I have had an SP30 on my license (for private car) for 3 years, I received NO POINTS but a 1 month ban and an £85 fine.
I was meant to attend court for this due to the speed (just over 100mph) but on the letter which I received it clearly said “If you do not attend court it will proceed in your absence)”. I just assumed I didn’t have to go, so I didn’t. I rang up that day to find out the result to be told I had a warrant out for my arrest for not attending.
I handed myself in and was read my rights but then allowed to go home and awaited another court date. I explained this to the judges and explained that I assumed it was optional to attend because of how it was written, all 3 judges chose to ignore this and moved on.
My question is would I of received a criminal record? I am always unsure what to put now when filling in forms and it asks for criminal convictions/records. Is there a way for me to check up?
But from what you have posted already, I would say “Yes, you have a criminal record and it should be disclosed until it is ‘spent’.” It will normally become ‘spent’ after 2.5 or 5 years, depending on your age at the time. The fact that a warrant was issued and you were arrested has no bearing on it - this was done simply to secure your attendance at court.
Would it show on a CRB check? I’m sure I had one a couple of years ago so surely it would show on there? My previous employer at the time never mentioned anything to me.
nurburg340:
Would it show on a CRB check? I’m sure I had one a couple of years ago so surely it would show on there? My previous employer at the time never mentioned anything to me.
If it’s dealt with by a court hearing, then yes, it should. If it was dealt with by Fixed Penalty (or by going on a Speed Awareness or Driver Improvement course) then no, it should not.
Oh - and to explain what happened with your court hearing:
The case can (and indeed did) proceed in your absence, and you were found Guilty. But then when it came to sentencing, the rule is that you have to be present to get your disqualification. There is usually a tick-box on the paperwork somewhere so you can indicate whether or not you will be attending. In the absence of a response one way or the other, the Court will often presume that you are deliberately ignoring the matter and so will issue an arrest warrant (although it will normally be backed for bail, so the arresting officer can immediately bail you assuming he is happy that your address etc details are correct).
When you subsequently appeared before the Court, they were not considering your guilt/innocence of the charge, nor the sentence (£85 fine in your case), as this had already been decided, in your absence, at the earlier hearing. Their only consideration was whether or not to impose an immediate ban. The ins and outs of the letter you received, and why you did not attend the original hearing were irrelevant to this process. Hence they ignored those matters.
From what you are saying I don’t think you do have a criminal record as it would seem that they only delt with the offence in hand which was a traffic violation for which you got banned. Also from what you are saying you attended court to hear the outcome of the case ‘sentencing’. You could of at this stage offered some form of mitigation if you presented yourself correctly…
You stated your reasons for not attend in error of your understanding of the paperwork. Judges tend to be reasonable and you did hand yourself in. I think that if the police had to come and get you the judges might have viewed things differently.
If you was only sentenced in relation to the original offence and there was no mention of anything else during the judge summing up. Then I would say you don’t have a criminal record.
However if on the other hand the sentencing was broken in to two parts; one covering the sentence and the other covering the no appearance… Where the judge either combines the punishment or gives out a second part of the punisent… ie ‘on the matter of failing to attend your court summons I find you guilty of contempt of court or states that for failure to attend court you fined / sentenced to■■?’ Then you will have a criminal record IMHO…
Why don’t you try popping down to the local police station with your id and explaining the situation ask if you have one…
I’m pretty sure when the same happened to me the letter gives you the option to plead guilty and not attend but you have to tick that box and send the form back before the court date.
Why didn’t you turn up though? They are usually less severe on you when you put you suit on a make an appearance. I got a 14 day ban and no points for 97mph in a 60mph.
Thruxton:
From what you are saying I don’t think you do have a criminal record as it would seem that they only delt with the offence in hand which was a traffic violation for which you got banned. Also from what you are saying you attended court to hear the outcome of the case ‘sentencing’. You could of at this stage offered some form of mitigation if you presented yourself correctly…
You stated your reasons for not attend in error of your understanding of the paperwork. Judges tend to be reasonable and you did hand yourself in. I think that if the police had to come and get you the judges might have viewed things differently.
If you was only sentenced in relation to the original offence and there was no mention of anything else during the judge summing up. Then I would say you don’t have a criminal record.
However if on the other hand the sentencing was broken in to two parts; one covering the sentence and the other covering the no appearance… Where the judge either combines the punishment or gives out a second part of the punisent… ie ‘on the matter of failing to attend your court summons I find you guilty of contempt of court or states that for failure to attend court you fined / sentenced to■■?’ Then you will have a criminal record IMHO…
Why don’t you try popping down to the local police station with your id and explaining the situation ask if you have one…
Hope that helps
I don’t think that will be of much help to the OP, sadly. Here in the UK the idea of “traffic violations” (an American term, I think) being separate from other Criminal matters does not exist from a legal standpoint. In this country, if you have been found guilty by a Court then you have a “criminal record” and it will normally show on a standard level CRB (or, as it is now called, DBS) check. If the offence was dealt with by Fixed Penalty (regardless of whether it was a traffic or public order/minor crime offence) then it will not show on such a check, and you won’t have a “criminal record” as a result of it.
To answer the question of why I didn’t attend, I have never been in trouble with the police before or gone to court. The thought of going scared me so much I was willing to take a more severe punishment (longer ban or bigger fine), stupid I know.
I did present myself very well in court the second time and as stated I have never been in trouble with the police, I started my own successful business at 18 (speeding happened when I was 19) and explained to them the speeding was a moment of stupidness and explained my reasons for not attending court.
Nothing was mentioned of a criminal record and nothing was mentioned of me not attending court.
So what your saying Roymondo is that if I were doing 99mph and received a fixed penalty I wouldn’t of become a “criminal” but because I was doing 107mph that warrants me being a registered criminal and therefore find it harder to find work in the future… All for a speeding offence? Doesn’t that seem a bit ridiculous as surely then everyone who speeds “should” be a criminal due to it being against the law?
They dealt with the original offence now you were there in person as stated before you MUST be present in court for offences that cant be dealt with by fixed penalties. If its says they are taking you to court over it they do expect you there!
You cant get a criminal record for ANY motoring offence.
Criminal charges maybe brought as a result of some secondary outcome of your motoring offence but the motoring offence will not be a criminal offence in itself.
Seeing you were speeding, got caught and banned by a court due to level of speeding, bad boy accept the ban/fine and let it go off your licence in due course.
Fact you were arrested for non-appearance makes no never mind simply a mechanism to get you into court so they could dish out the sentence for your motoring offence in person.
You do not have a criminal record so nothing to declare other than speeding
nurburg340:
To answer the question of why I didn’t attend, I have never been in trouble with the police before or gone to court. The thought of going scared me so much I was willing to take a more severe punishment (longer ban or bigger fine), stupid I know.
I did present myself very well in court the second time and as stated I have never been in trouble with the police, I started my own successful business at 18 (speeding happened when I was 19) and explained to them the speeding was a moment of stupidness and explained my reasons for not attending court.
Nothing was mentioned of a criminal record and nothing was mentioned of me not attending court.
So what your saying Roymondo is that if I were doing 99mph and received a fixed penalty I wouldn’t of become a “criminal” but because I was doing 107mph that warrants me being a registered criminal and therefore find it harder to find work in the future… All for a speeding offence? Doesn’t that seem a bit ridiculous as surely then everyone who speeds “should” be a criminal due to it being against the law?
The question asked was whether or not you had a criminal record (with a sub-text about how you should answer conviction questions on job applications), not whether you were a criminal. By the literal meaning of the word, anyone who breaks the law is indeed a criminal - but the question asked on job applications etc is not “Have you ever committed a crime?” - rather it is “Have you ever been convicted of any criminal offence?” (or similar words). A Fixed Penalty is not a conviction (there is no admission of guilt), even if it is issued in respect of e.g. an offence of Theft. As it’s not a conviction, it doesn’t need to be disclosed when answering a question about them. If it’s dealt with by a court hearing then yes, it is a conviction and has to be disclosed as such. Yes, it’s crap, but those are the rules…
The discussion as to whether speeding (or any other traffic offence) should be classed as a crime is a whole new can of worms - but in all honesty, which has the greatest potential to cause harm; Speeding at 100mph+ or nicking a Mars bar from Tesco’s?
Roymondo:
Hogwash. Ask Gary Hart to explain it to you.
Who’s Gary Hart?
I still think there will be secondary to his charges that resulted in a record so at mo I’ll stand by what I said
Proven wrong then yes I’ll stand corrected
Isnt he the fella who plunged his land rover off a road onto a railway line because he fell asleep at the wheel after he was up all night on chat rooms.
nurburg340:
To answer the question of why I didn’t attend, I have never been in trouble with the police before or gone to court. The thought of going scared me so much I was willing to take a more severe punishment (longer ban or bigger fine), stupid I know.
I did present myself very well in court the second time and as stated I have never been in trouble with the police, I started my own successful business at 18 (speeding happened when I was 19) and explained to them the speeding was a moment of stupidness and explained my reasons for not attending court.
Nothing was mentioned of a criminal record and nothing was mentioned of me not attending court.
So what your saying Roymondo is that if I were doing 99mph and received a fixed penalty I wouldn’t of become a “criminal” but because I was doing 107mph that warrants me being a registered criminal and therefore find it harder to find work in the future… All for a speeding offence? Doesn’t that seem a bit ridiculous as surely then everyone who speeds “should” be a criminal due to it being against the law?
The question asked was whether or not you had a criminal record (with a sub-text about how you should answer conviction questions on job applications), not whether you were a criminal. By the literal meaning of the word, anyone who breaks the law is indeed a criminal - but the question asked on job applications etc is not “Have you ever committed a crime?” - rather it is “Have you ever been convicted of any criminal offence?” (or similar words). A Fixed Penalty is not a conviction (there is no admission of guilt), even if it is issued in respect of e.g. an offence of Theft. As it’s not a conviction, it doesn’t need to be disclosed when answering a question about them. If it’s dealt with by a court hearing then yes, it is a conviction and has to be disclosed as such. Yes, it’s crap, but those are the rules…
The discussion as to whether speeding (or any other traffic offence) should be classed as a crime is a whole new can of worms - but in all honesty, which has the greatest potential to cause harm; Speeding at 100mph+ or nicking a Mars bar from Tesco’s?
I would still say that you do not have a criminal conviction. Traffic matter seems to be dealt with in a different way. Some aspects have a criminal aspect and some don’t… I had a full criminal records check and my three points where I had to attend court due to not receiving paper work never showed up
Worth just popping down to the local main cop shop with your I’d and having a chat with a duty sgt or down to the local magistrates court and having a quick chat with the clerk of the court…
So stop beating yourself up about it and go and ask a few simple questions… The courts and the police can be very helpful if you talk to the right people