Where has it been reported the mini bus driver only had 3 hours sleep? It certainly hasn’t come out in any press I’ve read or is it just gossip to attempt to deflect attention away from these 2 miserable beings.
I hope their actions and their guilt destroys their lives.
In my book, Wagstaff was the most serious culprit of the trio. The jury let him off the hook with their bloody verdict.
mattecube:
Where has it been reported the mini bus driver only had 3 hours sleep? It certainly hasn’t come out in any press I’ve read or is it just gossip to attempt to deflect attention away from these 2 miserable beings.
I hope their actions and their guilt destroys their lives.
It was widely reported, go and find it.
TiredAndEmotional:
mattecube:
Where has it been reported the mini bus driver only had 3 hours sleep? It certainly hasn’t come out in any press I’ve read or is it just gossip to attempt to deflect attention away from these 2 miserable beings.
I hope their actions and their guilt destroys their lives.It was widely reported, go and find it.
Yeah right!
mattecube:
Where has it been reported the mini bus driver only had 3 hours sleep?.
If I remember correctly one of his relatives said the mini-bus driver had 3 hours sleep at his house before the journey started, as far as I’m aware it hasn’t been established whether or not he had any other sleep during the day.
Not hat it makes much difference because as far as I can see the videos that have been published show that he did little or nothing wrong.
kcrussell25:
This is my point that he was convicted and sentenced for careless. I just started my post with it. I have followed, though not closely this case and think there was an attempt to make a big deal of being cruise and the phone. Cruise is normal driving for a lorry even if it may sound bad to the public. The phone was hands free, again legal so can’t be called dangerous.I think some on here believe he should have got longer because of the outcome of his actions rather than the actions themselves. We are tried for our actions and then the circumstances, including the outcome are taken into account for sentencing if found guilty. He received the maximum sentence possible for his crime. Can’t ask the judge for anymore than that.
To be clear, I hope I never find myself in this situation
^^^ That.
He was and should be based on his actions. He did one thing wrong, which was to not be concentrating on the road; the cruise and the phone were both legal.
On a purely personal basis, I actually think it’s irrelevant how many he killed, 1 or 20. He made the one mistake.
To take a similar scenario but with no emotion attached to it. I had a driver put petrol in a truck last week, drove it a couple of miles and by some miracle could just pull in to a lay by as the engine started making odd noises. Luckily all round, it only cost a call out, the loss of 200 litres of petrol, but of course it could have cost an engine and dragging it back from the top end of Sweden. So he did one thing wrong, would any punishment be different depending on the outcome? Not in my book.
And I’m very much in the camp of realising that we are not robots, we are human beings that make mistakes. I am positive there have been times that I in effect got away with a lapse in concentration. How many on here haven’t looked at a pretty girl in a mini skirt in summer for longer than was maybe wise, or looked at a truck on the hard shoulderon the other side of the motorway, and looked to see if it’s your mate Jim? Everyone makes mistakes in their job, however only certain roles have consequences that are severe, most people get shouted at for not following up a sales lead, or ordering 20 boxes of sterilizing wipes instead of 2.
tachograph:
mattecube:
Where has it been reported the mini bus driver only had 3 hours sleep?.If I remember correctly one of his relatives said the mini-bus driver had 3 hours sleep at his house before the journey started, as far as I’m aware it hasn’t been established whether or not he had any other sleep during the day.
Not hat it makes much difference because as far as I can see the videos that have been published show that he did little or nothing wrong.
Playing devils advocate, it could be argued that if he had had three hours sleep, he may have realised the truck was stationary earlier?
tachograph:
mattecube:
Where has it been reported the mini bus driver only had 3 hours sleep?.If I remember correctly one of his relatives said the mini-bus driver had 3 hours sleep at his house before the journey started, as far as I’m aware it hasn’t been established whether or not he had any other sleep during the day.
Not hat it makes much difference because as far as I can see the videos that have been published show that he did little or nothing wrong.
The one thing he did wrong was parking behind an artic in a live lane on a motorway,don’t think I’ll be trying that one anytime soon.
albion:
tachograph:
mattecube:
Where has it been reported the mini bus driver only had 3 hours sleep?.If I remember correctly one of his relatives said the mini-bus driver had 3 hours sleep at his house before the journey started, as far as I’m aware it hasn’t been established whether or not he had any other sleep during the day.
Not hat it makes much difference because as far as I can see the videos that have been published show that he did little or nothing wrong.
Playing devils advocate, it could be argued that if he had had three hours sleep, he may have realised the truck was stationary earlier?
I THINK but can’t remember that it was said he was doing paperwork the night before. If so he hasn’t had daily rest as far as the taco goes and maybe if he had had more sleep and maybe been more alert that he maybe wouldn’t have stopped there.
Maybe, who knows
bobbya:
tachograph:
mattecube:
Where has it been reported the mini bus driver only had 3 hours sleep?.If I remember correctly one of his relatives said the mini-bus driver had 3 hours sleep at his house before the journey started, as far as I’m aware it hasn’t been established whether or not he had any other sleep during the day.
Not hat it makes much difference because as far as I can see the videos that have been published show that he did little or nothing wrong.
The one thing he did wrong was parking behind an artic in a live lane on a motorway,don’t think I’ll be trying that one anytime soon.
He didn’t park it - he came safely to a halt behind what he probably initially thought was the back of a queue (queues happen, especially at junctions…). 9 seconds later Wagstaffe arrives, FUBBIN.
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albion:
tachograph:
mattecube:
Where has it been reported the mini bus driver only had 3 hours sleep?.If I remember correctly one of his relatives said the mini-bus driver had 3 hours sleep at his house before the journey started, as far as I’m aware it hasn’t been established whether or not he had any other sleep during the day.
Not hat it makes much difference because as far as I can see the videos that have been published show that he did little or nothing wrong.
Playing devils advocate, it could be argued that if he had had three hours sleep, he may have realised the truck was stationary earlier?
We’ll probably never know if that’s the case or not, even if he did only have 3 hours sleep it doesn’t really mean much, I’ve worked with people who could drive an artic all day on 4 hours sleep and still end the shift more alert than me.
What is known is that when the vehicles in from of the Fed-Ex vehicle pulled out into lane 2 Wagstaff failed to notice that there was an obstruction in front of him, even though one of the vehicles causing the obstruction had amber flashing lights on each corner, that takes a bit more than a slight lapse of concentration, he was clearly paying so little attention to what was going on around him he appears to not have reacted until the moment of impact.
Sorry but I don’t see any similarity between that and someone putting the wrong fuel in a vehicle.
tachograph:
albion:
tachograph:
mattecube:
Where has it been reported the mini bus driver only had 3 hours sleep?.If I remember correctly one of his relatives said the mini-bus driver had 3 hours sleep at his house before the journey started, as far as I’m aware it hasn’t been established whether or not he had any other sleep during the day.
Not hat it makes much difference because as far as I can see the videos that have been published show that he did little or nothing wrong.
Playing devils advocate, it could be argued that if he had had three hours sleep, he may have realised the truck was stationary earlier?
We’ll probably never know if that’s the case or not, even if he did only have 3 hours sleep it doesn’t really mean much, I’ve worked with people who could drive an artic all day on 4 hours sleep and still end the shift more alert than me.
What is known is that when the vehicles in from of the Fed-Ex vehicle pulled out into lane 2 Wagstaff failed to notice that there was an obstruction in front of him, even though one of the vehicles causing the obstruction had amber flashing lights on each corner, that takes a bit more than a slight lapse of concentration, he was clearly paying so little attention to what was going on around him he appears to not have reacted until the moment of impact.
Sorry but I don’t see any similarity between that and someone putting the wrong fuel in a vehicle.
I was trying to take the emotion out of it. The question, AIUI, was how much doe the outcome influence the punishment. Are you punishing the action of lack of concentration, or are you punishing the outcome an differentiating between the deaths of 1 or 20 people.
bobbya:
tachograph:
mattecube:
Where has it been reported the mini bus driver only had 3 hours sleep?.If I remember correctly one of his relatives said the mini-bus driver had 3 hours sleep at his house before the journey started, as far as I’m aware it hasn’t been established whether or not he had any other sleep during the day.
Not hat it makes much difference because as far as I can see the videos that have been published show that he did little or nothing wrong.
The one thing he did wrong was parking behind an artic in a live lane on a motorway,don’t think I’ll be trying that one anytime soon.
As it turns out that was an unfortunate judgement call, the reality was that he saw an obstruction in front of him and chose to stop safely with his hazard lights on instead of pulling out in front of a faster moving vehicle in lane 2.
If the Fed-Ex driver had done the same this discussion wouldn’t be taking place.
albion:
I was trying to take the emotion out of it. The question, AIUI, was how much doe the outcome influence the punishment. Are you punishing the action of lack of concentration, or are you punishing the outcome an differentiating between the deaths of 1 or 20 people.
Look at a fight outside of night club?
The bouncer gets punched, falls and rips his bomber jacket? GBH?
The bouncer gets punched, falls and cracks his head on the kerb? Murder? Manslaughter?
The actions are the same, but the outcomes very different.
I do see exactly what youre suggesting, and the charge and sentencing maybe should look only at the actions, but in many cases they dont.
albion:
The question, AIUI, was how much doe the outcome influence the punishment. Are you punishing the action of lack of concentration, or are you punishing the outcome an differentiating between the deaths of 1 or 20 people.
Dangerous driving is dangerous driving regardless of the outcome, in this case, in my opinion at-least, the jury let the driver off the hook by finding him not guilty of causing death by dangerous driving.
As far as I can see David Wagstaff has behaved in a decent manner since the accident and I wish him luck, but I still think he’s been very lucky to have been found guilty of causing death by careless driving rather than causing death by dangerous driving.
Having a slight lapse of concentration is one thing but it’s a little concerning that so many HGV drivers on this board seem to think that being completely oblivious to what’s going on around you while driving in traffic is acceptable 
11 seconds is not a slight lapse of concentration.
He was busy doing something else and only he knows what.
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This is nearly the same: dailymail.co.uk/news/article … years.html
Fat women who looks like a bloke gets high and intentionally runs out of fuel. Truck driver goes into the back.
Fat women gets 3 years and trucker gets a suspended sentence.
Seems weird to sentence them all so differently.
sammym:
This is nearly the same: dailymail.co.uk/news/article … years.htmlFat women who looks like a bloke gets high and intentionally runs out of fuel. Truck driver goes into the back.
Fat women gets 3 years and trucker gets a suspended sentence.
Seems weird to sentence them all so differently.
Roymondo:
bobbya:
tachograph:
mattecube:
Where has it been reported the mini bus driver only had 3 hours sleep?.If I remember correctly one of his relatives said the mini-bus driver had 3 hours sleep at his house before the journey started, as far as I’m aware it hasn’t been established whether or not he had any other sleep during the day.
Not hat it makes much difference because as far as I can see the videos that have been published show that he did little or nothing wrong.
The one thing he did wrong was parking behind an artic in a live lane on a motorway,don’t think I’ll be trying that one anytime soon.
He didn’t park it - he came safely to a halt behind what he probably initially thought was the back of a queue (queues happen, especially at junctions…). 9 seconds later Wagstaffe arrives, FUBBIN.
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So if lanes 1&2 were running why choose to join a queue in lane 1 ■■
bobbya:
Roymondo:
bobbya:
He didn’t park it - he came safely to a halt behind what he probably initially thought was the back of a queue (queues happen, especially at junctions…). 9 seconds later Wagstaffe arrives, FUBBIN.Sent from my SM-G920F using Tapatalk
So if lanes 1&2 were running why choose to join a queue in lane 1 ■■
Did you see the clips showing streams of almost tail-gating traffic in lane two with little chance to get a vehicle into it?
It may have been less than perfect driving by the minibus driver, BUT he was driving within his limits, and was able to stop without ploughing into a stationary vehicle!