limeyphil:
‘…So, when do you think the war will start…?’
Is Harry Hill running it?
Is my Bulldog vs. the preening, ■■■■-sniffing, barren, skint, poncy & dysfunctional, cabbage scoffing, in-bred poodle OK as a prelude 
kr79:
I agree with you Carryfast in respect of what the UK joined in 1973 is a total different thing to what it is now and given the choice today I think most peoe would be pro having trade agreements etc but not pro what we have now.
Europe isn’t the USA we as nations are very different and the argument that the new eu nations economy
will get up to speed with the more established economy is a joke as we are now seeing the traditionally
more poor nations of the established eu the PIGS have come unstick closely followed by Italy. T
hen when the economy picks up and it looks like the east is
booming the eu will let Turkey join for more cheap labour.
General de Gaulle, president of the French Republic, states that France
doubts the political will of the United Kingdom to join the Community.
A few days later, negotiations with all applicant countries are suspended.
He said this in 1963, the same year that Turkey was admitted to a customs union with the EEC
In 1967 Britain applied again to join and was again turned down by France and De Gaulle, it took until 1973 for the UK to be accepted.
Turkey has the 15th largest GDP in the World lying closely behind Spain, Italy and France.
It trails the UK who are currently in 7th place and Germany 5th (Top) Within the top 30 there is only Poland at 20th and Belgium just sneaking in at number 30
I think you are being misled when you think Turkey will be a source of cheap labour,
it will probably become a paradise for builders, plumbers and lorry drivers like Holland and Germany did in the Auf Weidersehn days
Carryfast:
limeyphil:
So, when do you think the war will start?I’ve sent orys a note explaining that unless Poland and all the other parasites in Europe are prepared to hand back all of the subsidies they’ve so far received from the EU funds that we’ve been mug enough to give them and all east european immigrant labour here had gone home by 11.00 this morning this country would be at war with Europe.I can tell you now that no such undertaking has been received so consequently this country is now at war with Poland.
And Germany And France.
we will fight them on the beaches.
when the weather gets better.
Cameron was right not to sign up to this latest treaty. There seems to be some confusion among some people of the difference between the EU (which we used to call the Common Market) which we are a member of, and the Euro (the singe currency which we do not use, thank goodness).
The Euro using Zone will in the next month or so break up with Greece leading the way. This treaty did nothing to address the problems the singe currency faces, so Cameron quite rightly allowed them to sort their own problems out.
Over the years we have given too much to Europe and as it happens other European countries are now having their doubts about this Franco - German cop out.
Wheel Nut:
kr79:
I agree with you Carryfast in respect of what the UK joined in 1973 is a total different thing to what it is now and given the choice today I think most peoe would be pro having trade agreements etc but not pro what we have now.
Europe isn’t the USA we as nations are very different and the argument that the new eu nations economy
will get up to speed with the more established economy is a joke as we are now seeing the traditionally
more poor nations of the established eu the PIGS have come unstick closely followed by Italy. T
hen when the economy picks up and it looks like the east is
booming the eu will let Turkey join for more cheap labour.General de Gaulle, president of the French Republic, states that France
doubts the political will of the United Kingdom to join the Community.
A few days later, negotiations with all applicant countries are suspended.
He said this in 1963, the same year that Turkey was admitted to a customs union with the EECIn 1967 Britain applied again to join and was again turned down by France and De Gaulle, it took until 1973 for the UK to be accepted.
Turkey has the 15th largest GDP in the World lying closely behind Spain, Italy and France.
It trails the UK who are currently in 7th place and Germany 5th (Top) Within the top 30 there is only Poland at 20th and Belgium just sneaking in at number 30I think you are being misled when you think Turkey will be a source of cheap labour,
it will probably become a paradise for builders, plumbers and lorry drivers like Holland and Germany did in the Auf Weidersehn days
China probably has a bigger GDP than Turkey but I don’t think there’s any unemployed geordies bothering to go over there to help them out with a bit of plumbing and lorry driving work .But it would be interesting to see what what would happen if China joins the EU and then they all go looking for a job in Germany. 
Smee:
Cameron was right not to sign up to this latest treaty. There seems to be some confusion among some people of the difference between the EU (which we used to call the Common Market) which we are a member of, and the Euro (the singe currency which we do not use, thank goodness).
The Euro using Zone will in the next month or so break up with Greece leading the way. This treaty did nothing to address the problems the singe currency faces, so Cameron quite rightly allowed them to sort their own problems out.
Over the years we have given too much to Europe and as it happens other European countries are now having their doubts about this Franco - German cop out.
limeyphil:
Carryfast:
limeyphil:
So, when do you think the war will start?I’ve sent orys a note explaining that unless Poland and all the other parasites in Europe are prepared to hand back all of the subsidies they’ve so far received from the EU funds that we’ve been mug enough to give them and all east european immigrant labour here had gone home by 11.00 this morning this country would be at war with Europe.I can tell you now that no such undertaking has been received so consequently this country is now at war with Poland.
And Germany And France.we will fight them on the beaches.
when the weather gets better.
Having carried out further talks with our German allies and trading partners we’ve now come to the conclusion that it’s probably all Belgium’s fault aided by their treacherous allies the French and the Poles.So the Germans are going to sort the Poles out and we’re going to get the Belgians and the French.
Carryfast:
China probably has a bigger GDP than Turkey but I don’t think there’s any unemployed geordies bothering to go over there to help them out with a bit of plumbing and lorry driving work .But it would be interesting to see what what would happen if China joins the EU and then they all go looking for a job in Germany.
Do you actually own a map?
Wheel Nut:
Carryfast:
China probably has a bigger GDP than Turkey but I don’t think there’s any unemployed geordies bothering to go over there to help them out with a bit of plumbing and lorry driving work .But it would be interesting to see what what would happen if China joins the EU and then they all go looking for a job in Germany.Do you actually own a map?
Yes last time I looked at it most of Turkey was on the same continent as China not Europe. 
But maybe all that changed when Yugoslavia moved further away from the borders of the old Soviet Union than East Germany was.
Breaking news: Polish fifth column has taken over major British cities. They rarely met any resistance from Britons: most of them refused to fight. They said “I won’t raise my bum from bed for that money” and “if this is all you going to pay me, ask the flip flop brigade to fight for you”. So this is what the British goverment did, asked Eastern Europeans to drive their tanks and fly their planes. They were met with overhelmingly positive response - most of the British military posts are now staffed by citizens of the former Eastern Bloc countries.
The goverment is very surprised. Cameron has called a special meeting to try to find the solution to that situation. At the same time Britons sit in their pubs and moan “Bloody Eastern Europeans has stolen our Army!”
On the more serious note:
Carryfast:
Yes last time I looked at it most of Turkey was on the same continent as China not Europe.But maybe all that changed when Yugoslavia moved further away from the borders of the old Soviet Union than East Germany was.
To admit that you were wrong is beyond your abilities I see?
Carryfast:
orys:
you see only things you want see so for you EU is only about Britons paying money to other countries…Maybe you could identify exactly what they are based on our contributions to and our trade deficit with the EU.That’s even before taking into account other issues like fishing quotas and allowance of foreign fishing in British sea areas and the inability to impose quotas on EU imports and road transport service provision etc etc etc.
So you cannot give a one single example of the profits you get from the membership? There was no simplified trade between the EU countries? It’s Britain the only country who has to let other fish in their waters, and no other country opened their waters for Britain? The fact that, for example, most of Polish fishing fleet was scrapped as it was too big competition for elder EU countries is nothing I guess?
Carryfast:
But how much of the problem in Greece,Italy and here has actually been caused by EU money,that should have been kept in the bank,for a rainy day in western europe,being given to eastern europe to grow their economies from a broken ex eastern bloc heap,to the point they are now compared to places like Portugal and Greece etc which are going backwards with us not far behind.
I like that you are dragging Eastern Europe to everything and blame it for everything. What about EU admitting Greece to the Euro zone when it wasn’t ready and ignoring the obvious facts of them making a creative bookkeeping? Many EU countries were admitted to EU while they were much less prepared than EE countries were in 2004. The problem is that you have expectations to be fullfilled from the new members, but you do not have the same standards when it comes to the older members.
Please note that it is not Eastern Europe who is dragging the whole EU down, and it is not Eastern Europe where the crisis has started.
Happy Keith:
And these ‘…benefits…’ are what? ‘They’ (whatever ‘they’ are) are surely not so sacred that they
cannot be courteously learned from and honed to suit the UK a bit better.
Well, if there are totally no benefits for you and never were, you must be a nation of idiots to join the EU and stay in it for so long, since is so easy to learn from that obvious mistake… Carryfast is having laugh at Poles who did not managed to break up with the Soviet Union - how is that so mighty country like Britain cannot break with the EU parasite while is not kept there by force by anyone?
Carryfast wrote
“China probably has a bigger GDP than Turkey but I don’t think there’s any unemployed geordies bothering to go over there to help them out with a bit of plumbing and lorry driving work .But it would be interesting to see what what would happen if China joins the EU and then they all go looking for a job in Germany.”
Not quite true, my brother in law - a geordie - moved to China over 10 years ago. There is a European expat colony running much of Chinese production.
He is now a director of a huge company, got dual nationality, and married a chinese girl.
He designs and develops new equipment, which he gets made in UK, shipped in parts through different routes into China to prevent wholesale copying, before installing in plants in China.
Smee - useful note reminding us all that this in not a European issue but a Euro issue. Europe may be affected, but different countries have different interests and more or less to lose.
I think the UK has less to lose - but it is still a lot - time will tell!
orys:
Happy Keith:
And these ‘…benefits…’ are what? ‘They’ (whatever ‘they’ are) are surely not so sacred that they cannot be courteously learned from and honed to suit the UK a bit better.‘…Well, if there are totally no benefits for you and never were, you must be a nation of idiots to join the EU and stay in it for so long…’
I didn’t say ‘…totally no benefits…’ - but I am asking what there is in the whole EU farce that is so sacred that we cannot, given that we’re consistently & expensively being mugged-off, walk away from to emulate the success that the Norges & the Swiss enjoy?
Meanwhile, the BBC ought to be more accurately considered as the EU BC
Interestingly the song “Final Countdown” was by a group called Europe!!!
mi13ke:
Carryfast wrote
“China probably has a bigger GDP than Turkey but I don’t think there’s any unemployed geordies bothering to go over there to help them out with a bit of plumbing and lorry driving work .But it would be interesting to see what what would happen if China joins the EU and then they all go looking for a job in Germany.”Not quite true, my brother in law - a geordie - moved to China over 10 years ago. There is a European expat colony running much of Chinese production.
He is now a director of a huge company, got dual nationality, and married a chinese girl.
He designs and develops new equipment, which he gets made in UK, shipped in parts through different routes into China to prevent wholesale copying, before installing in plants in China.
The Chinese are obviously importing production technology that they can’t produce for themselves and it’s probably turning out products which the Chinese can then export back to us.
So what happens to that ex pat community when the Chinese have all the technology they need in place and then just copy for themselves what they’ve got when it needs renewing or just use that technology to produce the same thing over there to undercut the original suppliers in the market place and you can bet that the only reason why that expat community is being paid a worthwhile wage not a Chinese type one is because,at the moment,the Chinese need their services and it’s being paid by us,with the money they get for their exports,anyway.
I think your reference,to needing to ship the stuff in,through different routes,to stop wholesale copying,and just a quick check of the trade deficit between us and China,let alone the fact that everything they export to us we could be making for ourselves anyway,thereby keeping the money in our own econonomy,instead of effectively giving it away to them,for stuff we don’t need them to produce for us,says everything about the ‘global free market’ economy.
But it would be interesting to find out what a British ex pat lorry driver or plumber would be able to earn over there.
orys:
Well, if there are totally no benefits for you and never were, you must be a nation of idiots to join the EU and stay in it for so long, since is so easy to learn from that obvious mistake… Carryfast is having laugh at Poles who did not managed to break up with the Soviet Union - how is that so mighty country like Britain cannot break with the EU parasite while is not kept there by force by anyone?
Now you’re talking a bit of sense.
But I wasn’t laughing at the Poles for not breaking up with the Soviet Union I was just asking the question as to how it was that Yugoslavia not only told them to zb off but also seemed to get more Russian oil supplied to them than Poland did,for doing it.
But the question is that why is it that the Poles and Yugoslavs and all the rest were so keen to get control of their own seperate nation states back from Russian rule (and then Serb rule in the case of the old Yugoslavia) but that they are all now so keen to enter into another even closer tied Federation within the EU .
Happy Keith:
orys:
Happy Keith:
And these ‘…benefits…’ are what? ‘They’ (whatever ‘they’ are) are surely not so sacred that they cannot be courteously learned from and honed to suit the UK a bit better.‘…Well, if there are totally no benefits for you and never were, you must be a nation of idiots to join the EU and stay in it for so long…’
I didn’t say '…totally no benefits…
I did.
If all this was not so serious it would be funny… 
limeyphil:
Will David camions refusal to sign the latest EU treaty have any effect, positive or negative on the UK haulage industry?
What do you think was the reason he didn’t sign?
I think it is because a law was past not so long ago, which will force the government to have a referendum on EU membership if we give up any more powers to Brussels. As the government knows the British voters will vote us out of the EU. So that’s the real reason.
telegraph.co.uk/comment/colu … r-was.html
Happy Keith:
I didn’t say ‘…totally no benefits…’ - but I am asking what there is in the whole EU farce that is so sacred that we cannot, given that we’re consistently & expensively being mugged-off, walk away from to emulate the success that the Norges & the Swiss enjoy?
Well, I would guess that there has to be something in it which keeps you in, so that’s why I suppose you are having some benefits from the membership at all. After all, I am just pulling your finger, I don’t think you are nation of idiots
Carryfast:
orys:
Well, if there are totally no benefits for you and never were, you must be a nation of idiots to join the EU and stay in it for so long, since is so easy to learn from that obvious mistake… Carryfast is having laugh at Poles who did not managed to break up with the Soviet Union - how is that so mighty country like Britain cannot break with the EU parasite while is not kept there by force by anyone?Now you’re talking a bit of sense.
The problem is, I was sarcastic 
But I wasn’t laughing at the Poles for not breaking up with the Soviet Union I was just asking the question as to how it was that Yugoslavia not only told them to zb off but also seemed to get more Russian oil supplied to them than Poland did,for doing it.
I provided you with explanation, but you are not happy with it. I am sorry, I can’t help you more on it
But the question is that why is it that the Poles and Yugoslavs and all the rest were so keen to get control of their own seperate nation states back from Russian rule (and then Serb rule in the case of the old Yugoslavia) but that they are all now so keen to enter into another even closer tied Federation within the EU
I think your problem here is that in your view European Union is not much different from the Soviet Hegemony. The truth is that even if EU is as bad as you try to picture, it is still light years better than being under Soviet occupation.
orys:
Carryfast:
orys:
Well, if there are totally no benefits for you and never were, you must be a nation of idiots to join the EU and stay in it for so long, since is so easy to learn from that obvious mistake… Carryfast is having laugh at Poles who did not managed to break up with the Soviet Union - how is that so mighty country like Britain cannot break with the EU parasite while is not kept there by force by anyone?Now you’re talking a bit of sense.
The problem is, I was sarcastic
But the question is that why is it that the Poles and Yugoslavs and all the rest were so keen to get control of their own seperate nation states back from Russian rule (and then Serb rule in the case of the old Yugoslavia) but that they are all now so keen to enter into another even closer tied Federation within the EU
I think your problem here is that in your view European Union is not much different from the Soviet Hegemony. The truth is that even if EU is as bad as you try to picture, it is still light years better than being under Soviet occupation.
I know you was being sarcastic so was I.
I also know that being a member state of the EU isn’t exactly the same thing as being one of the ex soviet eastern bloc countries (so far).However that still doesn’t explain why it was that those states were all so keen to put on a big show of wanting to be totally independent self governing sovereign states to the world before the Russians pulled out of those places but now seem keen enough to want to enter into a Federal United States of Europe.
In addition to that the ex Yugoslav Federation never was under Soviet ‘occupation’ but it still broke up into it’s seperate constituent states after those States called for total sovereign status and then had a civil war to do it supported by NATO and the EU to do so.So why the double standards from all concerned in that case in that that the ex Yugoslav States did not want to be all together in a Yugoslav Federation but they all seem happy enough now to want to all be together in a European one .I think the difference is that they see money in it from the subsidies provided by the net contributors to the EU like Germany and Britain which wasn’t available under a Federation of their own like the old Yugoslavia.
My theory,as to why the East European states seem happy enough to be all together in a Federation within the EU,but not outside of it,is because they are just a bunch of parasites who want to take the developed western economies for what they can get.
Assuming that if the developed western economies,starting with Britain,were to no longer remain members,then it’s my bet that there’s no way that the East European states would all want to live happily in a federation made up of just themselves,because they are just in it so long as the wealth from the ‘richer’ states like Britain and Germany keeps going their way.