Over 10 hours driving time in a single day. Not all on a tacho, some of it in a van. All of it in company vehicles on company time though.
100% legal or not?
I thought I knew the answer but I’m getting conflicting information from so called expert CPC trainers and my TM.
What’s TruckNet say?
No opinions please, I need cold hard facts.
driving a vehicle not fitted with a tacho is classed as other work.
you can then do a manual entry to cover next time you insert your card into a tacho head.
Is the van GVW under 3500 kg ?
If yes then that is counted as other work for EU regs
If you are mixing both then remember that all the work etc done in that shift must be officially recorded not just the EU regs bit
Trukkertone:
driving a vehicle not fitted with a tacho is classed as other work.
That’s what I thought.
I’ve been told otherwise by two different CPC trainers though. 
Yes ROG, it’s under 3500kg.
So just to clarify; 10 hours driving a lorry followed by 2 hours driving a company van and getting paid for it is absolutely completely 100% legal, right? If I accidentally killed some children in that last 2 hours, I’ve not committed any offence with regards to driving time, correct?
Not what we were told,if you are getting PAID to drive the van then it’s part of your daily driving allowance.
Contraflow:
So just to clarify; 10 hours driving a lorry followed by 2 hours driving a company van and getting paid for it is absolutely completely 100% legal, right? If I accidentally killed some children in that last 2 hours, I’ve not committed any offence with regards to driving time, correct?
10 hours driving followed by 2 or 3 hrs OTHER WORK… IS LEGAL
as long as he has had proper breaks
ckm1981:
Not what we were told,if you are getting PAID to drive the van then it’s part of your daily driving allowance.
Pay has no bearing on the matter.
Driving is the time recorded on the equipment as driving. The equipment will only record driving when moving (some early digital Tachodisc can record up to 2 minutes of driving when stationary).
Driving ANY kind of vehicle would be considered as work and of course work must be recorded. Of course you can however travel to or from a regular place of work as part of your rest period.
So you could drive 9 hours in a vehicle over 3.5t and then drive a 3.5t van. HOWEVER - if you are using the van as a goods vehicle rather than just a mode of transport then be aware that you may need to comply with both EU Rules and also GB Domestic rules. When carrying out mixed activities BOTH sets of rules must be complied with.
Therefore as soon as you drive the van - the driving time in the Tacho vehicle counts towards the max 10 hours drive time for GB rules (but driving of the van only counts as work for EU rules). And also be aware the definition of driving is different for EU Rules than GB Rules.
Mixed EU and GB is possibly about as complex as it gets.
Contraflow:
Trukkertone:
driving a vehicle not fitted with a tacho is classed as other work.That’s what I thought.
I’ve been told otherwise by two different CPC trainers though.
Yes ROG, it’s under 3500kg.
What did the CPC trainers tell you? Were they consistent?
ckm1981:
Not what we were told,if you are getting PAID to drive the van then it’s part of your daily driving allowance.
which numpty told you that ?
Bet it was a dcpc trainer who has never been in this industry …
You’re good with that, crack on drive!
shep532:
Contraflow:
Trukkertone:
driving a vehicle not fitted with a tacho is classed as other work.That’s what I thought.
I’ve been told otherwise by two different CPC trainers though.
What did the CPC trainers tell you? Were they consistent?
Yes, consistently inept.
ROG:
Bet it was a dcpc trainer who has never been in this industry …
Yeah! Flamin DCPC trainers 
Contraflow:
I need cold hard facts.
Hope that helps.
Contraflow:
So just to clarify; 10 hours driving a lorry followed by 2 hours driving a company van and getting paid for it is absolutely completely 100% legal, right? If I accidentally killed some children in that last 2 hours, I’ve not committed any offence with regards to driving time, correct?
Come on, Fess Up Contra’ did you Accidentally kill 2 innocent children [emoji127] in the last 2 hours & you’re just sorting out your Alibi ?
Phew, the Tacho Infringements/Offences are ok, it’s just the Manslaughter Charge to worry about now. [emoji6]
Would that be this then Shep??
transportsfriend.org/hours/mixed.html
If it is, looks like you’d be breaking the GB rules in a few ways, both the driving and working time?
I can imagine what the prosecuting barrister would be saying in court if you did kill two children in the last two hours. Would the exchange between the QC and the defence barrister go something like this…
QC
So you claim to have been fit to drive at the time of striking the children?
DB
Objection me lud my client was not driving he was on “other work”
Judge
Overruled although the defendant was on “other work” there is no doubt that he was driving a motor vehicle and that he struck the two children resulting in their deaths. The fact that he did drive a HGV vehicle for 10 hours previous to this “other work” certainly has a bearing in this case.
Defendant
Where’s me ■■■■■■ tablets
Trukkertone:
driving a vehicle not fitted with a tacho is classed as other work.
you can then do a manual entry to cover next time you insert your card into a tacho head.
tell that to the money grabbing flip flops that work as shunters at my place all weekend then go back on general mon fri NO CARD NEEDED time sheets can be manipulated 
waynedl:
Would that be this then Shep??transportsfriend.org/hours/mixed.html
If it is, looks like you’d be breaking the GB rules in a few ways, both the driving and working time?
The Road Transport Working Time Rules don’t apply to GB DOMESTIC activities. For GB Domestic it is the normal WTD and the worker can opt out of most, if not all of this.
I believe that if the van driving was for the purpose of deliveries/collections then after 9 hours of EU driving they could then only drive the van for a further 1 hour. Alternatively a combination throughout the shift of EU and van driving would mean after 10 hours of these activities no more driving of the van could take place, but you could continue in the truck under EU rules until your driving time was finished. If the driving of the van was simply as a means of transport then I don’t believe it infringes the GB Domestic rules.
Of course driving a 3.5t van does not require any record keeping for GB Domestic rules - on the other hand it does for EU Rules but only has to be recorded as OTHER WORK!!!
Basically EU and GB Domestic rules do not play well together. Personally I would simply stick to EU Rules throughout the shift and ignore GB Domestic. I’m not saying that would be legal though - that’s just what I would do. Use a tacho/digi card, manually record all van driving as work, stick to the EU driving limits, daily rest, breaks etc.
Mixed EU/AETR and GB domestic driving
Many drivers spend some of their time driving under one set of rules and some under another set, perhaps even on the same day. If you work partly under EU/AETR rules and partly under GB domestic rules during a day or a week, the following points must be considered (the EU rules take precedence over the GB domestic rules):
The time you spend driving under EU rules cannot count as an off-duty period under GB domestic rules.
Driving and other duty under GB domestic rules (including non-driving work in another
employment) count as attendance at work but not as a break or rest period under EU rules.
Driving under EU rules count towards the driving and duty limits under GB domestic rules.
Any driving under EU rules in a week means that you must take a daily rest period on those days
when you actually drive under EU rules, as well as a weekly rest period.