Range change gearbox and virginity

Well, as you might have guessed i have lost one of those things :grimacing:

Two days in a row i hade a chance driving two manual artics.

So the first one was a daf cf 3over3 splitter, 64 plated.

tbh i thought seeing a modern manual unit was like seeing a dinosaur. But well, here it is and i have to drive it. A quick review of the gearboxes thread on this forum and google on splitter makes me more or less comfortable with the theory.

I was not sure if you can do a range change and a split change ay the same time but it appears the answer is yes, you can.

Drivers around were very excited about seeing a manual artic and everyone wanted to get in the cab and ā€œtouch the stickā€ :slight_smile:

The mechanics of changing the gears is easy and does not take more than a couple of minutes to feel comfortable. The difficult thing for me was / is making the gear choice in your head. Obviously the sequence is different depending on how heavy the load is. I have seen someone suggesting going 1h-3l for some reason i did not like it and used 1h-2h-3h making the full use of the splitter in the upper range. Tbh honest i cant remember why i was uncomfortable with 1h-3l.

But going down the gears is a bit more difficult for me. My brain is not fast enough on deciding which gear i want to be in and quite often the final decision was made too late as the speed had already changed.

My next day was full of joy as well as i got a daf xf with 4over4 now with a splitter as well.Basically i faced similar problems with decision making.

My personal feelings on the subject are a bit complicated though. On one hand i liked the ability to put the truck in the gear i want and more importantly not guessing when the bloody autobox decides to pull out. On the other hand i am still not very good in deciding quickly on the gear i want to be in going down or pulling out.

But the thing that annoyed the hell of me is the mechanics of the gearbox on these particular units. I have driven a rigid cf with a straight six gearbox and it was a peice of cake to change the gears: short movements of the stick, youvare always sure that the gear has engaged and that it is the right one. On these x over x gear boxes the distance thebstick travelsbis tremendeous, i had to lean forward all the time and the overall feel was like you are pushing the stick in a jelly: has ot engaged? If yes what gear? too often i kicked the wrong one - normally 1 instead of 3 on the 4over4. Not sure i explained properly though :slight_smile:

The other thing is that pulling out is soooooo slow for me, it took me ages to pick some speed up, autobis doimg that way faster.

So unfortunatlybi cannot conclude that i lost my virginity. I know how ot works, i can do it, bit i can do it quite poorly, lets be honest.

Ps am i the only one finding dafs both manual and auto very bouncy?

Knock over boxes are far superior in my eyes. 3 over 3 just seems silly. Maybe its something that Dafs do as they age but I drove a 56 plate CF 18t and that gearbox was like a stick in a bucket of slop, all loose and wobberly. On the other hand, I drove an MAN with an Easy-shift and that was pretty good, 4 over 4 with a splitter. Just donā€™t rush it, youā€™ll get a box of nothing like I did on a roundabout.

The best manual I ever drove was a Merc Axor with a 8 speed knock over. Nice tight feel to the shift changes, gears were where you needed them to be plus it could take a beating. Still, give me a auto over a manual any day.

A lot of grief is down to poor maintenance. If linkages, of assorted types, are not up to scratch youā€™ll feel like youā€™re stirring a pudding.

Pete :laughing: :laughing:

Iā€™ve always 4 over 4ā€™s to be guesswork. Go for first ā€œGRRRRRā€, yeah I think thatā€™s reverse :unamused:. Started using 2nd instead (not a great load on). The splitter isnā€™t hugely important unless youā€™ve got a lot on the back. Iā€™ve mostly used it with low gears for keeping up with traffic (when the traffic is slower than your truck then something is wrongā€¦).

Never used a 3 over 3, or a slapover, but Iā€™m young yet.

agree that the merc axor slapovers are pretty easy and straightforward. ive driven a few different types of 4 over 4 now and they are all different. in the volvos it feels like an almost seemless move between 1-4 and 5-8 whereas in the MANs there seems to be a delay in being able to go from 3 to 5. not a long delay, but enough that you notice it and when pulling away it seems to be slow to change

Daf 4 over 4 is the best box by far just donā€™t rush and sometimes double the clutch makes it easier, slap overs are a pain in the ā– ā– ā– 

Peter Smythe:
youā€™ll feel like youā€™re stirring a pudding.Pete :laughing: :laughing:

thats exactly how i felt it

Radar19:
Knock over boxes are far superior in my eyes

loved the one on my training iveco

Only ever driver a manual for 1 day on my class 2 training (Which didnā€™t exactly go well! :laughing:)
So somewhat scared by the thought that I may have to get in one againā€¦
Iā€™m sure I would sort it out and get the hang of it with a bit of practice, but iā€™d be ā– ā– ā– ā– ā– ā– ā– ā–  myself! :laughing:

Good on ya Priest! :smiley:

Drove both manual and automatics since passing my Class 2.

My current ride is a 4 over 4 manual and i much prefer this gearbox to any automatic iā€™ve so far driven.

Driving in London itā€™s an auto all the way but when I have to do twisty up and down A roads I would prefer a manual

blue estate:
Driving in London itā€™s an auto all the way but when I have to do twisty up and down A roads I would prefer a manual

You canā€™t beat a manual when youā€™re battering about at strictly 50mph and not a mile more constable.

Edit: Before I get shouted at, go to Wales. I thought I was quick but the tipper in front of me just kept getting smaller :open_mouth:. Mad as hatters.

It always takes a few days to get comfy with a new, to you, manual box, so it aint going to be a barrel of laughs for newer/younger drivers who have in many cases only driven autos from day one, well done Priest, judging gear needed every time exactly will only come when youā€™ve had the vehicle for a few days, and will take months to perfect to get the very best from your engine, fuel versus progress.

My mate is getting to grips with things the other way round, heā€™s come from a left ā– ā– ā– ā– ā– ā– , manual boxed, lots of grunt being high specced in the first place.
Now heā€™s driving a RHD, with auto rubbish box and underpowered to boot at constant maximum weights :open_mouth: , thankfully the large wage increase and much shorter hours makes up for it.

The 16 speed Daf manual i had till three years ago was a cracking box, suited the 460 lump too, 4 then 4 then split every gear if reqd, very slick box which could see you taking advantage of rolling junctions that most autos canā€™t, you could be 400 yards down the road and nearly up to limiter whilst the auto version is still debating itself.

Pete Smythe is spot on about maintenance, or lack of it, a Scania with the not exactly pleasant 3 speed ranger plus split making it a 12 was a horrid gearchange once worn, someone rolled one and it was recabbed, new gear linkage fitted, the transformation in gearchange quality had to be experienced to be believed, and considering it was 1m+ kms when rolled even more amazing.

Once Iā€™ve got my dcpc card thought I might book an hour or two with a trainer with a manual just to get the feel of a split or slap box as I passed my test In a lovely Iveco auto!

spacemanZ10:
Once Iā€™ve got my dcpc card thought I might book an hour or two with a trainer with a manual just to get the feel of a split or slap box as I passed my test In a lovely Iveco auto!

no no no no no no no no no no no no no, sorry, the words Iveco and Lovely cannot ever, and never could in all the history of the world, appear together complimenting one another in one sentence, as for asserting that an Iveco auto could in any sense of the term be described as lovely simply does not compute.

take 100 lines that boy and i want them in by Friday or itā€™ll be Masters detention on Saturday for youā€¦ :laughing:

Juddian:

spacemanZ10:
Once Iā€™ve got my dcpc card thought I might book an hour or two with a trainer with a manual just to get the feel of a split or slap box as I passed my test In a lovely Iveco auto!

no no no no no no no no no no no no no, sorry, the words Iveco and Lovely cannot ever, and never could in all the history of the world, appear together complimenting one another in one sentence, as for asserting that an Iveco auto could in any sense of the term be described as lovely simply does not compute.

take 100 lines that boy and i want them in by Friday or itā€™ll be Masters detention on Saturday for youā€¦ :laughing:

LMFAO - I was thinking exactly the sameā€¦
OK I did my Class 2 training in one, and it was fine for that.
But I wouldnā€™t want one day in day outā€¦

Can I also add that the words ā€œMercā€ ā€œAutoā€ and ā€œlovelyā€ should not be used together without an accompanying essay describing how on earth such a concept could exist (in my experience anyway). Otherwise youā€™ll need to attend two of Juddianā€™s detentions!

As for Iveco - we know theyā€™re Italian, but most vehicles from that country are as useful as a Fiat 125 Specialā€¦aka. they are ā€œspecialā€. :wink:

Yep trev, what a pity, coupled to a manual box a standard Merc 430 engine as found in the much derided square Axor is a lovely strong puller, makes driving especially at junctions a pleasure in comparison, youā€™d never believe it was the same vehicle once you throw that poxy box into the mix.

What you reckon a choice between Mercs mediocre offering and ZFā€™s arsetonic gearbox of doom, which is worse?

Lines havenā€™t arrived yet, looking badā€¦ :laughing:

The best autos Iā€™ve driven have been dust carts with the alisons touch button box
As for the Daf Lf auto box was designed by Vogons and need 2 weeks written notice to pull out of a junction :imp:

It does puzzle me why the MAN and Merc auto boxes are so bad and slow to respond, as the Renaultā€™s I drive most of the time now are miles aheadā€¦ These apparently use the Volvo gearbox (and I assume engine) which are a dream in comparison! :smiley:

I will stop being a bellend!
I will stop being a bellend!
I will stop being a bellend!
I will stop being a bellend!
I will stop being a bellend!
I will stop being a bellend!
I will stop being a bellend!
ā€¦

renaults are really nice indeed