You can drive on more than six consecutive days, providing you take a weekly rest. I’ve done it several times. Bearing that in mind, you are not limited to just the 4x9 and 2x10 driving periods. Take a weekly rest and you have more 9 hour driving days at your disposal before the end of the fixed tacho week, only nines though not tens as they are limited to two a week.
Start midnight Sunday/Monday and taking the minimum rests and doing the very minimum of other work drive your ten hours. Nine hours daily rest then same again. Nine hours daily rest then a nine hour driving day. Nine hours daily rest then another nine hour driving day. 11 hours rest then nine hours driving followed by the same again. Six driving periods completed so a twenty-four hour weekly rest away from home base then back onto the nine hour driving days and eleven hour rests and by the time the week is up at midnight Sunday you can squeeze in 74 hours driving.
It’s legal, very unlikely to be achieved but legal. Even without taking it to that extreme it is possible to legally do more than 56 hours driving in the week which is why the 56 hour weekly limit is being written into the new regulations.
Yep, but if it is technically possible they have to close the loophole I guess. I have only once done more than 56 driving hours in a week, with a 24-hour away from base weekly rest, and even then it was only a few hours over the 56.
Where do I stand on this, we have our tachos checked by an independent company, they pick up two weeks worth of tachos every other tuesday, and drop off the checked ones, with their relevant print outs, guess what, we are due a pick up / return on tuesday 02.05.2006 ■■?
We have drivers going out from 04.00am MONDAY and TUESDAY, I cannot possibly supply the drivers with their legal requirement, it will be difficult to comply with even when we get the originals back, as a number of drivers are not due back until friday.
When VOSA have been in to check our records, they have been happy with our fortnightly independent check, so, do I rely on common sense, on their part ?
West Hallam Ram:
When VOSA have been in to check our records, they have been happy with our fortnightly independent check, so, do I rely on common sense, on their part ?
I wouldn’t, they can’t apply common sense when the regulations have been broken.
While your system has been fine under the old regulations it will need modifying for the changes.
I presume when the scheduled pick up is made on Tuesday they would normally be collecting the last charts from w/e 16th April, all charts from w/e 23rd April and all but the last charts from last week (w/e 30th April) On Tuesday you will not be able to give them any charts from the 16th onward as your drivers will need to carry them and you will need to make a new collection arraignment with the analysis company. There is little or no point in them collecting charts this Tuesday as they will really only get one chart from each driver. If they don’t collect until next Tuesday, 9th May, they could have all charts prior to the 23rd May on that day and then two weeks later, on the 23rd May, they would be back to collecting two weeks at a time. They must be aware of the new regulations and are surely working with the companies whose charts they analyse to arrange collection schedules that fit in with the new requirements.
I know this means it takes a little longer before you get the analysed charts and the reports back but it is either that or face problems for both the company and drivers if they are stopped while not carrying the correct number of charts. You will still be having the charts independently checked and VOSA will still be happy with that.
I wouldn’t, they can’t apply common sense when the regulations have been broken.
Apparently there will be a period where the new legislation is enforced with a ‘Light Touch.’ This means that initially fail to produce charts at the roadside will result in advice being given, unless you make a complete Horlicks of the job and forget to take the charts with you that you should have produced under the old legislation as well. However, it appears that records will be made and future fail to produce by driver / company and you get to chat to the three nice Magistrates.
Don’t know how long this ‘Light touch’ period will last, probably not very long
geebee45:
Don’t know how long this ‘Light touch’ period will last, probably not very long
My understanding from conversations with VOSA people is not very long at all. That’s why I think it would be best to sort out a new schedule with the tacho analysis company as soon as possible.
My understanding from conversations with VOSA people is not very long at all. That’s why I think it would be best to sort out a new schedule with the tacho analysis company as soon as possible.
probably about twice round the roundabout and half a ‘click’ down the road, about the same length of time an MOT is good for
Couldn’t agree more; sort the system out to-day, tomorrow is too late!!
That seems a more sensible approach Rep, but as Geebee45 said you wouldn’t want to get stopped twice for it, so better to sort out the procedures now rather than the last minute.
Cheers for the advice, our tacho man rang the day after he picked up the last lot, with the news of the impending change in regulations, as he collects from a lot in our area, I am in the same boat as others.
He will not be collecting any tomorrow, just dropping off, so i will be able to sort out 60% of the drivers by tomorrow night.
The other 40%, we shall see, we will be 100% legal by friday / saturday.
From the conversation, this rule change came in very quickly, I certainly did not read too much about it before it happened, or have I had my head in the clouds again ?.
Sounds like you have it sorted. With the tacho man only dropping off next week, and presumably not collecting for another two weeks you should move smoothly into the new system. Might be an idea to give your drivers, that don’t have all the required charts, a letter explaining they are at the analysis company and will be given to the drivers on their return. If they are stopped by VOSA it would show you are aware of the new regulation and are doing your best to comply with it. That coupled with the VOSA ‘Light Touch’ approach should help.
Although it was known changes were coming, the exact date and what they would be wasn’t know. All that was know was that some would come into force 20 days after the new regulations were published and it was unclear when that would be. It finally happened on the 11th of April, hence the changes happening today. The rest come into force on 11/04/2007.
If you got a problem with tachos…its possible for you to carry photocopies…so thats simple then…
with regard to the rest of the rules…there doesnt seem much change to me …except the new digi tacho…and if you got one…but no smart card…then use a manual overide…
i can never workm out how ytou can do 74 hours a week …when we supposed to be on a 48 hour week …or has that been thrown out the window…blimey ,.we havnt got used working a 48 hr week …and the french are already working on a reduction to 40 hours…and me…well i will carry on the same as i always have…start monday …finish friday …15 hours 3 times a week …2 x 10 and 3 x 9…thats about it really … i dont see any benefits whatsoever for the drivers…so they can all fork off…i do what i want to do …
truckyboy:
with regard to the rest of the rules…there doesnt seem much change to me …except the new digi tacho…and if you got one…but no smart card…then use a manual overide.
Nope, not having a smart card means you cannot drive a digi tacho equipped vehicle.
truckyboy:
i can never workm out how ytou can do 74 hours a week …when we supposed to be on a 48 hour week
The 74 hours mentioned is 74 hours driving, the 48 hours under the WTD is total work, not just driving, and the WTD doesn’t apply to everyone yet. 74 hours driving is theoretically possible in a week under the current regulations, which is why there will now be weekly driving limit specified to prevent that.
truckyboy:
…and the french are already working on a reduction to 40 hours…
Oh, and by the way Bob, the French have been on a 35 hour week for years now. But by filtering out all non-working time (waiting, non-assisted loading etc.) it becomes possible. I think it is averaged over a month too. Every now and then I was surprised by suddenly being given a Friday or a Monday off .
I`m still totally confused…as stated on this thread …you can drive for 74 hours in a week…you can work a 60 hour week…and yet the WTD says you can only work for 48 hours…(based over a 17 week period)…
Why does brussels always complicate things…its very simple to work out an easy way of doing things…ie…no one should work more than 48 hours a week…
a daily rest should be 11 hours…with no reductions…
a driver should have a working daily limit eg 9 hours
so after 4.5 hours driving…1 hour break
another 4.5 hours driving…and finish…then have 11 hours off…easy innit…except for brussels beaurocrats…who have never been inside a truck in their life…
Truckboy;
the confusion comes from the different Regulation being applied to road transport over time. The original 74 hours driving in a single week comes from consideration of the limits applicable to the regulations contained in 3820/85, the original ‘drivers hours’ applicable to Europe. You’re quite correct in stating that you can only work 48 hours per week (on average, it could be up to a maximum of 60 hours). However, this limit comes from the Working Time regulations and not the drivers hours laws.
It is due to this disparity between the two sets of legislation that the original drivers hours are being replaced on 11th April 2007. The new regs, detailed at the start of this post actually give a weekly driving limit of 56 hours, but don’t forget there is a fortnightly limit of 90 hours
One question: is the double-manned requirement of 9 hrs rest per day limited to 3 times a week (like single-manned)?
No. Article 8.2 of 561/2006 says; Within each period of 24 hours after the end of the previous daily rest period or weekly rest period a driver shall have taken a new daily rest period…
Article 8.5 goes onto say; By way of derogation from paragraph 2, within 30 hoursof the end of a daily or weekly rest period, a driver engaged in multi-manning must have taken a new daily rest period of at least nine hours.
In English; within 24 hours of ending the previous daily or weekly rest, you must have another daily rest. The second paragrah basically says that for double manned vehicles you must have at least 9 hours rest within 30 hours of when you ended the previous daily or weekly rest period. There is no limit as to how many times you can do this in the week, just like there was no limit under the current (soon to be replaced) 3820/85 Regs.
That’s why I think it would be best to sort out a new schedule with the tacho analysis company as soon as possible.
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