Not if you are under supervision, direction or control. Which 99% of drivers are.
eagerbeaver:
Not if you are under supervision, direction or control. Which 99% of drivers are.
Would you like to go a bit further on that, “supervision, direction, control”
If you are told what truck to use. If you are given a delivery by someone who supervises you. If you are given a start time. If you are subject to the clients disciplinary procedures. If you ring in after a drop for your next delivery/collection. etc,etc…
eagerbeaver:
If you are told what truck to use. If you are given a delivery by someone who supervises you. If you are given a start time. If you are subject to the clients disciplinary procedures. If you ring in after a drop for your next delivery/collection. etc,etc…
So, as you see it, I am told by my “agency” on Monday to travel 25 miles (from where I live) to client A, where they will advise me what truck I will be driving, hand me the delivery notes, then ask me to call in to the office as there may be a collection to do on the way back. This may be the same client on Tuesday. Wednesday, Thursday and Friday I then go to client B, 40 miles away where the same procedure happens.
What you are saying then is that I am not allowed to claim travelling expenses from my home address to the clients premises because I have been instructed/informed by the client what I will be driving and doing during the day? Really ■■?!!!
Have a look at Conor’s post further up this thread. He has summed it up perfectly.
eagerbeaver:
Have a look at Conor’s post further up this thread. He has summed it up perfectly.
Yes I read his post earlier and again
Workers employed through intermediaries such as umbrella companies or limited company directors
I’m talking about agency drivers on “PAYE”
Just gone back to PAYE after approx 1yr “self-employed” / Umbrella as they’re not worth a ■■■■!
Any mobile worker regardless of pay type.
pierrot 14:
I’m talking about agency drivers on “PAYE”
I think if you search Conors back posts he covered that a long time ago too. If you’re PAYE its related to having “usual place of work”, or rather not a fixed one. Anyway he has covered it before and how to go about claiming when you are PAYE. Search…
I have just read the whole of that accountancy web site that Conor quoted
sjdaccountancy.com/our-servi … l-expenses
(along with a lot of the links within it).
There is only mention of workers being paid under " UMBRELLA" or " LIMITED"
There is no mention whatsoever of drivers paying their own tax through PAYE along with their own NIC as an “employee” of an agency.
pierrot 14:
eagerbeaver:
Have a look at Conor’s post further up this thread. He has summed it up perfectly.Yes I read his post earlier and again
Workers employed through intermediaries such as umbrella companies or limited company directors
I’m talking about agency drivers on “PAYE”
Doesn’t matter if you are on PAYE. If you are an agency driver then you are “employed through an intermediary” and the relevant rules apply.
Roymondo:
pierrot 14:
eagerbeaver:
Have a look at Conor’s post further up this thread. He has summed it up perfectly.Yes I read his post earlier and again
Workers employed through intermediaries such as umbrella companies or limited company directors
I’m talking about agency drivers on “PAYE”
Doesn’t matter if you are on PAYE. If you are an agency driver then you are “employed through an intermediary” and the relevant rules apply.
Can’t agree, I am, or was up until a couple of months ago, an employee of an agency, they paid my wages not their clients, I paid my employee contributions, the agency paid their employer contributions into the system. Where is the intermediary ? The client paid the agency for a service. This was a employee/employer situation both playing and paying their part. The umbrella system, or as I call it SCAM, which has been discussed here on TNUK loads of times is not the same, it’s an employer/employee/third party marriage, where the third party is the one that does all the wheeling and dealing regarding wages taxes etc and this is what the government wanted to stop.
eagerbeaver:
I went on a website that say’s I can have ■■■ with 100 women in my area FOC.Doesn’t mean its true.
pierrot 14:
Roymondo:
pierrot 14:
eagerbeaver:
Have a look at Conor’s post further up this thread. He has summed it up perfectly.Yes I read his post earlier and again
Workers employed through intermediaries such as umbrella companies or limited company directors
I’m talking about agency drivers on “PAYE”
Doesn’t matter if you are on PAYE. If you are an agency driver then you are “employed through an intermediary” and the relevant rules apply.
Can’t agree, I am, or was up until a couple of months ago, an employee of an agency, they paid my wages not their clients, I paid my employee contributions, the agency paid their employer contributions into the system. Where is the intermediary ? The client paid the agency for a service. This was a employee/employer situation both playing and paying their part. The umbrella system, or as I call it SCAM, which has been discussed here on TNUK loads of times is not the same, it’s an employer/employee/third party marriage, where the third party is the one that does all the wheeling and dealing regarding wages taxes etc and this is what the government wanted to stop.
Disagree all you like. The government were not looking to stop anything - they were seeking to remove the imbalance which had allowed agency workers to claim tax relief on “simple commuting” (i.e. travel from home to a single place of work) while regular employees could not.
Rather than looking at the accountancy website mentioned earlier, have a look at this HMRC page:
gov.uk/government/publicati … ubsistence
Read and understand it, especially the “Policy” paragraphs, then tell me how agency drivers on PAYE are able to claim tax relief for simply driving to/from work for routine “Here’s the lorry, here’s the paperwork, take the load to X, Y and Z and bring back any returns” jobs. If you are still not convinced, put the question to HMRC yourself.
Roymondo:
If you are still not convinced, put the question to HMRC yourself.
Thought I said that. In the general case, not this one in particular, if you read something a certain way that can possibly be understood in other ways, it might always be wise to question the people who originally wrote it to explain/interpret it.
pierrot 14:
Can’t agree, I am, or was up until a couple of months ago, an employee of an agency, they paid my wages not their clients, I paid my employee contributions, the agency paid their employer contributions into the system. Where is the intermediary ? The client paid the agency for a service. This was a employee/employer situation both playing and paying their part. The umbrella system, or as I call it SCAM, which has been discussed here on TNUK loads of times is not the same, it’s an employer/employee/third party marriage, where the third party is the one that does all the wheeling and dealing regarding wages taxes etc and this is what the government wanted to stop.
Yep. Downside is that HMRC now consider a “travel to work area” for mileage claims from PAYE agency workers as you describe although I reckon if it wasn’t excessive, i.e under £1k, then you’d probably get away with it but if you’re trying to claim half your annual income it may be a different story. Even under old rules I can’t claim now because I limit myself to one agency client.
Roymondo:
Read and understand it, especially the “Policy” paragraphs, then tell me how agency drivers on PAYE are able to claim tax relief for simply driving to/from work for routine “Here’s the lorry, here’s the paperwork, take the load to X, Y and Z and bring back any returns” jobs. If you are still not convinced, put the question to HMRC yourself.
Under the old rules you could because you weren’t going to a single place of work but it was kind of an abuse of a rule that was designed for permanent employees being asked to go to another site for a temporary period. The guidance changed a little while ago to make that a “travel to work area” I think because of the abuse.
Now i understand they have stopped it so regular and agency workers are the same but when i did agency work i was told the agency office was my place of work and from there they sent me where needed so i couldn’t claim travel to the office but i could to my place of work. If the work place was 10 miles from my house but 20 miles from the agency i claimed 20. This was all PAYE
My wife works for a firm and if she’s sent to another office she gets mileage just the same as contractors sent on jobs away from base, how will that work?
The government were not looking to stop anything - they were seeking to remove the imbalance which had allowed agency workers to claim tax relief on “simple commuting” (i.e. travel from home to a single place of work) while regular employees could not.
Conor:
Roymondo:
Read and understand it, especially the “Policy” paragraphs, then tell me how agency drivers on PAYE are able to claim tax relief for simply driving to/from work for routine “Here’s the lorry, here’s the paperwork, take the load to X, Y and Z and bring back any returns” jobs. If you are still not convinced, put the question to HMRC yourself.Under the old rules you could because you weren’t going to a single place of work but it was kind of an abuse of a rule that was designed for permanent employees being asked to go to another site for a temporary period. The guidance changed a little while ago to make that a “travel to work area” I think because of the abuse.
Even under old rules I can’t claim now because I limit myself to one agency client.
I was always aware that if you were, as an agency driver, sent to a client that you were able claim the mileage from your address to the clients address, as long as it was different clients. The moment you stayed at the same client as Conor says, I think it was for 6 months, you were no longer allowed to claim.
(May I add the agency that I worked for paid us a £6 per day travelling expenses which I would have to remove from the amount on the P87 claim form).
So if as you say you can no longer claim allowances for mileage expenses to and from the agencies client, I presume that I will be receiving a letter from HMRC, explaining that my Tax Code will be changing dramatically in the near future.
You used to claim like you said until april this year. It says “mobile workers” not unbrella or ltd or paye, any “mobile” workers. So you might want to check your tax code then before your stung.