Just read in the RHA magazine that a Scots firm have been presented with a tax bill by HMR&C for £ 50,000 because they were paying tax-free nightout allowance when drivers were on a ferry with bunk and meal provided - how desparate are they to grub more money from this, or any other, industry?
I always thought that night out money was for just the inconvenience of being away from home
Bet the lawyers are having fun with this one 
ROG:
I always thought that night out money was for just the inconvenience of being away from homeBet the lawyers are having fun with this one
Night out or subsistence money is to provide a breakfast, evening meal, bed and enough for supply & laundering of bedding if my terminology is correct.
Every company I have worked for have either paid less on the ferry or not at all. Continental rates can be more than the agreed rate in the tax area.
hmrc.gov.uk/manuals/eimanual/EIM66130.htm
Read that, and more links within it 
I was more interested in this one though, don’t tell Diesel Dave.
PIE allowance is payable as a flat rate. - The rate is intended to cover personal incidental expenses such as newspapers, laundry and private telephone calls…
On most ferries nowadays the driver has to pay for meals albeit discounted.
Must be a BIG Haulier for that amount of TAX…didn’t think we had any left up here, or elsewhere in the UK.
Why is this unfair? Nobody likes paying tax, but without it everything would grind to a halt…no fire service, health service, armed forces, refuse collection, police etc etc.
Certain expenses incurred in the course of work are allowed to be paid without being taxable. For obvious reasons, these expenses have to be genuinely incurred in the course of work, and must be realistic in covering the expenses incurred. They cannot be used to provide extra untaxed income or to top up wages/salary (wasn’t there a scandal about that recently in…umm…oh yes, Westminster?). Such payments are not allowed tax free for ‘inconvenience’ but to cover actual expenses incurred.
You might think it unfair that night out money paid when no expenses had to be incurred (because the bed/meal was already paid for) should be reclaimed, but you must see that there have to be some rules. Otherwise we could all be paid our entire salary as ‘expenses/dayout/nightout money’ with no tax. Fine, you might think. Probably you wouldn’t think the same if it was an MP having a moat cleaned ‘on expenses’ or boosting their salary by ‘flipping’ homes to get mortgages paid; or a City banker having a Porsche as a company car with no tax liability or being paid a £100,000 salary plus £10m bonus as tax-free expenses ‘for the inconvenience of working in London away from the family Chateau in the south of France’.
Cheers…M
we use to get a different rate on a overnight crossing than an international night out £27 taxable on boat and £24.25 int night out plus £10 p.i.e.s, and it was monitored so we didn’t try and get the £34.25 on the boat, we were told tax man very keen on this !
All meals for drivers USED TO BE free,on ferries.The flip flop wearers put an end to it by nicking the bread and stuff,filling up un-used sick bags with free food.I could save a fortune by not eating on the way up to Ouistreham.The seafood on Brittany ferries was world class dining,cotton table clothes,waiters in uniform,treated like a human,not some third world scum in a pee ridden lay by with rats for company in the UK.And attitude,of if you dont like it,then shove off somewhere else.Open all day caravans,but shut at 2pm.
spot on toby, shiped out on brittany for many years. top nosh nice staff, the problem now the boats ar full of taliban.
MartinC:
Why is this unfair? Nobody likes paying tax, but without it everything would grind to a halt…no fire service, health service, armed forces, refuse collection, police etc etc.
Uninvited invasions in Iraq and Afghanistan, MPs moats and chandeliers, the Millennium Dome, the 2012 Olympics etc etc.
Harry Monk:
MartinC:
Why is this unfair? Nobody likes paying tax, but without it everything would grind to a halt…no fire service, health service, armed forces, refuse collection, police etc etc.Uninvited invasions in Iraq and Afghanistan, MPs moats and chandeliers, the Millennium Dome, the 2012 Olympics etc etc.
Harry
You forgot the MP’s Expenses…takes more tax for that than probably the Millennium Dome
bedgar047:
Harry
You forgot the MP’s Expenses…takes more tax for that than probably the Millennium Dome
I included that under “MPs moats and chandeliers”
We are going to have to face it, the Government desperately need more tax. They have been frantically trying to delay the pain since 2007 but time has run out.
If they tax my night=out money just because I am on a boat, then I just won’t go on a boat. Simples!
browncow2:
the problem now the boats ar full of taliban.
I’m a bit confused by this, is it something new?
I thought the Taliban was something to do with Afghanistan or something, not Poland or Slovakia?
Wheel Nut:
I was more interested in this one though, don’t tell Diesel Dave.PIE allowance is payable as a flat rate. - The rate is intended to cover personal incidental expenses such as newspapers, laundry and private telephone calls…
Hi Malc, I’ve spotted that. 
When I did Euro work, I always imagined that the PIE rate was a form of compensation owed to me to compensate for the awful quality of European pies and was claimable because I didn’t have my rightful 24/7 access to British-made pies. 
dieseldave:
Wheel Nut:
I was more interested in this one though, don’t tell Diesel Dave.PIE allowance is payable as a flat rate. - The rate is intended to cover personal incidental expenses such as newspapers, laundry and private telephone calls…
Hi Malc, I’ve spotted that.
When I did Euro work, I always imagined that the PIE rate was a form of compensation owed to me to compensate for the awful quality of European pies and was claimable because I didn’t have my rightful 24/7 access to British-made pies.
Dave goes on holiday to Wigan PIEr
Wheel Nut:
Dave goes on holiday to Wigan PIEr
(Groan) PMSL
If you subject much more of that on the sites members,
I’ll have to get you put on pre-moderation.
we now get taxed on our subsistence allowance when we are on an overnight ferry.
it is completely wrong. if you board a ferry at 9.30 and the food is ready at 11.00pm, then does that mean you have to eat it?
the chances are, i would have already eaten. i still need clean clothes, i may have paid for a shower earlier in the day.
it is completely wrong. MP’s now get a tax free subsitence living allowance for each night they spend away from home. one rule for them, one rule for us.
Yes, I don’t incur any less expense because I am on an overnight ferry because I will have eaten during the day. I cannot eat a meal at 11 p.m. so soon before I have to sleep, it would just give me indigestion and a sleepless night. The only difference is that I will be sleeping in a cabin as opposed to in the truck (I would prefer to sleep in the truck if they would let me) and so I can’t really see a case for taxing my money.
Other than that the Government are deep in the doo-doo and desperate…
Harry Monk:
I cannot eat a meal at 11 p.m. so soon before I have to sleep, it would just give me indigestion and a sleepless night.
I used to eat dinner at 2.30am on Travemunde-Trelleborg no problem,then up again at 9am for breakfast.
What did used to put me out of sequence though was eating breakfast at half past midnight on the Hook-Harwich freighter crossing.
When I drove for Van Maanen we didn’t get a night out if it was a night crossing,but if it was a day crossing we’d get paid waiting hours.
Some logic there somewhere I suppose 
We had this problem a couple of years ago after a local firm was paying night out money to supplememt wages even though no nights out were taking place, i.e. tax free income. We had a vist from the Inland Revenue and the only thing they picked up on was paying night out money on the ferry. We then had to tax our staff on their night out allowance. It would probably have gone unnoticed if it hadn’t been for this other companies attempt at avoiding income and empoyer tax.
we get standard rate of £15.00 on ferry night rate day rate meal alce of £8.00 [ferry] uk european nights out £27.50 p/n if 50 miles ref no req tax man wrote to me about this as company work is a frence company i usely out for 6 nights italy thursday back next friday