Just been found with 3 somalians in the trailer - HELP?

UK PROFESSIONAL DRIVERS FORUMS EURO DRIVING FORUM (INTERACTIVE)
1

CAN ANYONE SUGGEST A GOOD SCOTTISH LAWYER OR ADVISORY SERVICE FOR FINES CONCERNING ILLEGAL IMMIGRANTS.

WE HAVE JUST BEEN FINED £3000 FOR HAVING THE “PLEASURE” OF HAVING THESE ILLEGALS IN THE TRAILER. OUR VEHICLE AND DRIVERS HAVE BEEN IN A SECURE COMPOUND SINCE 00.40 AND UNTIL WE AGREED TO PAY THE FINE THEY WOULD NOT BE RELEASED. THEY WERE FOUND IN CALAIS AND THE VEHICLE AND DRIVERS WERE BROUGHT TO DOVER TO BE INTERVIEWED.

WE ARE JUST A LITTLE COMPANY AND THIS WILL ■■■■■■■ US COMPLETELY.

ANY ADVICE GRATEFULLY RECEIVED.

JOHN
JPM :angry:

2

Where did your driver ship in from?

and did he check the vehicle before shipping and before disembarking the ferry?

If he went through the normal Calais Checks then you should be able to claim back the fines as you have taken reasonable precautions

if you are a member I would suggest calling the RHA for more help

3

OUR TRUCK HAD PASSED THE CHECK AT THE FRENCH CUSTOMS AT CALAIS AND WAS WHEN THEY WENT THROUGH THE BRITISH CHECK AT CALAIS THE STOWAWAYS WERE DETECTED. WE CANNOT UNDERSTAND HOW THE FRENCH DID NOT PICK IT UP.

THE BRITISH CHECK AT CALAIS THEN SHIPPED THE DRIVERS, UNIT AND TRAILER TO DOVER TO A SECURE COMPOUND WHERE THEY WERE HELD. THE ILLEGALS WERE HELD IN FRANCE.

WE ARE NOT A MEMBER OF EITHER THE RHA OR FTA.

THANKS FOR YOUR QUICK REPLY.

JOHN

4

Sorry to hear of your troubles.

I’m guessing here that it was a soft sided trailer because the Brits don’t usually pull the boxes for a check as their probes don’t work on them very well. The French check for soft sided trucks is rubbish and you can’t rely on it, you have to do your own checks before arriving in Calais. The British one is better which is why they will have detected the stowaways in your truck.

Had you issued any sort of guidelines to your drivers regarding checking for stowaways because if so you can use this in mitigating circumstances?

5

The driver did his final check when he fuelled at IDS at Calais. Unfortunately as he was pulling out from the pumps he had a Willie Betz motor pull out in front of him and block his passage. This is the only time we can assume that there would have been access prior to arriving at the docks. He had checked the trailer after he fuelled.

We have tried on several occasions to open the home office link for the guidelines and codes of practice for clandestine entrants and have continually found the links to be broken. We reported this to the home office yesterday. We wanted this especially for the checklist example so we could provide our drivers with their written checklist and not just a verbal agreement.
If anyone could e mail me with an example I would be really grateful.
Unfortunately due to not having this it was one reason our penalty was imposed.

Why do they not issue those guidelines and codes of practice along with the issue of a standard international operator licence? Surely the two bodies could work together or perhaps no - this is the government we are talking about!!

We have contacted our MSP and will see if he can help.

Thanks to all who have replied.

John
JPM

6

Reading that last post seems as though it was a bit late to start issuing government guidelines after the event.

Calais has been in the news for years, there are hundreds of illegals running around this part, especially an unmanned fuel station. which to them is like a bus stop!

I hate to say it, but it seems you couldnt have been more accomodating to the illegals, if you had given them a leg up into the trailer yourself.

The tacho will show a stop for fuel in calais, which is enough for any prosecution to use that as an excuse.

I know it sounds like i am having a go, Im not, just pointing out the pitfalls :frowning:

7

Crikey :exclamation: What a terrible situation to be in. I can’t offer any useful advice I’m afraid but you sure have my sympathy. Let us know how you go on and sincerely hope it doesn’t break you :confused:

8

i am very sorry to hear about this.
i travel through calais every week and the amount of trailer buddies has decreased dramatically since the end of last year and the closure of sangatte but it still pays to be very cautious.
you do not require the government guidelines or checklist, you can create your own for the same purpose.
start point of journey, trailer inspection carried out after loading, seal number.
any stops on way to port, checked trailer before leaving that stop, resealed etc.
it is the responsibility of the operator to supply the drivers with a check list for a return to the uk.
once supplied then the onus is upon the drivers to use that checklist to carry out the instructions of the employer.
you may want to change your fuel card too, or perhaps get your drivers to fuel up in belgium at steenvorde border the ids.
i am afraid that i cannot help with a good lawyer in scotland but a phone call to another transport company may help.

9

hi jpm.i am not much help but,as i understand it,
there was a 2000pd fine levied for every [wont say it] found in your trailer.now the rha took this to court to challenge the british governments attempt to make immigration officers out of the average driver.
they lost the first time,appealed it,and lost again.
its my understanding that you are not resposible,however,you would be better getting on to the rha making all apologies for not being a member,new starter etc,they will at least know solicitors who are fimiliar with this,no point in asking your local one whos better with divorce and property proccedings,good luck in you plight,with the british authorities,its difficult,every one on the ground,customs,immigration seem to make the rules up as they go.
or get a solicitor in dover,most of these guys should be aware,os else ask them can you keep the 3 refugees?at least you could subcontract them to some local builder.could"nt avoid that.sorry.

10

I don’t get it, or I missed something.
If the illegals didn’t get to the UK, how come you and your drivers are being done? I thought that at least half of the reason for having the UK Immigration in Calais, was to stop the illegals getting into the UK, by having the UK checks done in Calais.

For future crossings you don’t actually need the RHA check-list. A home made check-list with all the necessary points on it and the company logo, will do. The check-list needs to be in two parts. The first part is for checking/completion at the loading point. It needs to have check points for:-
Who checked the load. Customer or driver
who sealed the trailer, customer or driver. Seal Number
Who locked the trailer. Padlock Number.
Roof checked (internally or externally?)?

It also needs to have Veh reg, trailer number, drivers name, date, time, signature etc for that check.
The second part is for checking and completion just before embarking onto the boat and a set of check boxes for just before disembarkation. It needs checkboxes for:-
Padlock checked?
Seal checked?
Seal/padlock number checked?
Curtains checked?
TIR cord checked?
Roof checked?
Under vehicle spaces checked?

This part of your check-list also needs to be dated, timed, signed and a translation of the signature.
This list is from memory, so I might have missed some, but you will get the idea and fill in some. Other drivers might be able to fill in any I’ve missed.
The main point, from now on, is that EVERY load which comes into the country MUST come in with a completed check-list. You need to keep the checklists with the paperwork for the loads so that, if you get caught out again, you have some proof that every load is checked. You are therefore in the habit of taking reasonable precautions against illegal immigrants. When I say you, I mean your company and your drivers. It isn’t a “Get out of jail, free card”. Each case is tested on its individual merits, they say. Having this “proof” of reasonable precautions, is a definite point in your favour. You need to ensure that checklists are completed for each load and kept. Its no good turning up with some just completed and back-dated checklists. If they like, they can do tests which can show how long ago the ink was exposed to air. Not that I’m suggesting that you would contemplate such a thing of course.

Best of luck with whatever comes next, in dealing with this problem.

11

Thanks guys for all your advice it is much appreciated. We have contacted our MSP who has written to the home office on our behalf. We are going to appeal. Now whether that will work who knows but we will certainly try.

The thing i find funny is that we actually tried toget stowaway insurance and couldnt get it as the company said due to the change in policy and laws no one actually wanted it. We did!!! Wish we had!!!

I will keep posting with updates to let you know what happens but thanks again.

A great site this is for people who need advice and will be highly recommended by me to all my mates. I tried a similar site and found it hopeless.

Thanks again

John

12

john,

you may be interested in an article in commercial motor about 3 weeks ago, reference the fines and the ability to pay, it says that a law firm in chester has won a court ruling that any fines levied on either a company or it’s drivers must be affordable by that party, it goes on to say that it is clearly ridiculous that a driver who earns £300 per week should be fined the sum of £17,000.

tim culpin of Chester law firm Aaron & partners won the ruling on behalf of Loane transport and it’s driver.

13

I remembered to bring a copy of the checklist home with me this time.

You will obviously need to make it up yourself, but the main thing is to ahve all the points to be checked on it. As far as I am aware, it doesn’t need to be a copy of the actual RHA checklist (Murfitts made up their own one anyway)

At the top you need :- Company name, Drivers name, Vehicle reg, date.

After Loading checklist :-
Vehicle checked after loading by driver/consignor - yes/no
Vehicle sealed/locked by driver/consignor - yes/no
Seal number recorded - yes/no
padlock serial number recorded - yes/no

followed by :- signature, print name, date, time.

Then the Prior to Embarkation checklist :-
Seal checked for tampering - yes/no
Seal number checked - yes/no
Padlock checked for tampering - yes/no
Padlock number checked - yes/no
TIR seal and cord checked for tampering - yes/no
Outer shell/fabric of vehicle & trailer checked for signs of damage - yes/no
Roof checked for damage - Externally/Internally - yes/no
External storage spaces, tool boxes, wind deflectors checked yes/no
Below vehicle storage recesses checked - yes/no

followed by :- signature, print name, date, time.

There is also a comments box for writing reasons for non-compliance to checklist in etc. I use it for adding CO2 check stamps and mentioning things like, a security personel check and that I have also done a “Prior to diembarkation” check along with anything else I can think of which would have a bearing on my load security, like a “first thing in the morning” check on a run of several days.
If I was making up my own checklist, I would add an extra column of yes/no for a “prior to disembarkation” check. I would also add a line about a CO2 check with space for the stamp. It would have the company logo at the top as well. If I was only running my own wagon, or a very small fleet, I would also print the reg in, leaving just drivers name and date to be filled in.

Where there is an option, like driver/consignor, then the driver strikes out the invalid option. I never use a padlock for eg (I think that they just attract attention, so my curtains will get slashed to see what needs locking up) so I always strike out yes to the questions concerning padlocks.

I know this is too late for you now, but if you use it from now on it should help if any other problems occur.

14

cheers mate. I will certainly be using this from now on. Should have word from MP this week on how things are progressing so will post an update as soon as.

Thanks all for your advice. It was much appreciated. Once again can I say top site!!! :smiley:

15

No problem at all mate :laughing: , of course you can say itl, we’re happy to help.

16

Simon:
I don’t get it, or I missed something.
If the illegals didn’t get to the UK, how come you and your drivers are being done? I thought that at least half of the reason for having the UK Immigration in Calais, was to stop the illegals getting into the UK, by having the UK checks done in Calais.

The UK Immigration checks in Calais port are “after” passport control so the vehicle is effectively in UK.

I once had my cab broken into on the Shuttle leaving Folkstone, it could only have happened on the English side of the channel, but I had to report the theft to the French police! :confused: