newmercman:
They don’t have an easy life in Italy either, my Italian is a bit rusty (no pun intended ) but I’m sure the phrase “I think that’s enough weight on there” doesn’t exist
i was in brescia this weekend, there was a truck show on, and me and a friend got chatting to a guy with a restored fiat, he was saying his first truck (which he still has) was an 8 wheeler fiat with 4 axle trailer, regularly loaded up to 50 odd tonnes, every 100km or so he would blow a tyre out! ill get a couple of pics from the weekend up on here as there was a turbostar in the show as well as a couple in the parking area
Had one on demo in 88, excellent drivers motor way ahead of it,s time then in cab space and comfort,but too many things to go wrong on elec side some of which were unnecessary for the time, such as elec mirror wipers and windscreen blinds
pete359:
when i see a turbostar pulling a bulker,i always think of the first one i ever saw,1984 on the north circular at hanger lane,mettallic blue,crofton-sleigh? bulk haulage from norfolk area?
Yep that was Robert & Mark Crofton-Sleigh bulk haulage, the truck you refer to was a 190.42 and registered B575 TEX
Hello all, lovely drop of rain today. [ZB] anorak, good question, I will try to answer it for you. Unic started with V8 engines back in the 60s with the “little” 225hp fitted to the Izoard and Galibier range. The arrival of the 340hp 14.8litre in 1969 was pretty sensational, but Vendammes team were rightly looking ahead. Being a major part of the Fiat Group they had access to both funding and engineering expertise. If the 340 had a weak spot fuel consumption, and longlevity could be questionable. The former could be attributable to driver exuberience, with such a powerful and delightfully free reving unit, the latter , the bain of “smaller” V configuration engines. Berliet had to suffer greatly with their earlier V8, before recasting as the 08. 35. 30. 16litre, @330hp, and getting power good fuel, and reliability. The problems of our own AEC V8 are well documented. Saviem had just introduced the SM340, with MANs 16litre V8, so the competition was getting back ground. Scania were causing concern to French manufacturers, imported by the Samyns family, from 1960, by 1975 when importation was taken over by the “factory” over 1500 units had been sold. Volvo were also making significant gains in (during the 70s), stagnating French lorry market. The two Scandanavians had an estimated total production capability of around 50.000 units so were making every major lorry manufacturer take notice, particularly as in the 70s there were roumers that they may merge! The thinking at Bourbon Lancy was for a new V8, of between 17/18litres, capable of c360/500hp in naturally aspirated form. Turin was in agreement, but design work was carried out jointly at Bourbon Lancy, Fourchambault, Turin and Trappes. Then centred on Turin, for Unic was to have a new role. 1975 saw the creation of the Industrial Vehicles Corporation, IVECO. An inward investment c70,000,000 French Francs, saw the two engine plants become the main Iveco plant for the 8210 series, 260hp inline 6cylinder 13.798litre. In the much later TurboStar this engine would show 420hp. Turin would produce the Franco Italian designed 17.2litre 8280 V8 at350 to 420hp. Trappes would become a medium and heavy assembly plant 6 to 40tonnes,as would IVECOs home at Turin, Brescia, the former OM factory would produce medium range 6 to 17tonne, and the “problem child” Ulm, specialised off road, and medium. With IVECO the Italians took the best of its talent wherever in the organisation it lay, and really developed their expertise, pity that Lord Stokes chose a different path. So the 8280 is really an Iveco colaboration, but Unic afficianadoes will always see its French credentials. Cheerio for now.
Saviem:
saw the two engine plants become the main Iveco plant for the 8210 series, 260hp inline 6cylinder 13.798litre. In the much later TurboStar this engine would show 420hp.
Would that be Eurostar @ 420hp? I’ve owned a good few Turbostars and been all over Europe in them and in that time only seen them badged at 33, 36 & (in the last years of the Turbostar) 38. The only 420 Turbostar to my certain knowledge was the early V8 prior to 1990 when the V8 was uprated to 480.
Love the history though, I’m a big fan of the French trucks and had no idea of the heritage of the V8 Fiat lump, thanks.
Thanks for that bit of history- another thing I didn’t know before but I do now! I had a look at some pictures of the two engines and could not fathom how they could be made from the same castings. It is nice to know that the spirit of Unic was to survive in the new Iveco engines. The last time I was in Italy (about 15 years ago), there were loads of six wheel Fiat/Iveco tippers about, V8 naturally aspirated engines, minimal silencing- what a glorious racket they made. I hope there are still some there.
Incidentally, you may know that Unic and Saviem quoted SAE power, so their 340s were only 304hp DIN- at least the MAN engine in the SM340 was, the Germans having used it in their 19.304 model. Commercial Motor, when it was written by people with a passing interest in matters technical, estimated this to be equal to about 282bhp net.
The only chances I ever got to drive an Iveco Turbostar were when I worked at Swifts in Northampton and we would have a rented unit and mine was in the workshops etc and I loved every second of it every time. There was something unique about them, the same smell in ever cab (unless some dirty git had been in it before), the power was out of this world, we had no limiters back then and when you put your foot into it it was amazing. We would run to Wakefield and back on night trunk most nights with 3 or 4 of us and in an Iveco I left the rest standing. I did once get to well off the clock with a flat bed loaded with Rockware glass and chickened out because it still had more left
I really loved those trucks and when Swifts anounced they were so impressed they were buying some I was over the moon, unfortunately they bought 4 and sent them to other depots
I can well believe that Pat, my 48 used to run at 1300rpm at 60mph, my Dad followed me up the A2 when I coming back solo from Abingdon after I had the Eminox fitted, he was in his car. I was at the lights at the M25 roundabout with my Dad behind me and I started off in high range crawler and nailed it, we got up to around 80mph before my Dad caught me and he was in a 416GTI Rover, I then drag raced him side by side until I maxed out and the Rover speedo was showing just over the ton
Now top speed is more down to gearing than anything else, a 13 speed Fuller has a top gear ratio of 0:74, with 3:55 rear axle ratios and 315/80s any truck will do over a ton if you can rev it high enough, I had a 1735 Merc that was just as fast, in fact it was so fast the mirrors used to fold back against the doors with an almighty bang about 200rpm after it went off the clock (so I’m told ) The thing with the V8 Turbostars is the way they pulled, especially when you consider how high geared they were.
Coming up from Susa on the pre Autostrada road, I used to have to brake for the bends and it was the only thing I ever went up there in that never had me in low range and I had 142s and 143s before that and they’re not known for being sluggish
Those big Italian V8s are an animal of an engine, just a shame that FIAT had such a poor reputation and hardly anybody bought them, if they did the big Scania would not be held in such high regard
newmercman:
I can well believe that Pat, my 48 used to run at 1300rpm at 60mph, my Dad followed me up the A2 when I coming back solo from Abingdon after I had the Eminox fitted, he was in his car. I was at the lights at the M25 roundabout with my Dad behind me and I started off in high range crawler and nailed it, we got up to around 80mph before my Dad caught me and he was in a 416GTI Rover, I then drag raced him side by side until I maxed out and the Rover speedo was showing just over the ton
Now top speed is more down to gearing than anything else, a 13 speed Fuller has a top gear ratio of 0:74, with 3:55 rear axle ratios and 315/80s any truck will do over a ton if you can rev it high enough, I had a 1735 Merc that was just as fast, in fact it was so fast the mirrors used to fold back against the doors with an almighty bang about 200rpm after it went off the clock (so I’m told ) The thing with the V8 Turbostars is the way they pulled, especially when you consider how high geared they were.
Coming up from Susa on the pre Autostrada road, I used to have to brake for the bends and it was the only thing I ever went up there in that never had me in low range and I had 142s and 143s before that and they’re not known for being sluggish
Those big Italian V8s are an animal of an engine, just a shame that FIAT had such a poor reputation and hardly anybody bought them, if they did the big Scania would not be held in such high regard
Was that Merc the orange one that I once tried to keep up with in my Iveco 190.36 on a Saturday afternoon going solo from Carisio to Santia when we were weekended once?
Graham, you’ve got it, that orange flying machine, that thing could bloody shift
[zb] anorak, there wasn’t much in it really, like any big and powerful mechanical fuel pump engine, a heavy right boot could bring tears to your eyes at a fuel pump Driven sensibly (with my road tester head on) I reckon the Scania would just edge it, but in my experience it was six of one, half a dozen of the other
) but I’m sure the phrase “I think that’s enough weight on there” doesn’t exist
Driven sensibly (with my road tester head on) I reckon the Scania would just edge it, but in my experience it was six of one, half a dozen of the other