Hi all.A s Roger so succinctly put it ‘‘lets not blow things out of proportion’’.The stories and pictures are,of course,excellent but are no different to the hundreds of stories,photo’s and anecdotes which have been posted over the years on the other M.E.threads on the forums,and not forgetting the excellent input on the ex pats site.
As to the M.E… [personally]the only person that should be put on a pedestal of any kind is Bob Paul and Mike woodward,as due to their hard work and courage in ‘‘pathfinding’’ the routes it made it possible for ALL the rest of us to partake in the fruits of their labours.Without people like them non of us would be posting now about our own meagre contributions.
It is a pity that someone literate and with organizational skills[ASH,are you listening]cannot put all the stories,anecdotes and musings,along with pictures from the forums into a book about ‘‘general’’ M.E. driving from the early days until now
It is a pity that so many ex M.E. guys,who have done so much,but perhaps are a little shy about their efforts or literary skills cannot, via other means put them on the site as all reminiscences are equally valuable and interesting .Mike
Well put Mike,and Steve your point is valid ,the point that made me unhappy was the remark of the GREAT LAURENCE KIELY.THE LEGEND ,these remarks are not for him ,I have seen his U TUBE vidio ,and a few other comments that are directed at ASDA ,it was fine for him to have his exploits recorded in print but it dont make him ,Great or a Legend,sorry Laurence but there are greater Legends as Mike put it ,most are not with us now in 500 years you will become part of the legend of ME drivers like most who are still writing on this site,as spock would say LIVE LONG AND PROSPER 
Roger Haywood
I dont think anybody said laurence was a god of driving or anything else.And of course Rodger he was’nt an Astran man which in your opinion makes him almost worthless. He did however write some bloody good articles in trucking mags in the past that quite a few of us on here grew up reading. People such as laurence( and yes i know there are lots of others) who did so were an inspiration to a lot of us who went on to become drivers.
Aidey
Thought someone might jump on the band wagon with the Astran bit and did I say he was worthless no so becareful what u say,did Laurence not work for MC and did they not work for Astrans ,or are there 2 Laurence Kiely’s ,strange but go back into the thread where u will find someone calling him a Legend also I never said he was or did anyone else say he was a God ,apart from you,normaly this is directed to someone who has passed away,Laurence was a normal ME driver who had the time to write stories ,legends are Bob Paul,mike Woodman.Gordon Pierce ,Trevor Long,■■■■ Snow ,Barry Barns(still with us),Andrew Wilson Young.Pat Seal,Gentelman George Ginn,Athol Addison,and lots more I Know he wrote some good articles,but he is not in the league of these guys .
Roger Haywood
There are many more that could be added to your list and i never said he was a god. Nobody is trying to take anything away from you or anyone else.
Whether you know it or not roger whenever sombody else comes on here that you dont know you have this habit of putting them down. check back through the thread.
I’ve never done any Middle East, furthest I went was Greece, & most other parts of Europe, I’d like to have had a go but was too young when most of you blokes did it during the 60s/70s etc, & was never in the right place at the right time years later. But it doesn’t bother me, I’ve done what I’ve done & I’m happy. I have read the magazines over the years & been inspired by the articles written by the likes of Lawrence Kiely etc, who I have admired for their incredible knowledge & in most cases great professionalism, being able to still get the job done under incredible pressure & extremes. Do I see any one as a God? No! The only man who I ever put on that kind of pedastle was my Dad, cos he was my hero! But all you gentlemen that did the Middle East run I have a great deal of respect for, personally I don’t care who you drove for, I just love seeing your pictures & reading your stories, so please just keep them coming for the likes of me cos this forum has given me countless hours of reading pleasure, & for that I thank you all!
Regards Chris
Never look forward unless you can dream, but never look back unless you can smile
Aidey
Im not running you down or Laurence,im just making a statement of the facts ,I dont know you ,but I do know Laurence Kiely,so that gives me a slight advantage ,if it reads like that then sorry ,If you know anyone that knows me you might think differently ,70% of the drivers I knew have now passed on ,I have been to six funerals in the past two years ,the number of drivers attending is dwindling fast,if you feel im insulting you then u have my permission to ■■■■ on my grave when I go ,just make sure my three 6ft 6in 120 kg rugby playing sons dont catch you 
Roger
Hi all.Roger.I’m glad i worked for some of the ‘‘less salubrious’’ companies like Simons and Stolk 
as well as Astran.I get a lot less flak than you,hehe.
I think there will be quite a queue waiting for a ■■■■ when you pop off I’m going to be buried in the river by my house,that way i won’t notice a bit more water when they all come to ■■■■ on me 
.I suggest you get buried in the lake in Sweden then they won’t know where you are[and you make the fish big for the next generation] Take care.Mike
aidey:
I dont think anybody said laurence was a god of driving or anything else.And of course Rodger he was’nt an Astran man which in your opinion makes him almost worthless. He did however write some bloody good articles in trucking mags in the past that quite a few of us on here grew up reading. People such as laurence( and yes i know there are lots of others) who did so were an inspiration to a lot of us who went on to become drivers.
I couldn’t agree more aidey. Lets hope some comments left on this thread don’t put anyone off reflecting on their driving experiences. As you stated Roger, many of the original M/E men are gone and so are their memories. I am lucky enough to have a friends dad to tell me stories of the M/E (he started it in '74, I’ve put some of his pics on here) but I still enjoy anyones contribution, especially when it is written in an absorbing style such as Laurences and published to be shared. This is why Mr Kiely stands out for my generation, for many he was the ONLY name to be put with the M/E run because no-one else had work published. Now we have the internet. All the ex- M/E boys on here are exceptional men, especially those who take the time and effort to put into words their experiences, whether they drove for Astran or anyone else. So please let things be positive before their tales are gone for good.
Regards,
Mark.
Hi all.It seems to me that with all the comments re Mr Kiely everyone seems to have forgotten a person of outstanding character who,long before Mr Kiely, made a substantial contribution and influenced many peoples lives.
Possibly the first person to bring the M.E.to the average person through the medium of print.Mr Philip Llewellen.
He first went to the M.E. in Feb 1975 as a passenger in a truck from Oryx Freight to Kuwait driven by Pat Hawkes to write an account of the hard road to the M.E. I was fortunate enough to meet them in Turkey and ran with them through Syria,Jordan,across H4 toTourayf and down the tapline where we parted company at the junction to Kuwait.This was Phil’s first trip in a truck but in 76 he went with a truck from the UK to Abadan,Iran and in 78 he went overland with Whittles to Jordan.
After these trips he went right across Canada and up the Dempster Highway to the N.W.T.in trucks with different companies.
This was a guy who really could say ‘‘been there,done that,got the t shirt.’’ He may not have been a driver but was an outstanding writer who brought exotic places within reach of many of us through doing the same job albeit from the passengers seat.Mike
sinbin31:
AideyIm not running you down or Laurence,im just making a statement of the facts ,I dont know you ,but I do know Laurence Kiely,so that gives me a slight advantage ,if it reads like that then sorry ,If you know anyone that knows me you might think differently ,70% of the drivers I knew have now passed on ,I have been to six funerals in the past two years ,the number of drivers attending is dwindling fast,if you feel im insulting you then u have my permission to ■■■■ on my grave when I go ,just make sure my three 6ft 6in 120 kg rugby playing sons dont catch you
Roger
Mmmmm…Looks like you are in trouble AGAIN Sinbin…
I guess I must have been an anti social loner who did fewer trips to the Middle East than some but a lot more than many and whilst I have read most books by Wilbur Smith, I had never heard of Laurence prior to the postings on this site. albit, there is some interesting reading…
ATVB…RDF
The only person not on here now is Laurence himself 
Hope to see some of your pictures & stories soon Laurence
Regards Chris
Reddesertfox
Yes when am I not in trouble ,but HEY- HO ,dont it come with title( Roger Rita Haywood) like Jonny Cash and the boy named Sue,never hurt him, or me ,so I supose I have some claim to fame,like you but wel;l keep the lid on that .
Chris.of course lets read them ,and see the pics ,
Roger Haywood
i knew it wouldnt take long for you two to start but by my reckoning he started in the 70s and was still running there in the 90s.he also took a oldboy who won the the radio 2 or 4 comp to have breakfast in babylon.and when i asked on the astran thred who had done the most trips you all declined to answer.and remember another of your astran mates said dow were a fly by night firm.so im with aidy your opinions if your not an astran subby you aint nothing. 
Oh no its dribbley dreva again the bull - sugar king keep it comming buddy funny thing no one mentioned Astran in the last few posts ,you must be ,anti Astran,but I can live with that ,so can Reddesert fox im sure…Wipe your mouth now or you will clogg up the key board ,with all that slobbering rubbish:lol:
Roger Haywood
I will just point out, This is why people wont post there memoirs on here you get a guy who has done as much as most or more who knows ? but more to the point who cares ? his stories were and are still entertaining and is one of the few to have his stories recorded for the future in print. I personally enjoy reading his thread and hope to carry on enjoying. If he comes back on here ?
This is why I dont put my memories from trips on here.you will always get someone telling you it was 2.5 miles further than you said,and the sand was not as sandy as they remember it in that exact spot in the desert.
Keep it up Laurence !!
Kenny.
sgt major roadworks:
I will just point out, This is why people wont post there memoirs on here you get a guy who has done as much as most or more who knows ? but more to the point who cares ? his stories were and are still entertaining and is one of the few to have his stories recorded for the future in print. I personally enjoy reading his thread and hope to carry on enjoying. If he comes back on here ?
This is why I dont put my memories from trips on here.you will always get someone telling you it was 2.5 miles further than you said,and the sand was not as sandy as they remember it in that exact spot in the desert.Keep it up Laurence !!
Kenny.
Spot on and well said, sgt major.
Ossie
OssieD:
sgt major roadworks:
I will just point out, This is why people wont post there memoirs on here you get a guy who has done as much as most or more who knows ? but more to the point who cares ? his stories were and are still entertaining and is one of the few to have his stories recorded for the future in print. I personally enjoy reading his thread and hope to carry on enjoying. If he comes back on here ?
This is why I dont put my memories from trips on here.you will always get someone telling you it was 2.5 miles further than you said,and the sand was not as sandy as they remember it in that exact spot in the desert.Keep it up Laurence !!
Kenny.
Spot on and well said, sgt major.
Ossie
Hullo Kenny,
You are quite right, both you and sgt.major roadworks in what you say, But I think that if you look back at what Rita said ( and he really has done more than many of us) was not a condemnation of Laurence. Rather it was a remark directed at those who were almost canonizing the man. Yes of course his recordings of his journeys were very good, it was just that he took the time and had the ability to convey them in writing to an audience. As Rita also pointed out there are others that have done the same and in many cases more, but are not able to convey their experieces in this manner.
Cheers, Archie.
Exactly the point Archie,why dont others see it this way,thank you
Roger
Roger i certainly don’t feel insulted by you can’t speak for others though As i have said before on here i have the greatest respect for all of you that did the job. I just feel as others do that when you start this bickering we all loose out cos instead of posting the the interesting stuff in ends up in a slanging match.Also as someone else said it stops people wanting to post their memories.
As you said yourself your lots of guys are no longer with us so do’nt stop the ones that are sharing their experiences.