joedwyer1:
ive spoken to the agency and its like he can’t hear me say the bit in the book where it clearly states if a driver starts at 0600 on day one BY 0600 on day two he must have COMPLETED either an 11, 9 or split rest. he seems to think that i can just stick it on poa when i get there and drive back leaving at about 8 to return for about 10. he seems to think that all it means is i can’t start work ( if i got work) until 07.00 or so on friday
Agencies like this shouldn’t be encouraged to send drivers out without bothering to check if the runs are legal but times are hard and you probably want the work, so second best option would be to remove the chart/card when you’ve finished working in the morning then have your rest of 9 or 11 hours and put a new chart/card in when you re-start work in the evening
It’s not for us to tell you what you should do but in my opinion under no circumstances should you go onto public roads without a chart/card in the tachograph, and you should be aware that if you move the vehicle whilst on a daily rest period even if you don’t go onto public roads you will be contravening the regulations and as Coffeeholic said it’s you who will be held responsible, so really it’s your call.
I suggest that you give these links to your agency person and ask them to study the regulations
Not that they’re likely to take any notice but it’s worth a try
joedwyer1:
it drives me mad. they have the cheek to give you a tacho test when you sign up! to which they clearly don’t have all the correct answers
Or do they ?
OH! I nearly forgot the first best option … it involve an agency consultant a copy of the regulations and a red hot poker, Ill leave the rest to your imagination
Wheel Nut:
What he is saying is, If you start at 05.30 on Thursday, than by Friday at 05.30 you have only taken 7.30 hours rest regardless of you having Friday off or any other day as far as that goes.
I was thinking about it last week. I work tue to sat, sun and mon off. I worked nearly 15 hrs on sat and started wondering if I could work longer. But now I understand I couldn’t. I started on sat at 0530 and finished 2030. So by sunday 0530 I need to have completed 9 hrs of daily rest and then after 36hrs I can start the next week.
so it doesnt matter if the next brake is a daily rest or a weekly rest I need to have at least 9hrs of reduced daily rest in a 24 hrs period.
Can someone tell me something about breaks that don’t count towards duty? I know nothing about it
Wheel Nut:
What he is saying is, If you start at 05.30 on Thursday, than by Friday at 05.30 you have only taken 7.30 hours rest regardless of you having Friday off or any other day as far as that goes.
I was thinking about it last week. I work tue to sat, sun and mon off. I worked nearly 15 hrs on sat and started wondering if I could work longer. But now I understand I couldn’t. I started on sat at 0530 and finished 2030. So by sunday 0530 I need to have completed 9 hrs of daily rest and then after 36hrs I can start the next week.
Forget 36 hours, it is now 45 that may be reduced to 24, that changed with the 2007 regulations. The EU rules (Regulation (EC) 561/2006)
The fixed week starts at 00.00 on Monday and ends at 24.00 on the following Sunday.
so it doesnt matter if the next brake is a daily rest or a weekly rest I need to have at least 9hrs of reduced daily rest in a 24 hrs period. Absolutely spot on.
Can someone tell me something about breaks that don’t count towards duty? I know nothing about it
Breaks are breaks, rest periods are different. Breaks do not count for anything else except to separate 4.5hr driving periods, but in any period of 24 hours you need to have taken 11 hours rest (you may reduce these to 9 hours three times between two weekly rest periods)
Wheel Nut:
Breaks do not count for anything else except to separate 4.5hr driving periods
And for the RTD(WTD)
Cheers Rog.
Without confusing myself anymore. I read my last post and will simplify it here.
If you start work at 6am you must stop work at 7pm regardless of how many cups of tea you have drunk during that day. Within that fixed week between 00.00 on Monday and 23.59 on the following Sunday you could have worked until 9pm 3 times only.
There are only 24 hours in a day, every day. So if you have a 9 hour rest period it means you were on duty for 15 hours. If you have an 11 hour rest period it means you were on duty for 13 hours. You can have POA, 7 hour tea breaks, 40 winks or go for a cycle ride within that 15 hours, but whether you are paid or not, you are still on duty.
If you do manage a 7 hour tea break or even a 3 hour one, then you can reduce your rest period to 9 hours even though you have reduced 3 times already in your fixed week.
Wheel Nut:
There are only 24 hours in a day, every day. So if you have a 9 hour rest period it means you were on duty for 15 hours. If you have an 11 hour rest period it means you were on duty for 13 hours. You can have POA, 7 hour tea breaks, 40 winks or go for a cycle ride within that 15 hours, but whether you are paid or not, you are still on duty.
It really is that simple.
It really is but for some reason it seems hard for people to grasp it.
wake up go to work [2300] [24 hours] Go Home [1200]= 13hours
wake up go to work [0000] [24 hours] Go Home [1300]= 13hours
wake up go to work [0100] [24 hours] Go Home [1400]= 13hours
wake up go to work [0200] [24 hours] Go Home [1500]= 13hours
wake up go to work [0300] [24 hours] Go Home [1600]= 13hours
wake up go to work [0400] [24 hours] Go Home [1700]= 13hours
wake up go to work [0500] [24 hours] Go Home [1800]= 13hours
wake up go to work [0600] [24 hours] Go Home [1900]= 13hours
wake up go to work [0700] [24 hours] Go Home [2000]= 13hours
wake up go to work [0800] [24 hours] Go Home [2100]= 13hours
wake up go to work [0900] [24 hours] Go Home [2200]= 13hours
wake up go to work [1000] [24 hours] Go Home [2300]= 13hours
So if you start work at 11.23 you just need to add 13.00 to give you your finish time of 00.23
If you do go past 13 hours by even one minute, then you have used one reduction out of three available.
In the same way as 09.01 driving counts as one of two available extensions. but only counts as 9.01 from your weekly driving limit of 56 or fortnightly limit of 90
Simon_1982:
Can someone tell me something about breaks that don’t count towards duty? I know nothing about it
All breaks count as duty time, there is no such thing as a break which doesn’t count as duty time.
ROG:
No break, rest or POA counts as daily duty (working time) for the regulations
I’ve said conflicting things in the same sentance - haven’t I
Whether it was conflicting or not depends on what you were trying to say, I just assumed it was your regular misunderstanding of the regulations and the terms used.
wake up go to work [2300] [24 hours] Go Home [1200]= 13hours
wake up go to work [0000] [24 hours] Go Home [1300]= 13hours
wake up go to work [0100] [24 hours] Go Home [1400]= 13hours
wake up go to work [0200] [24 hours] Go Home [1500]= 13hours
wake up go to work [0300] [24 hours] Go Home [1600]= 13hours
wake up go to work [0400] [24 hours] Go Home [1700]= 13hours
wake up go to work [0500] [24 hours] Go Home [1800]= 13hours
wake up go to work [0600] [24 hours] Go Home [1900]= 13hours
wake up go to work [0700] [24 hours] Go Home [2000]= 13hours
wake up go to work [0800] [24 hours] Go Home [2100]= 13hours
wake up go to work [0900] [24 hours] Go Home [2200]= 13hours
wake up go to work [1000] [24 hours] Go Home [2300]= 13hours
If that lot is on consecutive days then it could be a bit illegal
wake up go to work [2300] [24 hours] Go Home [1200]= 13hours
wake up go to work [0000] [24 hours] Go Home [1300]= 13hours
wake up go to work [0100] [24 hours] Go Home [1400]= 13hours
wake up go to work [0200] [24 hours] Go Home [1500]= 13hours
wake up go to work [0300] [24 hours] Go Home [1600]= 13hours
wake up go to work [0400] [24 hours] Go Home [1700]= 13hours Have a a couple of days off, ideally 45 hours, drive to Leicester and punch Rog’s lights out, in the family car of course as the lorry would mean you were still on duty. Even if it was private use
wake up go to work [0500] [24 hours] Go Home [1800]= 13hours
wake up go to work [0600] [24 hours] Go Home [1900]= 13hours
wake up go to work [0700] [24 hours] Go Home [2000]= 13hours
wake up go to work [0800] [24 hours] Go Home [2100]= 13hours
wake up go to work [0900] [24 hours] Go Home [2200]= 13hours
wake up go to work [1000] [24 hours] Go Home [2300]= 13hours
If that lot is on consecutive days then it could be a bit illegal
Wheel Nut:
Have a a couple of days off, ideally 45 hours, drive to Leicester and punch Rog’s lights out, in the family car of course as the lorry would mean you were still on duty. Even if it was private use
i think i will ignore the agency bloke. do what is legal, what I know is right. perhaps leave a bit later in the morning so that i spend less time hanging around at the nec . have a 9 hour rest during the day tomorrow or what ever it takes. yes i do need the work but there are other agencies that want me for work. its not worth the worry. many thanks for all your replies.
Simon_1982:
Can someone tell me something about breaks that don’t count towards duty? I know nothing about it
Coffeeholic:
All breaks count as duty time, there is no such thing as a break which doesn’t count as duty time.
ROG:
No break, rest or POA counts as daily duty (working time) for the regulations
ROG:
I’ve said conflicting things in the same sentance - haven’t I
Coffeeholic:
Whether it was conflicting or not depends on what you were trying to say, I just assumed it was your regular misunderstanding of the regulations and the terms used.
I am not the only one…
Wheel Nut:
(you may reduce these to 9 hours three times in a fixed week)
Simon_1982:
Cheers guys, I need to read it a few times to understand.
If you mean you need to read this thread a few times to understand it then let me summarise it for you.
joedwyer1 asked a question so a few of us answered, ROG posted something or other so Coffeeholic told him that he’s misunderstanding the regs as usual, but ROG continued to post so Wheel Nut threatened to go to Leicester and punch his lights out
