weeto:
The only people to blame for crap pay and conditions in this industry is us as drivers.
Yes. It was us that pulled the rug by opening the country up to cheap labour every time wages got a bit nearer what people should be paid, in every manual industry you can think of. We asked for less money and more hours, we asked for more regulation and less freedom, we asked to pay to park or sleep badly in a layby.
This blame the driver culture has really taken off hasn’t it.
Who else is to blame? 13 years ago is the last time us as drivers could have made a very big difference for this industry, since then all we have is drivers moaning about how bad things are.
Most of the stuff you’ve posted is only recently been let to happen, it could have been stopped in its tracks if drivers stuck together!
Pat Hasler:
What happened over there ?
When I left it was law that every employee, no matter what job he or she had must get overtime after 8 jours each day, not 40 hours per week, it was based on per day, if you only worked one day per week and did 12 hours you got 4 of them at overtime rate.
You must have all gone soft.
If an agency doesn’t pay it, don’t work overtime for them, they will soon give in and pay it if you refuse to work over 40 hours.
Cannot believe that no overtime is payable any more - found this info after searching
Overtime pay
Employers don’t have to pay workers for overtime. However, employees’ average pay for the total hours worked mustn’t fall below the National Minimum Wage. gov.uk/overtime-your-rights/overview
You could even argue that “not changing jobs” and thereby adding liquidity to the driver’s labour market didn’t help either.
“Not going to take that job elsewhere? You must be too happy here then, or at least too insecure to get off your arse and move. Let’s cut your T&C’s.” :twisted:
One’s best bet these days is a right-through rate, which will be premium at night or at weekends.
It has it’s compensations when one does the occasional stupid O’clock start sunday night as well.
Pat Hasler:
What happened over there ?
When I left it was law that every employee, no matter what job he or she had must get overtime after 8 jours each day, not 40 hours per week, it was based on per day, if you only worked one day per week and did 12 hours you got 4 of them at overtime rate.
You must have all gone soft.
If an agency doesn’t pay it, don’t work overtime for them, they will soon give in and pay it if you refuse to work over 40 hours.
I don’t no about any law on paying overtime but with regards to agencies and drivers standing up to them they never will. The government brought the AWR in to give agency staff the same rights as regular staff in the hope that companies would take them on but what happened the agencies brought in a contract to work for them on less money and drivers like lambs to the slaughter all signed sometimes for zero hours.
Pat Hasler:
What happened over there ?
When I left it was law that every employee, no matter what job he or she had must get overtime after 8 jours each day, not 40 hours per week, it was based on per day, if you only worked one day per week and did 12 hours you got 4 of them at overtime rate.
You must have all gone soft.
If an agency doesn’t pay it, don’t work overtime for them, they will soon give in and pay it if you refuse to work over 40 hours.
I don’t no about any law on paying overtime but with regards to agencies and drivers standing up to them they never will. The government brought the AWR in to give agency staff the same rights as regular staff in the hope that companies would take them on but what happened the agencies brought in a contract to work for them on less money and drivers like lambs to the slaughter all signed sometimes for zero hours.
AWR didn’t help out at all. If an employer decides they don’t want to honour it (and many don’t!) then they’ll just inform their supplying agency that none of their bods will get a look in unless they sign a AWR opt-out, meaning you get no rights at all, and a zero hour contract if you’re not on one already.
weeto:
The only people to blame for crap pay and conditions in this industry is us as drivers.
Well said mate, and it still continues today, some can’t see as far as their nose ends however much you try and point things out to them , you know the ones… those that as long as they are seen to be driving a Megaspacesupergiggatoplineglobetrottinghiliner with Kelsas hellas and illuminated cab board, it doesnt matter to them if they get paid next to [zb] all for driving it for 90 hours a fortnight, not just that but it spoils the chances of the more serious drivers getting a pay rise as employers love these guys… and laugh their knobs off at them at the same time
As much as I have enjoyed driving similar spec motors in the past (ok maybe not with the illuminated name board ) I have been lucky enough to drive them on a decent wage, my priority has always been cash rather than flash.
Pat Hasler:
What happened over there ?
When I left it was law that every employee, no matter what job he or she had must get overtime after 8 jours each day, not 40 hours per week, it was based on per day, if you only worked one day per week and did 12 hours you got 4 of them at overtime rate.
You must have all gone soft.
If an agency doesn’t pay it, don’t work overtime for them, they will soon give in and pay it if you refuse to work over 40 hours.
I don’t no about any law on paying overtime but with regards to agencies and drivers standing up to them they never will. The government brought the AWR in to give agency staff the same rights as regular staff in the hope that companies would take them on but what happened the agencies brought in a contract to work for them on less money and drivers like lambs to the slaughter all signed sometimes for zero hours.
AWR didn’t help out at all. If an employer decides they don’t want to honour it (and many don’t!) then they’ll just inform their supplying agency that none of their bods will get a look in unless they sign a AWR opt-out, meaning you get no rights at all, and a zero hour contract if you’re not on one already.
That’s just what I mean but if all agency staff had refused to sign any opt out contract how many days would they last with no staff. I know that one of the agencies I am with charge 39% so for each £10 I earn they get £3.90, we may have got to a point where agencies may have paid more just to keep contracts but it never happened because they told drivers how much better off they will be working for less on a zero hour contract.
Pat Hasler:
What happened over there ?
When I left it was law that every employee, no matter what job he or she had must get overtime after 8 jours each day, not 40 hours per week, it was based on per day, if you only worked one day per week and did 12 hours you got 4 of them at overtime rate.
You must have all gone soft.
If an agency doesn’t pay it, don’t work overtime for them, they will soon give in and pay it if you refuse to work over 40 hours.
weeto:
The only people to blame for crap pay and conditions in this industry is us as drivers.
Yes. It was us that pulled the rug by opening the country up to cheap labour every time wages got a bit nearer what people should be paid, in every manual industry you can think of. We asked for less money and more hours, we asked for more regulation and less freedom, we asked to pay to park or sleep badly in a layby.
This blame the driver culture has really taken off hasn’t it.
Who else is to blame? 13 years ago is the last time us as drivers could have made a very big difference for this industry, since then all we have is drivers moaning about how bad things are.
Most of the stuff you’ve posted is only recently been let to happen, it could have been stopped in its tracks if drivers stuck together!
Really? So canals were only built recently, civil engineering started recently, textile mills are recent, two world wars happened recently, inviting people from foreign countries is a recent phenomenon is it? It’s very simple, lots of people looking for jobs forces wages down. You let more people into a country - everybody gets paid less and bickers amongst themselves, whilst those in power carry on doing what they like.
I’d like to know how drivers could have stopped the New Labour propoganda machine, I remember it well. Anybody who questioned anything was instantly labelled a bigot, so nobody dared say anything. That’s how they got away with it for so long.
When I left it was law that every employee, no matter what job he or she had must get overtime after 8 jours each day, not 40 hours per week, it was based on per day, if you only worked one day per week and did 12 hours you got 4 of them at overtime rate.
It used to be the usual thing but I don’t think it was ever a law.
But it was also usual for the overtime to be based on working 40 hours first, then 1.5 on hours after that, or Saturday etc.
Maybe different at where you worked Pat but I guess that was down to T and C’s rather than laws.
The claim that drivers are responsible for their own present situation is true in some respects, in that they have never stuck together and fought as a single unit, but the current situation has moved far beyond being able to deal with it by militant actions.
A general strike, for example, wouuld simply mean that the ferries etc from the EU would be chock a block with foreigners being imported to do the jobs.
The only short term hope for drivers is that the DPC causes a shortage of drivers, which may push up rates for a while, as happened when the HGV was introduced, but then it will fall again , as happened after the HGV was introduced and things settled down.
, you know the ones… those that as long as they are seen to be driving a Megaspacesupergiggatoplineglobetrottinghiliner with Kelsas hellas and illuminated cab board, it doesnt matter to them if they get paid next to [zb] all for driving it for 90 hours a fortnight, not just that but it spoils the chances of the more serious drivers getting a pay rise as employers love these guys… and laugh their knobs off at them at the same time 