I don’t think the Tories are going to hold on for long - if Hammond is serious about raising taxes instead of completing brexit, and getting his hands on the “Brexit Dividend”…
Winseer:
I don’t think the Tories are going to hold on for long - if Hammond is serious about raising taxes instead of completing brexit, and getting his hands on the “Brexit Dividend”…
“Brexit Dividend”…
I love it when little kids talk about fairy tales, but when we have a Chancellor relying on the bag of gold we`ll find at the end of the rainbow…
Franglais:
“Brexit Dividend”…I love it when little kids talk about fairy tales, but when we have a Chancellor relying on the bag of gold we`ll find at the end of the rainbow…
It’s so much better to go on imposing austerity at home while sending our cash to be spent in Europe.On that note it seems strange why Airbus would threaten Brit jobs over Brexit while being happy to base production facilities in USA,Mexico,China,Australia and New Zealand.So tell us what ‘contributions’ and sovereignty do those all have to give up to Juncker’s rabble for the privilege of having Airbus jobs in their countries and why the double standards in our case. 
While if we had a PM with balls we’d tell Airbus to zb off and then impose an import ban on all further Airbus products including spare parts and force BA to use Boeing or nothing.Oh wait.
I’m gobsmacked that there are still so many out there that believe we’re not giving much money to the EU.
100m per week, 350m per week or 999m per week - even if one uses “minimums” and “best case scenarios” then there WILL be a “Brexit Dividend” - defined as the money we stop paying Brussels, and keep for ourselves in the UK.
U would say that there are rather too many remainers out there that only persist at “Remain” at this point - because they don’t like the idea of the Tories getting their mits on that money before Labour can.
Labour, however - are not really chasing the money themselves, which of course leads people like me to believe that they are not serious about Brexit, and will drop it on the spot if the EU asks them nicely enough, upon Labour winning any power.
Basically, we’ve voted for something that we don’t actually have a party to implement.
If Brexit is to be overturned, then I might be persuaded as a ■■■■■■■■ Brexiteer to “accept that doctored result” If… IF… BOTH houses of Parliament are disbanded for being totally useless in our time. If we’re gonna be a dictatorship from all this ‘ignoring of democracy’ - then it just needs to NOT be a “Parliamentary” one.
Winseer:
I’m gobsmacked that there are still so many out there that believe we’re not giving much money to the EU.Basically, we’ve voted for something that we don’t actually have a party to implement.
As it stands all of Europe is now in a struggle between Nationalism v Soviet style Socialism allied with Conservative style Federalism/Globalism.With no way of knowing which will eventually win out.
On that note ironically I could foresee a situation in which being part of a Nationalist Confederal Europe,in which we replace the anti nation state Parliamentary rabble,with PR elected Nationalist MEP’s,would actually be more advantageous to ‘Brexiteers’.While suddenly a Socialist/Globalist UK then becomes the default choice of the Remain vote.IE the result has now been hijacked by the establishment to provide it with a convenient exit strategy only to be implemented if Europe actually succeeds in turning against the Soviet Socialist and Federalist/Globalist alliance agenda.The fact that ‘Brexit’ at present seems to just consist of wiping out our UKIP type presence in the EU parliament,while keeping us tied to the EU in all other respects,just confirms that.While it’s equally easy to foresee a situation in which the LabLibDemCon remain alliance at home suddenly says that they now want to distance themselves from a Europe turned Nationalist assuming that Orban’s East Euro allies and the AfD and FN all eventually finally win out to add to the Italian and Slovene upsets. 
Nationalism will only win out if the Police and the Army are on the side of the people.
If our government starts handing our honours to mid-ranking armed forces personnel like they were “Muttley’s Medals” - then they might be able to buy the Public’s last line of defence off the nation on the cheap…
Winseer:
Nationalism will only win out if the Police and the Army are on the side of the people.If our government starts handing our honours to mid-ranking armed forces personnel like they were “Muttley’s Medals” - then they might be able to buy the Public’s last line of defence off the nation
The flaw in that plan being that the forces will eventually have to be subject to foreign Federal rule as in the case of PESCO and will then have to choose who they actually serve the EU or UK.While being deliberately starved of resources on the grounds that the Federation won’t want to allow any particular state to be stronger militarily than the Federation’s forces as a whole.Maybe with the exception of Germany.Bearing in mind how fast circumstances can change in that regard.As recently as the Yugoslav JNA having to choose which side they were on and then turning from a similarly inspired Federal force back to National militias loyal to their own states virtually over night.IE there’s no reason to think that the same split and having to choose loyalties won’t apply just the same among military personnel as the general public.
It’s just unbelievable how the head of state and ultimate command of the forces is allowing this obvious and inevitable situation to develop. 
As opposed to HM nipping it in the bud now by calling the EU the threat to national security that it is and then ordering the military to deal with the remain agenda accordingly.
The Military want their pound of flesh of Hammond’s 20bn giveaway to the NHS, that hasn’t been raised as of yet.
Now we have £40bn to raise… That’s 16p on income tax - or even the combined Brexit Dividend (£18bn per year) PLUS the Cancelled foreign aid budged (£12bn per year) would still leave us some £10bn per year short.
As the main reason that working people vote Tory in the first place is for “lower” if not “not higher” taxes - I think we can safely kiss the Conservatives chances at the next election goodbye - the moment they even raise taxes by 2p in the pound, let along double digits!
I remember back in 1992 when in the aftermath of “Black Wednesday”, the Bank of England, under the direction of the Excheqeur and the “First Lord of the Treasury” threw away some £1bn of taxpayer’s money straight into the pocket of none other than George Soros…
This caused some resentment, but it was the interest rates going up to “House Repossession” levels that really drove the voters away - but this was in the period 1992-1994, when the housing market bottomed out, long term as it turned out.
By 1997, the result of the next election was a foregone conclusion. Tony Blair had taken Labour to the Right of “center left”, and crushed the Tories in the 1997 election.
We’re still paying the price for the Tories dropping the ball so badly as they did then, as we surely wouldn’t have had the immigration/Islamic State/Unwanted Foreign Wars/stagnant pay/credit crunch/austerity situation we have now suffered for over a decade - IF the Tories could have just got off their daft policies of “EU appeasement” in the FIRST place.
We wouldn’t even had had a referendum - as public resentment would never have got high enough to have ever warranted one! 
So… This Autumn - if Hammond raises taxes, the Tories have thrown the next election in advance, just like Major and co did from late 1992… Took another 5 years, as the Tories had unexpectedly stayed in power at the previous election less than a year earlier - but the comparison is there.
I suspect the 1922 committee might step in after the event, - but by this point, you could suddenly see Labour “vote through” Hammond’s “Tory Trashing” Budget, and by that point - it will be too late for even Moggs to take over. The public, especially the Lefties would accept a clear “political move” by Labour to “approve” this tax-raising budget, - because they know it will bring the government down!
The snap election would then be siezed upon as being the “2nd referendum” the Lefties and Remainers both want - and us Right-thinking folk will be forced back underground again for the remainder of our days… Unless we can stop it by fair means or foul in the meantime.
I await with interest the “propaganda results” of the returning Football fans from Russia, once this world cup is over.
Any “Non Committals” or “disenchancted” football fans - might well be shifting sharply to the RIght, should say, England end up playing Russia in the final - regardless of the result.
I’m not going to place any hopes of any football fans being “Lefties” - because I cannot imagine them being able to avoid a punch-up - with their fellow England fans! 
Winseer:
We’re still paying the price for the Tories dropping the ball so badly as they did then, as we surely wouldn’t have had the immigration/Islamic State/Unwanted Foreign Wars/stagnant pay/credit crunch/austerity situation we have now suffered for over a decade
Why do you think that? Net immigration was at a record high already under Major, being generally about 100k a year. It was generally twice as high under Blair, but you wouldn’t say it was small under the Tories. It’s also at a record high now under the Tories (including the non-EU component which they control, and isn’t mainly comprised of asylum seekers or refugees).
And the Tories have proved to be just as militant as Blair - making a hash in Libya, in Syria, and so on. It’s only the overwhelming resistance of the population to more outright war that has really constrained the Tories (and, surely, the example of Blair, who is still hectored as a war criminal), who have clearly itched for it several times.
Why this need to invite our former and now decimated enemies over here to “get their own back”■■?
I never understood that. 
Winseer:
Why this need to invite our former and now decimated enemies over here to “get their own back”■■?I never understood that.
Probably for the same reason that radical Islam is supposedly an enemy and a threat but the Wahabbist Saudis and the Hanafist Pakistanis are our allies and friends with Islamic revolutionary Iran somewhere in between.
While if it looks like the Kalergi plan in action it probably is.
It will be interesting to see what the England fans have to say when they return from Russia…
How many of you got killed/duffed over by this new “Enemy” we were told by our establishment to make of Russia?
How long to we have to wait until the Next Islamic State nutter on benefits already here - gets lucky enough to kill some more Home-grown UK citizens?
I don’t think that the Champagne Socialists are putting up many “refugees” in their own mansions all the while, mind…
Are there any historians out there who know the last time the Russian State actually managed to directly and deliberately kill a British born Citizen was?
I’d vote the same as I did the first time.
I too would vote again for Brexit, and i’d once again vote no to the common market, as i did in 1975.
I didn’t vote Tory in the last general election, nor umpteen before that because they are not Conservative and haven’t been for 20 odd years, and the way things stand with the Tory leadership proving themselves to be the most treacherous bunch we’ve seen in quite some time (actually making Blair look fair and decent, which takes some doing ), then unless the few real Conservatives left stand up and do the decent thing and bring down the PM, and then replace her with a patriot of integrity prepared to carry out the wishes of the people, the Tory party are finished, cheerio, good riddance.
If Farage gets back on the horse - I’d be quite happy to switch back to UKIP for the next election…
Migrating voters would be the key to the next election result:
Some Labour voters - the ones that don’t like Corbyn’s version of labour - might switch to UKIP if they are Brexiteers, and Libdems if they are Remainers. Net result Labour lose seats to both the Libdems and UKIP.
Some Tory voters - the ones that are Brexiteers and/or Right Wingers - will almost certainlly switch to UKIP, as there is no desire for a Left or Center vision of Un-Brexit otherwise. Net result: Tory lose voters to UKIP.
Some Libdem voters that voted Leave - now realize that Libdems are ONLY for Remain, and no longer represent them. They, too - should only be switching to UKIP as a “Net result”.
Some SNP voters, already ■■■■■■ off at Labour, Tory, and Libdems - can only go to UKIP - especially if they voted “Better Together” in the SCOTTISH referendum.
Some people that either didn’t vote last time, or couldn’t vote last time - have got the choice of a Remain party, a Remain Party, a Hard Remain Party, or a Pretend Brexit (Remain) party. Chances are - they’ll consider voting UKIP as well then.
NONE of the above groups of people - will be picked up by any “opinion polls” - except perhaps an Exit poll on election day itself.
Therefore I suggest the result of the next election is a LOT harder to predict than the last one, where UKIP lost voters in droves - by the mainstream parties “pretending” to pander to parts of UKIP’s policies…
Winseer:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S78QK-E8dSkhttps://www.youtube.com/watch?v=S78QK-E8dSk
If Farage gets back on the horse - I’d be quite happy to switch back to UKIP for the next election…Migrating voters would be the key to the next election result:
Some Labour voters - the ones that don’t like Corbyn’s version of labour - might switch to UKIP if they are Brexiteers, and Libdems if they are Remainers. Net result Labour lose seats to both the Libdems and UKIP.
Some Tory voters - the ones that are Brexiteers and/or Right Wingers - will almost certainlly switch to UKIP, as there is no desire for a Left or Center vision of Un-Brexit otherwise. Net result: Tory lose voters to UKIP.
Some Libdem voters that voted Leave - now realize that Libdems are ONLY for Remain, and no longer represent them. They, too - should only be switching to UKIP as a “Net result”.
Some SNP voters, already ■■■■■■ off at Labour, Tory, and Libdems - can only go to UKIP - especially if they voted “Better Together” in the SCOTTISH referendum.
Some people that either didn’t vote last time, or couldn’t vote last time - have got the choice of a Remain party, a Remain Party, a Hard Remain Party, or a Pretend Brexit (Remain) party. Chances are - they’ll consider voting UKIP as well then.
NONE of the above groups of people - will be picked up by any “opinion polls” - except perhaps an Exit poll on election day itself.
Therefore I suggest the result of the next election is a LOT harder to predict than the last one, where UKIP lost voters in droves - by the mainstream parties “pretending” to pander to parts of UKIP’s policies…
Firstly Gerard Batten is a better leader for UKIP than Farage ever was.The proof being that,unlike Farage,Batten never trusted May at any point and it’s only because,also unlike Farage,Batten didn’t give up and stepped up to the mark that UKIP even still exists as a credible force.In addition to the fact that Batten isn’t soft on the Islamic issue.
While the Cons are undoubtedly a remain Party as would be expected of an ideologically Federalist rabble having more in common with the LibDims than UKIP.As shown by their willingness to enter into a co alition with the LibDems but never UKIP.
As for the next election we can probably safely predict another hung parliament but an increased majority for Corbyn.The Brits really are just too bleedin stupid to vote any other way.
Farage doesn’t have to be the actual “Leader”, taking over from Batten - he could go in as a “Running Mate” - squaring up for the Chancellor’s job, whilst Batten becomes Deputy Prime Minster.
Farage has enough Metals Exchange experience to be Chancellor of the Exchequer I reckon - and in any case, we NEED a Hard Brexiteer Chancellor - because they are the only ones who can really grab the Civil Servant’s ■■■■■ strings, the Bank of England, and any other places that “Brussels Money” comes from - and PULL THE PLUG on it all!
The EU will argue that this constitutes “Theft” or “Default” or maybe even “Treason” of course.
I hasten to remind them that they have already effectively frozen some £9bn of UK assets banked fairly and squarely (so we thought) at the ECB. Our Bank of England also has a rather large “long” position in the Eurocurrency, which if dumped onto the open market - would crash over half the banks in mainland Europe.
What better person to organize such a coup (if necessary…) than Nigel Farage as Chancellor?
…He might not even bother to replace Remainer Mark Carney at the helm of the Bank of England… The BoE used to be run by the Government - and could in theory go back to being run by the government… (just sack the damned Remainer who should have stood down the moment his buddies Cameron and Osbourne quit!)
Any attempt by Euro financial players to “crash the pound” - would then actually play straight into the incoming Chancellor/Govenor’s hands: It would form a nice toppy price to dump all those temporarily much higher Euros at! This not only underpins the Pound, but re-patriates a serious wedge at the same time for the UK WAY in addition of the “Brexit Dividend” money. I suspect that the Euro position being held by the Bank of England - exceeeds a trillion Euros!.
The EU would then have to capitulate, and shut down as an institution - or go bust along with their banks and currency. That would put the UK back into the same position it was in during the Summer of 1945 - BUT this time around, we’ve got a recently stuffed coffer to deal with a “new plan for Europe” that doesn’t include Germany in it this time around. Germany can keep their power stations, and they can get a trickle of income back by selling us energy at ever-deceasing prices, now that the attempt to “Corner Russian Energy” has blown up in their faces as well, by this point.
Winseer:
Farage doesn’t have to be the actual “Leader”, taking over from Batten - he could go in as a “Running Mate” - squaring up for the Chancellor’s job, whilst Batten becomes Deputy Prime Minster.Farage has enough Metals Exchange experience to be Chancellor of the Exchequer I reckon - and in any case, we NEED a Hard Brexiteer Chancellor - because they are the only ones who can really grab the Civil Servant’s ■■■■■ strings, the Bank of England, and any other places that “Brussels Money” comes from - and PULL THE PLUG on it all!
The EU will argue that this constitutes “Theft” or “Default” or maybe even “Treason” of course.
I hasten to remind them that they have already effectively frozen some £9bn of UK assets banked fairly and squarely (so we thought) at the ECB. Our Bank of England also has a rather large “long” position in the Eurocurrency, which if dumped onto the open market - would crash over half the banks in mainland Europe.
What better person to organize such a coup (if necessary…) than Nigel Farage as Chancellor?
…He might not even bother to replace Remainer Mark Carney at the helm of the Bank of England… The BoE used to be run by the Government - and could in theory go back to being run by the government… (just sack the damned Remainer who should have stood down the moment his buddies Cameron and Osbourne quit!)
Any attempt by Euro financial players to “crash the pound” - would then actually play straight into the incoming Chancellor/Govenor’s hands: It would form a nice toppy price to dump all those temporarily much higher Euros at! This not only underpins the Pound, but re-patriates a serious wedge at the same time for the UK WAY in addition of the “Brexit Dividend” money. I suspect that the Euro position being held by the Bank of England - exceeeds a trillion Euros!.
The EU would then have to capitulate, and shut down as an institution - or go bust along with their banks and currency. That would put the UK back into the same position it was in during the Summer of 1945 - BUT this time around, we’ve got a recently stuffed coffer to deal with a “new plan for Europe” that doesn’t include Germany in it this time around. Germany can keep their power stations, and they can get a trickle of income back by selling us energy at ever-deceasing prices, now that the attempt to “Corner Russian Energy” has blown up in their faces as well, by this point.
Firstly having put the suggestion of a joint leadership made up of Farage and Batten,in large part to make it more difficult for the media to apply character assassination against two leaders,the word seems to be that Farage can’t/won’t work with Batten as an equal.While Farage really cooked his own goose reghardless.By walking away when the country and UKIP needed him most and then Batten stepping up and more than saving the day.While as we’ve seen Batten is more than capable of making a better anti establishment case.While also being immune from the type of typical establishment media retaliation along the lines of being a so called ‘far right extremist’,which Farage seems too easily subjected to and obviously unable/unwilling to brush off and defend himself against.On that note UKIP is arguably in a stronger position now under Batten than it’s ever been with Farage now being an irrelevant side show by his own actions.
Although having said that I’d guess no one would complain ‘if’ Farage decided to return so long as he expressed his agreement that Batten is as good as UKIP’s leadership will ever get and is prepared to work enthusiastically with/under him.
While it’s clear that there’s not much point in deciding Farage’s position in any new administration until we can first get UKIP into the type of position held by the LibDems in the case of the previous Con/LibDem coalition,or that of the DUP over May now and for that we’ll need to take Labour voters from Corbyn added to whatever of the ■■■■■■ off anti May Con vote we can get.In which case Batten is also as good as it gets for doing that in uniting and bringing both sides of that vote together.Also bearing in mind that it’s also Batten,not Farage,who had the foresight to predict a Con implosion around the Autumn and a snap election being on the cards and putting UKIP on the alert for that.Now with the hopeless team of May loyalist Raab and May/Hammond having now obviously taken control of the Brexit agenda showing that implosion is on track.Bearing in mind that Raab is also hamstrung by a 60/40 remain constituency mandate unlike Davis and remainer May obviously knows it.With Raab already having made the statement to me,in reply to the question why was the referendum deliberately set up by the Cons as a non binding document,that it’s ultimately a question for a general election to decide not a referendum. Which I then relayed to our local UKIP constituency office.
Realistically the future of the country depends on whether people choose to vote for Batten or for more of the same May/Corbyn/Cable/Sturgeon remain alliance.But what is certain is that the referendum and with it May controlled Brexit was always a dead duck from June 2016 having deliberately been made so by the remainers as an insurance policy in the unlikely event of a Leave win.With Cameron having already obviously made the required plans to keep the agenda in the hands of the remainers within the Con administration as part of that.
To which Farage’s answer at the time was let’s trust May as he walked away saying his job was done in addition to taking an increasing establishment line. With many UKIP members/voters justifiably now not being too keen on trusting Farage to return and deliver as part of that and with Batten’s,no compromise leadership,so far having more than compensated for.
So yes there still might be a place for Farage.Just so long as he recognises his catastrophic and naive failings in the immediate aftermath of the referendum,in walking away with job nowhere near done and going soft on numerous issues and rightly delegates to Batten in the realisation of that.
Carryfast:
Winseer:
Farage doesn’t have to be the actual “Leader”, taking over from Batten - he could go in as a “Running Mate” - squaring up for the Chancellor’s job, whilst Batten becomes Deputy Prime Minster.Farage has enough Metals Exchange experience to be Chancellor of the Exchequer I reckon - and in any case, we NEED a Hard Brexiteer Chancellor - because they are the only ones who can really grab the Civil Servant’s ■■■■■ strings, the Bank of England, and any other places that “Brussels Money” comes from - and PULL THE PLUG on it all!
The EU will argue that this constitutes “Theft” or “Default” or maybe even “Treason” of course.
I hasten to remind them that they have already effectively frozen some £9bn of UK assets banked fairly and squarely (so we thought) at the ECB. Our Bank of England also has a rather large “long” position in the Eurocurrency, which if dumped onto the open market - would crash over half the banks in mainland Europe.
What better person to organize such a coup (if necessary…) than Nigel Farage as Chancellor?
…He might not even bother to replace Remainer Mark Carney at the helm of the Bank of England… The BoE used to be run by the Government - and could in theory go back to being run by the government… (just sack the damned Remainer who should have stood down the moment his buddies Cameron and Osbourne quit!)
Any attempt by Euro financial players to “crash the pound” - would then actually play straight into the incoming Chancellor/Govenor’s hands: It would form a nice toppy price to dump all those temporarily much higher Euros at! This not only underpins the Pound, but re-patriates a serious wedge at the same time for the UK WAY in addition of the “Brexit Dividend” money. I suspect that the Euro position being held by the Bank of England - exceeeds a trillion Euros!.
The EU would then have to capitulate, and shut down as an institution - or go bust along with their banks and currency. That would put the UK back into the same position it was in during the Summer of 1945 - BUT this time around, we’ve got a recently stuffed coffer to deal with a “new plan for Europe” that doesn’t include Germany in it this time around. Germany can keep their power stations, and they can get a trickle of income back by selling us energy at ever-deceasing prices, now that the attempt to “Corner Russian Energy” has blown up in their faces as well, by this point.
Firstly having put the suggestion of a joint leadership made up of Farage and Batten,in large part to make it more difficult for the media to apply character assassination against two leaders,the word seems to be that Farage can’t/won’t work with Batten as an equal.While Farage really cooked his own goose reghardless.By walking away when the country and UKIP needed him most and then Batten stepping up and more than saving the day.While as we’ve seen Batten is more than capable of making a better anti establishment case.While also being immune from the type of typical establishment media retaliation along the lines of being a so called ‘far right extremist’,which Farage seems too easily subjected to and obviously unable/unwilling to brush off and defend himself against.On that note UKIP is arguably in a stronger position now under Batten than it’s ever been with Farage now being an irrelevant side show by his own actions. As far as I’m concerned, Farage walked when he did more about personal safety reasons than anything else. It can’t be easy to deal with this sickening feeling of the walls closing in, whilst failing to win a seat yet again means NO security detail as enjoyed by currently out-of-office Geert Wilders and Marine Le Pen of course. Any talk of animosity between Farage and Batten I suggest has been bigged-up by the UKIP haters to keep reminding people “why you must never vote for UKIP” (Essentially because the Liberal Left says you mustn’t!)
Although having said that I’d guess no one would complain ‘if’ Farage decided to return so long as he expressed his agreement that Batten is as good as UKIP’s leadership will ever get and is prepared to work enthusiastically with/under him. My line above stands. I think Farage would make an excellent “running mate” for Batten, which then lines him up for the Chancellor’s job - providing that UKIP win enough seats to give them a proper balance of power of course. If UKIP had the 2nd biggest number of seats - then the senior partner would just say “You get what cabinet positions we give you, which’ll be very little - or you can not be in this coalition”. In actual fact, I believe UKIP freshly minted MPs would do better “not rushing into a coalition” if they have not won the most seats: They should stand back and let the Tories and Labour “panic jump” into the all-too-obvious “Coalition of National Unity” which will see them lumber from one crisis to another - with UKIP now safely Her Majesty’s Opposition - and in a position that sees them gain power day by day… That would make the UK position similar to that now seen in Germany, where Schulz and Merkel now look like complete idiots for “panic forming” their “keep AfD OUT” coalition of their own - simply because it has now left AfD as OFFICIAL OPPOSITION.
While it’s clear that there’s not much point in deciding Farage’s position in any new administration until we can first get UKIP into the type of position held by the LibDems in the case of the previous Con/LibDem coalition,or that of the DUP over May now and for that we’ll need to take Labour voters from Corbyn added to whatever of the ■■■■■■ off anti May Con vote we can get.In which case Batten is also as good as it gets for doing that in uniting and bringing both sides of that vote together.Also bearing in mind that it’s also Batten,not Farage,who had the foresight to predict a Con implosion around the Autumn and a snap election being on the cards and putting UKIP on the alert for that.Now with the hopeless team of May loyalist Raab and May/Hammond having now obviously taken control of the Brexit agenda showing that implosion is on track.Bearing in mind that Raab is also hamstrung by a 60/40 remain constituency mandate unlike Davis and remainer May obviously knows it.With Raab already having made the statement to me,in reply to the question why was the referendum deliberately set up by the Cons as a non binding document,that it’s ultimately a question for a general election to decide not a referendum.
If AfD can go from Zero to 94 seats in one shot - then UKIP can do the same. Have faith, brother!
Realistically the future of the country depends on whether people choose to vote for Batten or for more of the same May/Corbyn/Cable/Sturgeon remain alliance.But what is certain is that the referendum and with it May controlled Brexit was always a dead duck from June 2016 having deliberately been made so by the remainers as an insurance policy in the unlikely event of a Leave win.With Cameron having already obviously made the required plans to keep the agenda in the hands of the remainers within the Con administration as part of that.
To which Farage’s answer at the time was let’s trust May as he walked away saying his job was done in addition to taking an increasing establishment line.
So yes there still might be a place for Farage.Just so long as he recognises his catastrophic and naive failings in the immediate aftermath of the referendum,in walking away with job nowhere near done and going soft on numerous issues and rightly delegates to Batten in the realisation of that.
The price the mainstream parties will pay for spending too much energy sidelining UKIP - is their total destruction. SNP are UKIP haters - they have already lost nearly half their seats from their high water mark.
The Libdems have lost nearly 80% of their seats from the Coalition Government days, just 3 years back.
Labour gained some voters from UKIP as “Protest Voters” lending their vote to Corbyn, who wasn’t seen to be actually in with a chance of winning - even with these “Loaned” votes. It was just to give TM a scare, I reckon.
The Prime Minster, Theresa May that she still is for the time being - will pay the heaviest price of all for manipulating ballots so Farage couldn’t win a seat time and time again.
It was spiteful of her to first stand down the Tory party candidate in Richmond, so Rebel Zach would have a better prospect there.
…And then NOT do the same thing in Stoke - where she insisted on fielding a complete fop of a candidate who couldn’t possibly win the seat - that then split the Right vote, leaving the Labour candidate to win a seat on a measly 7853 votes. Pah!
Winseer:
As far as I’m concerned, Farage walked when he did more about personal safety reasons than anything else. It can’t be easy to deal with this sickening feeling of the walls closing in, whilst failing to win a seat yet again means NO security detail as enjoyed by currently out-of-office Geert Wilders and Marine Le Pen of course. Any talk of animosity between Farage and Batten I suggest has been bigged-up by the UKIP haters to keep reminding people “why you must never vote for UKIP” (Essentially because the Liberal Left says you mustn’t!)My line above stands. I think Farage would make an excellent “running mate” for Batten, which then lines him up for the Chancellor’s job - providing that UKIP win enough seats to give them a proper balance of power of course. If UKIP had the 2nd biggest number of seats - then the senior partner would just say “You get what cabinet positions we give you, which’ll be very little - or you can not be in this coalition”. In actual fact, I believe UKIP freshly minted MPs would do better “not rushing into a coalition” if they have not won the most seats: They should stand back and let the Tories and Labour “panic jump” into the all-too-obvious “Coalition of National Unity” which will see them lumber from one crisis to another - with UKIP now safely Her Majesty’s Opposition - and in a position that sees them gain power day by day… That would make the UK position similar to that now seen in Germany, where Schulz and Merkel now look like complete idiots for “panic forming” their “keep AfD OUT” coalition of their own - simply because it has now left AfD as OFFICIAL OPPOSITION.
While it’s clear that there’s not much point in deciding Farage’s position in any new administration until we can first get UKIP into the type of position held by the LibDems in the case of the previous Con/LibDem coalition,or that of the DUP over May now and for that we’ll need to take Labour voters from Corbyn added to whatever of the ■■■■■■ off anti May Con vote we can get.In which case Batten is also as good as it gets for doing that in uniting and bringing both sides of that vote together.Also bearing in mind that it’s also Batten,not Farage,who had the foresight to predict a Con implosion around the Autumn and a snap election being on the cards and putting UKIP on the alert for that.Now with the hopeless team of May loyalist Raab and May/Hammond having now obviously taken control of the Brexit agenda showing that implosion is on track.Bearing in mind that Raab is also hamstrung by a 60/40 remain constituency mandate unlike Davis and remainer May obviously knows it.With Raab already having made the statement to me,in reply to the question why was the referendum deliberately set up by the Cons as a non binding document,that it’s ultimately a question for a general election to decide not a referendum.
If AfD can go from Zero to 94 seats in one shot - then UKIP can do the same. Have faith, brother!
The price the mainstream parties will pay for spending too much energy sidelining UKIP - is their total destruction. SNP are UKIP haters - they have already lost nearly half their seats from their high water mark.
The Libdems have lost nearly 80% of their seats from the Coalition Government days, just 3 years back.
Labour gained some voters from UKIP as “Protest Voters” lending their vote to Corbyn, who wasn’t seen to be actually in with a chance of winning - even with these “Loaned” votes. It was just to give TM a scare, I reckon.
The Prime Minster, Theresa May that she still is for the time being - will pay the heaviest price of all for manipulating ballots so Farage couldn’t win a seat time and time again.
It was spiteful of her to first stand down the Tory party candidate in Richmond, so Rebel Zach would have a better prospect there.
…And then NOT do the same thing in Stoke - where she insisted on fielding a complete fop of a candidate who couldn’t possibly win the seat - that then split the Right vote, leaving the Labour candidate to win a seat on a measly 7853 votes. Pah!
The issue of Farage and Batten not being able to work together as equals ( Farage wants to be top dog ) was actually explained to me by the local UKIP constituency office during the previous leadership election discussions and nothing to do with UKIP ‘opposition’. As for whether Farage was warned off or not we’ll never know for sure but what is certain is that Batten has now more than taken over Farage’s place and hopefully that will remain so in the coming fight between May,Corbyn and UKIP.While whatever it is that Farage was/is scared of Batten obviously doesn’t give a zb starting with the obvious difference between Batten’s approach to the post referendum cluster zb to date v that of Farage’s grovelling support of May at the start.On that note I’d guess that I’m not the only UKIPer who’s more loyal to Batten than to Farage in that regard and it’s now up to Farage to show that he’s actually up to the job by admitting his mistakes and throwing his weight behind Batten.As opposed to the bad judgement he’s shown so far.
As for Goldsmith he’s probably one of the better Con MP’s being anti Heathrow expansion and pro Brexit and pro Green Belt protection.Although it’s anyone’s guess why he sees any advantage in standing for the Cons rather than as an independent.