I will do whatever it needs to prevent me or others getting this disease. The quicker it is reduced the better. I have to laugh at people moaning at issues of national health when they are quick to complain bitterly about waiting rooms at rdcs; tacho rules etc etc
Franglais:
Night-and-day:
I’m in agreement with you too, I think it’s a massive over reaction that will ruin this country and the rest of the world for years.
apple.news/A67SMBY7zQdy7Dx43LHuDDASo well known millionaire Murdoch (and his well off employee Kavannah) agrees with millionaire Trump that those of us reliant upon the under resourced public health services, should ignore the risk to protect the existing economic status quo?
.
Shock!
That all depends wether you believe the hype, personally I don’t.
AndieHyde:
Franglais:
adam277:
Funny is it not?For what? Millions died during WW2 for liberty.
Yet thousands may die due to this virus and we lose more and more of our liberty daily.And people are welcoming it and demanding more draconian measures to be introduced. People recording rule breakers and publically shaming them for going on walks or playing football.
We could of gone down the other route of isolating and protecting the old and vunerable but no it is everyone.Just feels very 1984ish.
I fully expect to get ripped to shreds for this but not seen this view on this forum yet so might be well worth the debate. (until questioning government propaganda becomes illegal anyway)
Firstly let’s look at your first paragraph.
.
In WW2 UK plus Crown Colonies total war deaths 1939 to 1945 military and civilian were under 450,000.
If no actions are taken COVID 19 could take over 500,000 lives, most in under one year.
.
If we carry on with the actions started the number of victims can be greatly reduced.
.
…
Retired doctors and other medical professionals are being asked to come out if retirement ( these are older and more vulnerable remember) to help those who are ill.
And some here are moaning…about…There you go again, using words like “could” & “can” & “if”
All ambiguous statements purporting to be fact.The impact from a complete collapse of infrastructure WILL kill many more people than a bad cold ever did.
telegraph.co.uk/news/2016/0 … ding-to-l/
bbc.co.uk/news/health-27796628
By all accounts this recession we are bringing on ourselves is going to be the worst recession in history.
I wonder how many will die due to that alone. The government can not protect everyone.
anisboy:
The sooner the UK goes on full lockdown like we have in NZ the better quite frankly!We have had to leave our daughter behind in the UK, she has her own life, but we are extremely worried about her as she is immune compromised and on her own. My elderly parents, still in the UK, are doing the best they can to keep away from all the other idiots who seem happy to roam about wherever they like because they are fit and healthy, not giving a ■■■■ whether they are carriers or not, or whether they become part of the chain in spreading this virus.
So yes, I will rip you to shreds until you all fully understand the seriousness of this pandemic.
Both my partner and I are both considered essential workforce in NZ, at least she can work from home and look after our youngest. My employer has the most draconian hygiene standards anyway (being part of the food chain) but they are even stricter now, and so they bloody should be. In my working day I come into contact with many suppliers, all of whom are taking this very very seriously so I feel that a full lock down is the way to go, especially in countries like NZ or the UK where so much precedence is put on personal freedoms. If everyone plays their part instead of mingling then the spread can be stopped.
NZ are still having to tell tourists to stop travelling around the country, some of whom thought the lock down did not apply to them as they weren’t Kiwi!! NZ yesterday had its first Covid-19 related death, a woman in her 70s who rarely travelled, the connection? Tourists passing through her town.
Locally to us, a couple of bars are related to number of cases stemming from a St Patricks event, they are only just coming to light due to the incubation period. In the meantime, those persons affected prior to the lock down will have come into contact with countless other persons. God knows how many people, and then they could have then passed it on to many others, thus creating the snowball effect. Now, I am fully aware that this would still have happened as it was prior to lock down but it is a good example of why we need to, and must isolate from everyone else.
If you think a full lock down is too draconian then I suggest you put yourself in the shoes of those on the front line, who are crying out for more serious measures, then you might understand.
Oh come on mate, your getting caught up in the hysteria and openly promoting it.
The bird in Greymouth was 70 years old, had underlying chronic health issues (NZHerald) and no one knows how she contracted the disease besides being admitted to hospital 4 days earlier (ministry of health)
Your in Matamata, one of the most frequented spots on the tourist trail as people love them Hobbits. Imagine that travelers from the four corners of the globe congregating in one spot might increase the likelihood of transmission but I am not seeing roadblocks anytime soon.
I live in Napier.
We have had cruise ships berthing here every other day for months, releasing thousands of potential infections into my community. How many cases in Hawkes Bay currently?
Five.
Four flew in from overseas and went into self isolation of their own volition.
So, despite this exposure, one person in a town of 80000.
Really not that serious and certainly not a reason to throw the future of the whole region under a bus.
I think people will only stomach it temporarily. The vast majority woukdnt willingly throw themselves into a level of personal hardship on a whim.
I know I wouldnt…
But what I do understand is that breaking the transmission will help defeat the virus, which is neither unique to this virus or indeed outside of common sense thinking.
AndieHyde:
Juddian:
“Aegrescit medendo”
It’s an idea that has seemingly been around for a while.
Confess i had to look that up, i never read Latin and am in awe of your command of it (it also ages you, and me 
, and gives a clue to the type of schools you attended), you virtually meet some surprising people on these pages, chapeau.
Personally, I feel if we are to beat this thing we need to follow China’s example.
But we wont. They had a ultra lockdown for just under 3 months.
We are looking at far longer.
They had 3k deaths with a population of over 1 billion.
Our government says if we only have 20 thousands deaths that will be a good result.
I can stomach 3 months… but lets be honest we all drive trucks around the country. Most people are ignoring it.
I wouldn’t be surprised if the lockdown lasts until the end of the year.
jowett1969:
https://youtu.be/4J0d59dd-qMSent from my SM-N976B using Tapatalk
We are not all at risk…
AndieHyde:
So the narrative is " the needs of the few outweighs the needs of the many" ?
More like 'The lives of a few outweigh the wants of many". Since China lied blatantly about their number of death/infected among other things we now see that the death rate is much higher. 51 doctors dead in Italy, a few already in the UK. Once the cut-off line for capacity is reached, there are going to be a LOT of people ill - anyone without treatment is going to have slim chances of survival. You know how when there’s a multi-vehicle crash or a bus crash where a dozen or so people have to be rushed to hospitals - they’ll scramble ambulances from several neighboring towns so they can handle the number of injured and then often disperse them to different hospitals depending on where they have free beds. Now imagine half a million people or so all crashing at the same time, on the same day at decent speed. Most of them will die simply due to not enough personnel/equipment available.
Any person with some decency wouldn’t have to be told by their gov’t to limit their out-of-home activities to a minimum (temporarily, mind you) I could understand if you’re between the ages of 13-30 this can hit particularly hard but take that as a lesson in societal behavior…‘We protect our elders and the vulnerable - it’s what defines us a civilization’
Juddian:
AndieHyde:
Juddian:
“Aegrescit medendo”
It’s an idea that has seemingly been around for a while.Confess i had to look that up, i never read Latin and am in awe of your command of it (it also ages you, and me
More like this I’m afraid. “Romanes eunt domus”
AndieHyde:
Oh come on mate, your getting caught up in the hysteria and openly promoting it.
The bird in Greymouth was 70 years old, had underlying chronic health issues (NZHerald) and no one knows how she contracted the disease besides being admitted to hospital 4 days earlier (ministry of health)
Your in Matamata, one of the most frequented spots on the tourist trail as people love them Hobbits. Imagine that travelers from the four corners of the globe congregating in one spot might increase the likelihood of transmission but I am not seeing roadblocks anytime soon.I live in Napier.
We have had cruise ships berthing here every other day for months, releasing thousands of potential infections into my community. How many cases in Hawkes Bay currently?
Five.
Four flew in from overseas and went into self isolation of their own volition.So, despite this exposure, one person in a town of 80000.
Really not that serious and certainly not a reason to throw the future of the whole region under a bus.
Thankfully not in Matamata, but near enough. I’m openly promoting the lock down simply because I have a family member on the front line here in NZ, as well as knowing several in the UK. If they are taking it seriously, and they are not fools, then that it is enough for me.
As far as the woman is concerned, the underlying health is irrelevent, what matters is how she caught it and so far the most likely theory is from travellers. I accept that it is a theory.
anisboy:
AndieHyde:
Oh come on mate, your getting caught up in the hysteria and openly promoting it.
The bird in Greymouth was 70 years old, had underlying chronic health issues (NZHerald) and no one knows how she contracted the disease besides being admitted to hospital 4 days earlier (ministry of health)
Your in Matamata, one of the most frequented spots on the tourist trail as people love them Hobbits. Imagine that travelers from the four corners of the globe congregating in one spot might increase the likelihood of transmission but I am not seeing roadblocks anytime soon.I live in Napier.
We have had cruise ships berthing here every other day for months, releasing thousands of potential infections into my community. How many cases in Hawkes Bay currently?
Five.
Four flew in from overseas and went into self isolation of their own volition.So, despite this exposure, one person in a town of 80000.
Really not that serious and certainly not a reason to throw the future of the whole region under a bus.
Thankfully not in Matamata, but near enough. I’m openly promoting the lock down simply because I have a family member on the front line here in NZ, as well as knowing several in the UK. If they are taking it seriously, and they are not fools, then that it is enough for me.
As far as the woman is concerned, the underlying health is irrelevent, what matters is how she caught it and so far the most likely theory is from travellers. I accept that it is a theory.
Healthline workers take everything related to health seriously, it is part of their job.
I dont think anyone is saying that this is not a serious matter.
Juddian:
People wonder why some never had a qualm about leading others to their certain awful deaths in concentration camps, you see the potential recruits in those asking, nay demanding, more losses of freedom.
The seeds are being being planted and amazingly welcomed by people who have never seen a police state but appear to want one.To the old bill, who didn’t raise a finger against ■■■■■■■■■■ gangs in cities and watched on as looters ransacked shops in the last riots, their new powers will go to their heads quickly, powers they will want to keep once this is over, we are taking giant steps back to 1984.
Trump is right the cure is in danger of being worse than the disease.
I think what we could be seeing is the end game of a defeated, ( more like the elites not willing to risk their lifestyles in a war with China ), west submitting to Vichy style puppet regime Chi Com rule.
I’d guess exactly the same questions were being asked by the average Southern French peasant regarding the German ■■■■ order book, suddenly being adhered to by the local Gendarmes overnight, under the new Vichy regime.Bearing in mind that curfew is the default go to tactic of Chinese rule in Tibet.While they get on with taking over the country and taking our supplies from us.Oh look suddenly we’re just another CCP run territory in all but name.
anisboy:
The sooner the UK goes on full lockdown like we have in NZ the better quite frankly!We have had to leave our daughter behind in the UK, she has her own life, but we are extremely worried about her as she is immune compromised and on her own. My elderly parents, still in the UK, are doing the best they can to keep away from all the other idiots who seem happy to roam about wherever they like because they are fit and healthy, not giving a ■■■■ whether they are carriers or not, or whether they become part of the chain in spreading this virus.
So yes, I will rip you to shreds until you all fully understand the seriousness of this pandemic.
Both my partner and I are both considered essential workforce in NZ, at least she can work from home and look after our youngest. My employer has the most draconian hygiene standards anyway (being part of the food chain) but they are even stricter now, and so they bloody should be. In my working day I come into contact with many suppliers, all of whom are taking this very very seriously so I feel that a full lock down is the way to go, especially in countries like NZ or the UK where so much precedence is put on personal freedoms. If everyone plays their part instead of mingling then the spread can be stopped.
NZ are still having to tell tourists to stop travelling around the country, some of whom thought the lock down did not apply to them as they weren’t Kiwi!! NZ yesterday had its first Covid-19 related death, a woman in her 70s who rarely travelled, the connection? Tourists passing through here town.
Locally to us, a couple of bars are related to number of cases stemming from a St Patricks event, they are only just coming to light due to the incubation period. In the meantime, those persons affected prior to the lock down will have come into contact with countless other persons. God knows how many people, and then they could have then passed it on to many others, thus creating the snowball effect. Now, I am fully aware that this would still have happened as it was prior to lock down but it is a good example of why we need to, and must isolate from everyone else.
If you think a full lock down is too draconian then I suggest you put yourself in the shoes of those on the front line, who are crying out for more serious measures, then you might understand.
Strange you’ve said all that but not a word about how all this started when numerous countries, including NZ, went on a ‘rescue’ mission involving the mass movement of possibly loads of asymptomatic people from the epicentre in China.While the international flights go on.
Were these ‘tourists’ Chinese people running from their own seeming infection problems and taking them elsewhere by any chance.Spare us the hypocrisy.
WhiteTruckMan:
I think it was an American commentator who summed it up nicely when they said freedom of speech does not give you the right to yell fire in the middle of a crowded theatre.
Oh wait.Now supposing it’s the theatre management shouting fire take the fire exits while at the same time allowing in loads of new customers at the main entrance.You know a bit like being locked down at home while at the airports it’s international free movement business as usual.Don’t you think people would be asking questions about their entrance fee when they are out in the street being told to move on by theatre’s security staff.
Or let’s bring in loads of infected people from a bio weapon escape epicentre to ‘rescue’ them and bring them to ‘safety’.What could possibly go wrong.Oh it has gone wrong but it’s all our fault for leaving our house to go to the shops.Not the government’s for bringing it into the country.
You’re avin a larf.
I must buy more tinfoil before you guys clear it off the shelves.
Sent from my CLT-L29 using Tapatalk
vbmonkey:
I must buy more tinfoil before you guys clear it off the shelves.Sent from my CLT-L29 using Tapatalk
I think the tinfoil actually works fine.
But some haven’t actually used it…[emoji3]
vbmonkey:
I must buy more tinfoil before you guys clear it off the shelves.
No tin foil here.Just wear a mask you’ll be fine and welcome home or to Europe etc social distancing what’s that.Now they don’t even need the mask for some reason.So now you can go to or from the airport by bus for an air journey to or from anywhere in the world.But leaving the house to go up the road could cost lives apparently.
youtube.com/watch?v=_hXwyTppCg8
Carryfast:
anisboy:
The sooner the UK goes on full lockdown like we have in NZ the better quite frankly!We have had to leave our daughter behind in the UK, she has her own life, but we are extremely worried about her as she is immune compromised and on her own. My elderly parents, still in the UK, are doing the best they can to keep away from all the other idiots who seem happy to roam about wherever they like because they are fit and healthy, not giving a ■■■■ whether they are carriers or not, or whether they become part of the chain in spreading this virus.
So yes, I will rip you to shreds until you all fully understand the seriousness of this pandemic.
Both my partner and I are both considered essential workforce in NZ, at least she can work from home and look after our youngest. My employer has the most draconian hygiene standards anyway (being part of the food chain) but they are even stricter now, and so they bloody should be. In my working day I come into contact with many suppliers, all of whom are taking this very very seriously so I feel that a full lock down is the way to go, especially in countries like NZ or the UK where so much precedence is put on personal freedoms. If everyone plays their part instead of mingling then the spread can be stopped.
NZ are still having to tell tourists to stop travelling around the country, some of whom thought the lock down did not apply to them as they weren’t Kiwi!! NZ yesterday had its first Covid-19 related death, a woman in her 70s who rarely travelled, the connection? Tourists passing through here town.
Locally to us, a couple of bars are related to number of cases stemming from a St Patricks event, they are only just coming to light due to the incubation period. In the meantime, those persons affected prior to the lock down will have come into contact with countless other persons. God knows how many people, and then they could have then passed it on to many others, thus creating the snowball effect. Now, I am fully aware that this would still have happened as it was prior to lock down but it is a good example of why we need to, and must isolate from everyone else.
If you think a full lock down is too draconian then I suggest you put yourself in the shoes of those on the front line, who are crying out for more serious measures, then you might understand.
Strange you’ve said all that but not a word about how all this started when numerous countries, including NZ, went on a ‘rescue’ mission involving the mass movement of possibly loads of asymptomatic people from the epicentre in China.While the international flights go on.
Were these ‘tourists’ Chinese people running from their own seeming infection problems and taking them elsewhere by any chance.Spare us the hypocrisy.
I don’t believe they were but I can only go from the information that is released.
It would be fair to say that I don’t think any country took this seriously enough from the start.