Oh, how different things could have been! I always knew there were supposed to be four london ringways, but still found this video quite interesting.
hhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yUEHWhO_HdY
Even if they’d just have done the south circular properly like the north circular imagine what a difference that would have made
Why the obsession with large circular routes.Which just mean loads of needless road building and fuel wasted covering resulting needless circular distances.When just one elevated direct North South route and one East West route running through London would do the same job far more efficiently.In addition to more upgrading of the North and South Circular which involve less distance in circumventing London than going further out.
In addition to North/South and East/West traffic needlessly being routed towards London that could be far better routed much further out.In which case the problem isn’t lack of motorways around London it’s a lack of direct motorway or even A road capacity linking the South/West with East Anglia and the North/East for example.In addition to only 3 main North South Routes M6/M1/A1.
Rowley010:
Even if they’d just have done the south circular properly like the north circular imagine what a difference that would have made
As my Londoner mate use to say, the south circ is just a selection of joined up back streets - but he didn’t like anything sarf of the river 
Carryfast:
Why the obsession with large circular routes.Which just mean loads of needless road building and fuel wasted covering resulting needless circular distances.When just one elevated direct North South route and one East West route running through London would do the same job far more efficiently.In addition to more upgrading of the North and South Circular which involve less distance in circumventing London than going further out.In addition to North/South and East/West traffic needlessly being routed towards London that could be far better routed much further out.In which case the problem isn’t lack of motorways around London it’s a lack of direct motorway or even A road capacity linking the South/West with East Anglia and the North/East for example.In addition to only 3 main North South Routes M6/M1/A1.
The problem ain’t the lack of roads. It’s too many vehicles. 
I think the 1960’s original plan for the Mancunian Way in Manchester was for it link with the M62 and M67 and continue over to Sheffield.
50 years later their still fiddling about at the edges, rather than commit to big building projects.
Sixties boy:
I think the 1960’s original plan for the Mancunian Way in Manchester was for it link with the M62 and M67 and continue over to Sheffield.50 years later their still fiddling about at the edges, rather than commit to big building projects.
Last I heard of that, they were going to tunnel UNDER the peak district for a Manchester to Sheffield link road.
Nite Owl:
Sixties boy:
I think the 1960’s original plan for the Mancunian Way in Manchester was for it link with the M62 and M67 and continue over to Sheffield.50 years later their still fiddling about at the edges, rather than commit to big building projects.
Last I heard of that, they were going to tunnel UNDER the peak district for a Manchester to Sheffield link road.
Can only imagine what happened to those plans. Govs of all parties are frightened of serious investment, and nimbys, civil servants lack vision, and so Jim Hacker and Humphrey Appleby keep going.
The tunnel for the proposed Manchester to Sheffield route is already there,the former electrified railway via the Woodhead tunnel.
Every now and again someone proposes it as a car only route or a piggyback rail/truck route.Then it all goes quiet again.
jakethesnake:
Carryfast:
Why the obsession with large circular routes.Which just mean loads of needless road building and fuel wasted covering resulting needless circular distances.When just one elevated direct North South route and one East West route running through London would do the same job far more efficiently.In addition to more upgrading of the North and South Circular which involve less distance in circumventing London than going further out.In addition to North/South and East/West traffic needlessly being routed towards London that could be far better routed much further out.In which case the problem isn’t lack of motorways around London it’s a lack of direct motorway or even A road capacity linking the South/West with East Anglia and the North/East for example.In addition to only 3 main North South Routes M6/M1/A1.
The problem ain’t the lack of roads. It’s too many vehicles.
The problem is ‘too many vehicles’ needlessly transiting and trying to circumvent London.Combined with lack of direct road links which would avoid that situation.As I said just two elevated road links through London not around it,fix the Norf and Saf circulars and build some new direct routes linking the South West and East Anglia,East Midlands and the North East.Then apply punitive ‘congestion charges’ to cross channel traffic that could/should be using the North Sea Ferry crossings instead.
Oh and it’s also time for the rest of the country to take its fair share of the country’s population instead of trying to force it all into the South East.
Carryfast:
jakethesnake:
Carryfast:
Why the obsession with large circular routes.Which just mean loads of needless road building and fuel wasted covering resulting needless circular distances.When just one elevated direct North South route and one East West route running through London would do the same job far more efficiently.In addition to more upgrading of the North and South Circular which involve less distance in circumventing London than going further out.In addition to North/South and East/West traffic needlessly being routed towards London that could be far better routed much further out.In which case the problem isn’t lack of motorways around London it’s a lack of direct motorway or even A road capacity linking the South/West with East Anglia and the North/East for example.In addition to only 3 main North South Routes M6/M1/A1.
The problem ain’t the lack of roads. It’s too many vehicles.
The problem is ‘too many vehicles’ needlessly transiting and trying to circumvent London.Combined with lack of direct road links which would avoid that situation.As I said just two elevated road links through London not around it,fix the Norf and Saf circulars and build some new direct routes linking the South West and East Anglia,East Midlands and the North East.Then apply punitive ‘congestion charges’ to cross channel traffic that could/should be using the North Sea Ferry crossings instead.
Oh and it’s also time for the rest of the country to take its fair share of the country’s population instead of trying to force it all into the South East.
Thanks for the reply Carryfast. I could argue your points but I won’t bother. 
Franglais:
Nite Owl:
Sixties boy:
I think the 1960’s original plan for the Mancunian Way in Manchester was for it link with the M62 and M67 and continue over to Sheffield.50 years later their still fiddling about at the edges, rather than commit to big building projects.
Last I heard of that, they were going to tunnel UNDER the peak district for a Manchester to Sheffield link road.
Can only imagine what happened to those plans. Govs of all parties are frightened of serious investment, and nimbys, civil servants lack vision, and so Jim Hacker and Humphrey Appleby keep going.
The con that is called the Humber Bridge is still waiting for its link road to the M11 and A1 link road to the North East.
However they have wasted billions on HS1 / HS2 and HS3