Limited choices!

[bones]

Well went into work today and went to get the unit… The unit today was an 05 fm12 with i shift which i really like, However got in the unit and notice something a bit odd with the Gear selector…

They have only gone and blanked out all the options on the box apart from A N and R so there is no manual choice!!! No Crawler Gear and No whatever the third one was SO i thought it was just unit but no the whole fleets been done. apparently it will save them money in diesel because “loads” of drivers are driving them round in manual??

Now theres a few things to this

1. I think the i shift is good but sometimes its good to be able to “lock” it into a gear by dropping into manual or Even drop one when coming up a hill…

2. Are drivers really driving round in manual all the time… i cant see it to be honest and i dont think this will help.

3. What happens when things go wrong. Your stuffed basically since you cant select anything but Auto as a drive gear.

4. What happens in Snow, bad ice etc where manual is needed??

Crazy in my opinion and quite possibly dangerous

A little bit more money spent on the Planning department muppets would save more money than any silly stunt like this…

[kyrbo]

Everyone who has ever drove a truck should understand that manual gears are needed in some situations. Auto box does one ill timed gear change when you’re going up on snowy hill and there you are sitting in the hill hoping that truck doesn’t start sliding backwards… Maybe you should go and point out something like this as it sounds like someone hasn’t really been thinking.

[flying_fenman]

Our whole fleet was done a month or so ago.

Volvo initially refused to supply a bracket because they feel a manual over-ride is necessary (that’s why they put one on it in the first place )

But Mr David Batty (SF Fleet boss - the one who made Volvo put ‘2000Nm’ instead of ‘420’ on the sides ) pressed them to do it, and they’ve given in. Volvo will no doubt be aware that SF are taking an increasing number of DAFs onto the fleet , and don’t want to lose any more sales.

I totally agree with you regarding being able to hold gears. There is a hill I go up often on the A23, just north of the A272 junction. Before the mod, my unit (an 05 420hp g/t) would steam up the hill with a loaded 44’, on the limiter - IF you dropped it into 11th before you started the climb.

Last night, with a half full 40’, I was down to about 42 mph before I got to the top. The box held onto 12th for so long that by the time it dropped into 11th, it needed 10th .
For God’s sake, one of the FL220s could have done better - and they are TRULY awful!

I would say that many of our 'more mature ’ drivers did over -use the manual mode, but education is the answer - not locking out manual all together. Familiarisation with the I-Shift has been very different amongst the drivers. Some (myself included) have had proper training direct from Volvo. Others have just been thrown the keys. One bloke I know tried to VOR one the other day because it was ‘jumping into neutral’ . I explained to him (and the clerk) what Eco-Roll is, and the driver was very grateful - nobody had ever expalined it, or the exhaust brake . And of course, ours arrived from Thomas Hardie minus instruction manuals and toolkits

With regard to getting out of trouble in case of failure, you can still use the ‘limp’ button on the back of the selector, but I’m not aware of any of ours ever breaking.

Have you also thought about snow, ice etc IN CONJUNCTION with the tyres SF spec? They are new at present, so have originals still. But when they get replaced with the high-nylon compound tyres that SF select, they are going to be lethal! TCS on or off!

I attended a meeting a few weeks ago with the GMB and our General Manager to discuss this and other issues. The GM was going to ‘see what he could find out’ and email Mr Batty, but I’ve heard nothing more.

And you leave Exel planners alone! I love them! They earn me a fortune in overtime .

[wheel_nut]

I have an FM now and I love it, the gearbox stays in Auto We have had the kickdown disabled to help fuel consumption but as there is a prize at the end of the year, I dont mind

To be honest the first time I have needed Manual was today as I drove off the shuttle, A spaniard, either waiting for his mate or just plain stupid stopped halfway up the ramp With a slack load it made it impossible to set off again without dumping the air and leaving it in 2nd gear

[bones]

Totally Agree, Dont know what consultation took place but i can see trouble ahead.

Surely this means the vehice is not as designed and would in validate the warranty on the box?? like you say the designed it with a M for a reason.

[brummie]

Apparently, Wisemans’ depot in Droitwich took delivery of a load of new DAF CFs and removed the splitter button in an effort to reduce damage to gearboxes. Undoubtedly agency drivers are to blame, full-time employees couldn’t possibly be responsible!

[flying_fenman]

Don’t know about why they disconnected the splitters, but when I worked for Wiseman in Peterborough, our CFs were only 340 bhp,so you needed a splitter because they were running heavy.

A few of the Polish lads who worked there knew how to reconnect the splitters, however

[paul_b]

a subsidiary of the firm i sub off, use these volvo fm’s with the I shift, the drivers love em, but they average around 6.5mpg on local work, i can match them, job for job, all day long with a twin splitter and a 380 ■■■■■■■■ and and get 9mpg no bother!
progress? i’m not so sure!

[brummie]

I was going for a job on the tankers last February and, whilst being shown around the site by their TM, he confirmed it - before they’d even taken delivery!

[flying_fenman]

I hear you there Paul!

One run we do, running at nigh-on 40 tonnes, I can get 9.0 mpg on a 420 I-Shift - if I’m very, very careful.

When there is a full load to collect I take an FM12 mk1 380, 9-speed manual six legger, and I can get 9.8-10.0 mpg without any bother. Thats with another 3 tonnes, and the resistance from another axle.

Although I’m a huge fan of two-pedal transmissions, I believe that if driven well, a manual will give better economy.

[muckles]

It comes down to 2 problems,

1. Companies spending £000’s on new trucks, but not willing to spend money on training to drive the vehicles. Bit like taking 747 pilots and letting them loose on an Airbus, with only a handbook in the side pocket for training.

2. Drivers not willing to take on new idea’s and learn how to get the best out of their vehicle. Just carry on doing it the way they have always done, because they know best and that’s the way they were taught when they did their training in 19long time ago.

So in the end the bosses treat us like morons and their suspicions are confirmed by a certain type of lorry driver.
However what comes first, the driver who can’t think for themselves or do these policies end up making inteligent drivers go elsewhere, just leaving the muppets who need even more spoon feeding.

[convoy]

When I did night shunting at cadburys a while
back I read an article in Commercial motors
magazine about Summerfields saying they
can save £700,000 a year on there fuel bill by
stopping drivers using manual.

[wheel_nut]

Our training manual consists of various fuel saving tips and it goes towards the fuel bonus.

The computers are set to give 34l / 100km and the advice from Volvo is to stick to 80kph and use the cruise control as much as possible.

My computer is giving an average of 32/100

[jammymutt]

I cant see a problem i have an I-Shift and i use Auto box all the time, i have never had a problem with it.

Dont forget that if you get wheel slip the vehicle is designed to use the diff lock at low speeds and unlike most otrhers it can actually be selected when you are moving [b]AT SLOW SPEEDS[/b].

As for dropping it down a gear when approaching a hill?thats probably why they have taekn it away too many people doing such a thing and getting poor performance.

The computer read outs on an I Shift will tell your boss EXACTLY what time manual was selected so he can effectivelytrace it back to certain people.

When things go wrong there is a button under the gearchange box which selects a “get me out of trouble gear”.

Just one question Bones but have you actually sat and read the manual?.

[flying_fenman]

jammy,

I use auto all of the time, except when I can see a situation ahead of me (which of course, the I-Shift cannot anticipate ) which I believe requires I change. I’m not talking about any slight incline - I mean a stonking great, ■■■■ off hill when you’re fully freighted.

When I learned to drive, I was taught to anticipate in advance what actions I may need to take to try and make good progress- so I try to.

If you don’t prepare yourself and leave it in auto, the box can be too slow to react and ends up ‘hunting’ to find the most appropriate ratio, all the time losing momentum and sapping the fuel figures.

Or for example, when leaving one motorway and joining another eg - M25 clockwise onto M23 south - you have to slow down a little.
If you can hold it in 11th and keep a little power on, you can go round at about 50ish.
If you leave it in auto, it will change up into 12th just when you don’t want it to! Then the truck goes all wobbly .

I think in my own personal driving - I use ‘M’ more for holding a gear, rather than using it for changing up through the box. Though I do accept that many of our drivers do abuse it and use it all the time .

I’m off to work now - think I’m gonna take an old 9-speed manual!

[kyrbo]

jammymutt:
Dont forget that if you get wheel slip the vehicle is designed to use the diff lock at low speeds and unlike most otrhers it can actually be selected when you are moving AT SLOW SPEEDS.

Thats really easy way to get truck jack-knifed. Having three axles prevents that jack-knife effect quite much but I think most will lift that third axle way before trying to engage diff lock (assuming that it won’t overload drive axle much more than 3-5 tonnes).

[rs005d1136]

All our fleet of fm’s have also been capped 03 and 05 units when our Tm was questioned he said there shouldnt be a problem with snow or ice as volvos come from sweden where they have lots of it i thought he was having a laugh but he was serious Bones i was at your place friday to collect a unit y668 xbv we dont want your cast offs mate whats going on!

[bones]

jammymutt:
I cant see a problem i have an I-Shift and i use Auto box all the time, **i have never had a problem with it.**Dont forget that if you get wheel slip the vehicle is designed to use the diff lock at low speeds and unlike most otrhers it can actually be selected when you are moving [b]AT SLOW SPEEDS[/b].

**As for dropping it down a gear when approaching a hill?thats probably why they have taekn it away too many people doing such a thing and getting poor performance.**The computer read outs on an I Shift will tell your boss EXACTLY what time manual was selected so he can effectivelytrace it back to certain people.

When things go wrong there is a button under the gearchange box which selects a “get me out of trouble gear”.

Just one question Bones but have you actually sat and read the manual?.
[/quote]

I havent had a problem with the i shift either and also drive it in Auto almost all day.
However like flying fenman said sometimes the i shift takes too long to realise what its been faced with since it dont have eyes it doesnt know how long its going to be pulling up a hill etc So to prevent it from changing up from say 11 to 12 then having to go back to 11 again i USED to drop it into m so it stayed in 11. Since i have eyes and could make this choice in my opinion to avoid undue stress on the engine/box.

Also like fenman said we are not talking about each and every hill just ones that you know from expereince the Gearbox struggles to read correct and so since you as a driver learn the roads and the gearbox doesnt it made sense to overide it on occasion

To be honest lookng at the size of the clamp they have put on it i also think it covers the overide button for the emergency selector, However not really looked that far tbh.

With regards the manual. I got a Training day on the volvo with our trainer and have read most have the manual and was talking about exactly that last night in the chatroom with Neil.

[jammymutt]

I had a training day with a Volvo man last week and he basically said to get the best performance out of the I-~Shift it should be in Auto 99.99% of the time when i asked when it should not be in auto he said when its in R.

Our company nag us like hell about M.P.G. which is why we have it Auto all the time, i have persoanly NEVER met a hill that the gearbox doesnt change down for when it needs to, I am in CC most of the time too so i just let the wagon do the work.

I am currently getting 8.79 M.P.G on average over the last 6 months from the ones i drive.

Just out of curiosity do you use the retarder to slow you down or the brake pedal?, (you can actually slow down VERY quick with no brake pedal at all) its only really after last weeks course that i have started using the retarder fully and hardly use the brake pedal now, it takes a bit of getting used to .

[flying_fenman]

jammymutt:
Our company nag us like hell about M.P.G. which is why we have it Auto all the time, i have persoanly NEVER met a hill that the gearbox doesnt change down for when it needs to, I am in CC most of the time too so i just let the wagon do the work.

So it’s not just my boss that puts up posters saying stuff like ‘average fuel consumption was only 9.36 mpg last week. Come on lads, let’s not slip back!’
He nearly fainted when he found out we are getting an FH16 610 for a month .

To be fair gents, I think you’ll find that SF vehicles have different software than standard I-Shifts. That’s what a chap from Volvo told me anyway. And I’ve driven hired units before that don’t seem to hang onto a gear as long as ours do, which would back up this theory.