And just to add !! You’re only new yourself, you where asking if it was right if you should be expected to drive a bin wagon or summat not long ago, go release your testosterone somewhere else and come back whe you can be more civil to other posters !!
matt f:
there is a new and wannabe forum for the likes of you
Don’t wanna get drawn into an argument here but, that’s a little unfair don’t you think?
We’ve all got to start somewhere, I got my “C” less than a week ago 
To be fair though joe, talking like that for little or no reason’s gonna get you little respect, especially from someone who drives a monster compared to your pushbike. Keep your head down mate and you’ll find people on here more welcoming 
Well TBH he has started to annoy me with the little bits trying to annoy me, i just bit i think. 
Joe…don’t let it get to you, it’s how bully’s operate mate
I also heard about the plans for the hard shoulder scheme going nationwide on the radio today. It was reported that the M42 “experiment” has been considered a raging success and it WILL be extended to other motorways soon (although I didn’t catch the proposed timescale). Apparently, there will be emergency refuges built “every 500 yards or so”.
If it eases congestion (for the most part) and it’s proved to be safe, then I’m all for it personally.
Matt & Joe
chill out before this gets into personal attacks ( and gets edited)
JoeG:
Well TBH he has started to annoy me with the little bits trying to annoy me, i just bit i think.
yeah, fair do’s. I don’t know what’s gone on previously tbh but it doesn’t matter where you go, you’ll always find someone you don’t get on with.
Back to the original subject, the hard shoulder thing does seem to work as has been said, I assume they close it if someone stops for whatever reason.
I do feel though, if speed wasn’t such an issue traffic would flow smoother;
What happens on a dual carriageway when one lorry overtakes another slowly - everyone waits and a queue forms which takes time to clear.
imagine if you were allowed 10mph over the limit to overtake (difficult to enforce I guess) and speed limits were increased to 80mph for cars on motorways lorries staying at 60mph unless overtaking with 50 - 60 on dual carriageways in the same respect. They’d need to be strict to make it work properly but that bit extra so you were past quicker, surely it’d help?
JUST A POINT over here in Germany WE USE ON CERTAIN
autobahns the HARD SHOULDER, however the germans
have put in place along the route where this is carried out
cameras and overhead motoway signs that direct the traffic
when a vehicle breaksdown and uses the hard shoulder to
stop on, then driveing on the hardshoulder is then stopped
and up to now we have not had any problems,
brit pete:
JUST A POINT over here in Germany WE USE ON CERTAIN
autobahns the HARD SHOULDER, however the germans
have put in place along the route where this is carried out
cameras and overhead motoway signs that direct the traffic
when a vehicle breaksdown and uses the hard shoulder to
stop on, then driveing on the hardshoulder is then stopped
and up to now we have not had any problems,
Thats the very same thing we have on the M42 , not bad aint it 
darkseeker:
I do feel though, if speed wasn’t such an issue traffic would flow smoother;
Hey you’re not alone !! The government actually reckon the slower we all go the quicker we’ll get there. I went to work at 4.30 am the other morning and i done 20mph all the way for 10 miles. It took me longer, maybe i missed some bits out of the statement i heard !!!
lol, I doubt I’m alone. Bet nearly everyone reading this is thinking the same!
Besides, the sooner you get to where you’re going, the sooner you’re off the roads! Not many people drive somewhere just to be driving that perticular road. do they!?
p*** ups, brewerys Hmmm 
The point here is that, in heavy traffic, if everyone drives at the same speed, then everyone does tend to get there faster on average. Without the speed restrictions, you get people dodging in and out of lanes, and this causes traffic jam waves as people have to brake to avoid collisions, and as everyone is always following much too close, these overbrakings escalate into a full-blown traffic jam.
Of course, if we could solve the problem of people following too close, then the issue would go away. Any ideas on how to do that? 
that hard shoulder is essential…at the moment the m42 is a novelty and is heavily monitored…what will happen after a few years of this bits open for hard shoulder running,tbut that bit isn’t ok to use.
there’s an example been mentioned…m6 n/b 4-5 gets hard shoulder running…than jct 5 to spaghetti doesn’t (flyover section-nowhere to put refuges)and spaghetti upto the m5 junction doesn’t(because the vosa/plod/ha compound needs protecting) then jct 8/9-10 gets hard shoulder running.
there are plenty of people out there who can’t figure out what they are supposed to do now never mind trying to let them figure out where they can and can’t use the hard shoulder…plenty of people run down the m42 hard shoulder now and then realise after a mile or so that it’s not open…i hate doing breakdowns there now unless they are in a refuge.
Mike-C:
The government actually reckon the slower we all go the quicker we’ll get there. I went to work at 4.30 am the other morning and i done 20mph all the way for 10 miles. It took me longer, maybe i missed some bits out of the statement i heard !!!
Not that I’m one to defend the government 
(or any politician come to that ) but there is some truth in it.
It won’t work at 04.30 but it does at 08.30. The problem is that too many vehicles are trying to get through a point on the motorway that can’t handle the volume of traffic.
If you slow everyone down a bit ( and lets face it 50 is not much lower than most limiters these days) and it is enforced so Mondeoman, BMWman and white van man know they will get a bill in the post, then traffic flow is better. 
Example.
When approaching a lane closure, why do many truck drivers block the lane that is closing. To stop the arrogant gits who think they have a divine right to zoom past everyone. Why, because if they merged into the open lanes early everyone would slow a bit, but you also flow better.
Example
If you send water down a pipe and that pipe narrows, then all the water molecules slow down to the same speed and flow together and come out faster the other side. That is because water molecules don’t drive BMW’s and white vans.
I can see how the system worked on the M42 and how it could work on the M25 because both motorways have endless gantries to provide lane instructions.
However on motorways like the M1, M6 and M40 I cannot see how it’ll work safely. It’s rushour, you have 4 active lanes including the hardshoulder and it’s at least 2miles between gantries however can easily be upto 6 miles etc. A car breaks down in the nearside lane, that lane is now blocked and drivers upto 2 miles back have no idea, so the lane jams and then the next lane as drivers move over and the next and you end up with gridlock.
Then there’s the accident, if all lanes are busy and there’s a smack you could potentially end up with 2miles of traffic blocking all 4 lanes and no route for the emergency services to get to the scene.
Then the idea of refuge areas I don’t see how it works, car’s dont break down when you want they do it when they want and if there’s no refuge area you’ll have to ditch it on the inside lane, if there’s no gantry to warn traffic behind you you’ve potentially got 70mph cars headed straight for a broken down vehicle. Then there’s the problem with the morons who don’t know when the hard shoulder is active, you see them on the M42 doing it all the time, big red X over the hard shoulder or no signs on at all (meaning not active) and they still dart up the hard shoulder like it’s allowed, and even undertake you approaching upto a mile before approaching sliproads, god help the broken down car that happens to be there when they jump onto the hard shoulder at 70mph from behind you without seeing it.
The only way around it is to install gantries at much more frequent intervals, but on motoways like the M1/M5/M6/M40 this would take decades, cost billions and cause unbelievable congestion during the 20years it’d take to build them.
" Not sure about the M42 test coming to an end. I thought i heard announced on the radio today that the scheme is being applied to more motorways like the M6 etc…? Did i hear wrong? "
Right:
All I can say is.
I have found memories of being stationary on the section of the M42 now covered by the active control system before the test began, especially at peak times,
The Jams were Horrendous ( you could actually take a break while waiting to move again)
I hate to say this:
But the system WORKS, and now its actually a USEFUL piece of motorway.
( OK at the werse times it slow moving, but quote “moving” )
Im in favour of the active control system (& 4 lane running) being extended to other motorways,.
PS:
In my view there are only 2 things wrong with the system
- the signs should display a signal at all times
i.e when the route is clear, NOT JUST BE SWITCHED OFF.
Examples of suitable mesages
i) The national speed limit icon
ii) A smily face { after all were happy to be moving }
- lower speed limits (ie below 40 MPH) should be enforcible
i.e for example. 30, 20 MPH
regards 2xQ
& PPS, yes you didnt hear wrong. on the radio it was annouced,
" Active Traffic Control System to be extended nation wide "
i aint seen any problems caused by the hard shoulder running scheme
for those who havnt been in it effectivley the shoulder is a long on / off ramp
" effectivley the shoulder is a long on / off ramp "
Yes, as a frequent user of the ATCS section of the M42
I could not fail to notice this modification to the 4th lane policy.
regards 2xQ
PPS late start this morning
( Wagon load of timber to truck to north wales, give me a wave )
The other motorways to be included will have extra gantys fitted for safe control .The 150 million has to be spent on something .
The only thing that gets on my nerves with that M42 Active system is that at 3 in the morning it will say "que ahead " 
At 3 in the morning , hardly likely .Slow you down to 40 mph way before the roadworks , far too early for 3 in the morning . Then signs working incorrectly and drivers not realising this and slamming their brakes on .For example lane 1 40 mph ,lane 2 20 mph ,lane 3 40 mph . The people in lane 2 slow down to 20 mph and more or less risk a serious accident due to the sign being wrong .
Quite a regular occurence that.
I use the traffic management section of the M42 (northbound) a couple of times a week in the early hours, usually between midnight and 01:00, and would go as far as describing it as traffic mismanagement, I’ve been reduced to 40 mph for no reason and often see the gantry signs reducing traffic to 20 mph again for no apparent reason.
On the whole I think the system is a good idea and is capable of keeping the traffic moving even when busy, but it’s far from perfect, the people who manage this section of motorway at night need better training, there are road works going on at the moment on the northbound carriageway, but with the amount of cameras and gantry signs on this section of motorway it should be possible to manage the traffic more efficiently, sometimes on the northbound carriageway in the early hours when it’s quiet it seems as though some-one is having a laugh at the motorists expense, in my view it really is managed in an appalling manner 
Have to say though that on my return journey I come down this section of the M42 when it’s really busy and never see any problems, but it seems that if there are any road works when it’s quiet they play around with the traffic movement unnecessarily.
fuse:
the use of m42 ,s hard shoulder is the begining of the end for motorways,and not before time.it is a waste of road space.our country is to overcrouded and small to allow it to go on.the two lane motorways could have outer lane narrowed quite a bit to allow only car use then drop truck speed down to 50 as on duel carrigeways there is 101 things i could think of to allow the complete abandonment of motorways
Motorways will continue to be built and used in this country, they’re an important and necessary part of the private and commercial transport system.