modern power stations. There’s also the problems with geological faults which is effectively what scuppered the state-of-the-art Vale of Belvoir coalfield in the late 1970’s; popular history of course puts it all down to Thatcher but there was a lot more to it than that.
Take a trip up the Heads of the Valleys road to see coal mining in today’s Britain; it’s all opencast. Cheaper to mine, which makes it cost competitive with imports. safer environment for the workforce and when it’s done you fill the hole up with landfill and grass it over. Trouble is the local residents don’t like the noise, dust etc. which is why so many similar projects never get off the ground. Half of South Africa’s coal is open-cast, with the local power station normally being next to the pit which cuts transport costs dramatically; and their environmental record is very poor, with many sub-surface fires burning for decades at abandoned mines.
India may indeed be opening 28 new collieries, but even Maggie wouldn’t expect our miners to work for a fiver a day. The availability of cheap (or even slave) labour in Asian and East European countries is what ultimately killed off our deep mined coal industry.
That reads like you’ve swallowed all the bs Con Party propaganda.Like all our other industries what’s killed/killing them is opening the domestic market to imports made in slave labour countries.The problem being a so called ‘post’ Fordist version of ‘capitalism’ which sees the minimising of wage levels as a good thing while conveniently forgetting the effects of that on demand and living standards.
As for the quality of UK coal it’s actually always been second to none.Welsh anthracite being one example.
CF, what I said is pretty much what you said but without the political attitude.
Power stations do not need high quality coal; in fact they work better on lower-grade stuff which doesn’t burn so fast cos it’s pulverised pretty much into dust and blown in not shovelled.
It’s far too easy to look back at deep mining with a very highly tinted pair of rose-coloured spectacles. The blunt reality was that it was a hard, dirty and extremely dangerous job whose end product and production technique had seriously negative environmental impact. The Valleys are back to being green today; leave 'em that way.
Sidevalve:
CF, what I said is pretty much what you said but without the political attitude.
Power stations do not need high quality coal; in fact they work better on lower-grade stuff which doesn’t burn so fast cos it’s pulverised pretty much into dust and blown in not shovelled.
It’s far too easy to look back at deep mining with a very highly tinted pair of rose-coloured spectacles. The blunt reality was that it was a hard, dirty and extremely dangerous job whose end product and production technique had seriously negative environmental impact. The Valleys are back to being green today; leave 'em that way.
The idea of closing down the mining industry on ‘environmental’ grounds might work in an ideal world.But the reality is we can’t have reliable long term energy self sufficiency without getting back to the idea of coal is king.Let alone the suicidal economics which combines over reliance on imports of stuff we can/should make for ourselves.Together with trying to make the figures add up in an environment of ever increasing over supply of the labour market and resulting decreasing wage levels and tax revenues.While paying for the ever increasing debts caused by the massive trade deficit by printing more money because we no longer have the industry to back the currency.
On the news it said that it was going to put 80 million into the area to retrain the workers made redundant. That works out to about £47000 per person if it’s just the 1700 that they’re interested in. I think i’d rather have the cash than the retraining if I were one of those affected!
