I just give you one example from my own experience. I am in Slovakia, parked in front of big local speditor. Small vans go on and off all the time and they have a big signs saying âreturn loads offeredâ.
Office guys call me and say âGo to Dusseldorf, you have back load from there it will be ready tomorow morningâ. I offer them that I can go to this speditor and ask him if he have some load to Ruhr area, so I do not go empty. Office guys say âNo, donât do that, they pay too poor rates for usâ.
So if itâs better for British company to run empty than to run and be pay low rate - well, I think a part of the answer to OP question lies here.
I discussed it on one occasion with one member of the forum who was at the same position as my office. He told me âif we wonât take loads for the lower price, they will have to pay us moreâ. â â â â â â â â , they have row of small vans from EE waiting to take this loads. So if you take this back load not only you will have costs of running empty covered in the worst case, but also you are taking job from them. If you donât - you just let them earn even more and expand their businessesâŚ
I just give you one example from my own experience. I am in Slovakia, parked in front of big local speditor. Small vans go on and off all the time and they have a big signs saying âreturn loads offeredâ.
Office guys call me and say âGo to Dusseldorf, you have back load from there it will be ready tomorow morningâ. I offer them that I can go to this speditor and ask him if he have some load to Ruhr area, so I do not go empty. Office guys say âNo, donât do that, they pay too poor rates for usâ.
So if itâs better for British company to run empty than to run and be pay low rate - well, I think a part of the answer to OP question lies here.
I discussed it on one occasion with one member of the forum who was at the same position as my office. He told me âif we wonât take loads for the lower price, they will have to pay us moreâ. [zb], they have row of small vans from EE waiting to take this loads. So if you take this back load not only you will have costs of running empty covered in the worst case, but also you are taking job from them. If you donât - you just let them earn even more and expand their businessesâŚ
Orys itâs often not worth the hassle of potentially letting a good client down. We do a lot of empty running, rather than try and squeeze a border line job inbetween, for that very reason. Better to be smart and know what youâre doing rather than be a busy fool chasing every penny.
for what itâs worth.
it is illegal to sell a product, or offer a service for less than cost price.
so if a company does a job for free, or at a loss, then they could be prosecuted.
not likely to happen though.
billybigrig:
Orys itâs often not worth the hassle of potentially letting a good client down. We do a lot of empty running, rather than try and squeeze a border line job inbetween, for that very reason. Better to be smart and know what youâre doing rather than be a busy fool chasing every penny.
Yeah, but in that case I had a long waiting for the cargo anyway, it could be done easily. And it wasnât the good client of ours, it was just some one-off job from online market.
I just give you one example from my own experience. I am in Slovakia, parked in front of big local speditor. Small vans go on and off all the time and they have a big signs saying âreturn loads offeredâ.
Office guys call me and say âGo to Dusseldorf, you have back load from there it will be ready tomorow morningâ. I offer them that I can go to this speditor and ask him if he have some load to Ruhr area, so I do not go empty. Office guys say âNo, donât do that, they pay too poor rates for usâ.
So if itâs better for British company to run empty than to run and be pay low rate - well, I think a part of the answer to OP question lies here.
I discussed it on one occasion with one member of the forum who was at the same position as my office. He told me âif we wonât take loads for the lower price, they will have to pay us moreâ. [zb], they have row of small vans from EE waiting to take this loads. So if you take this back load not only you will have costs of running empty covered in the worst case, but also you are taking job from them. If you donât - you just let them earn even more and expand their businessesâŚ
I reckon your office guy are crazy & made some loss money on fuel! running empty to Dusseldorf from Slovakia! I rather have return loads somewhere from Slovakia to somewhere in Ruhr area or Frankfurt am Main area then collect the loads in Dusseldorf for England. I know Slovakian Speditioner dont pay well but could be cover for fuel running to Dusseldorf instead loss money!
Have you conisder to set up own courier bussiness and seem better running than your work company!
Betz:
I reckon your office guy are crazy & made some loss money on fuel! running empty to Dusseldorf from Slovakia! I rather have return loads somewhere from Slovakia to somewhere in Ruhr area or Frankfurt am Main area then collect the loads in Dusseldorf for England. I know Slovakian Speditioner dont pay well but could be cover for fuel running to Dusseldorf instead loss money!
My point exactly.
Have you conisder to set up own courier bussiness and seem better running than your work company!
Actually I did, but itâs not so easy. See, my company have some really good deals, so they can afford to waste money. But it took them some years to establish their position And the guys were worked in the industry before.
I guess it is not so easy to start if you are just a guy from nowhere with only few contatcs⌠But I will see, maybe one day I will just buy a van for my own and start to work in partnership with our place - there is few guys who do just that.
maybe,just maybe orys your boss works on principals.
if where you were offered such a terrible rate that you were moved empty then the rate was very bad and if everybody said no and stuck to their principals the rate would eventually have to go up.
unfortunately there will always be some idiot whoâll do the job for such a bad rate
limeyphil:
for what itâs worth.
it is illegal to sell a product, or offer a service for less than cost price.
so if a company does a job for free, or at a loss, then they could be prosecuted.
not likely to happen though.
Ask your missus what a loss leader is, she will see it when she goes shopping. You may have seen it when you take your car for an MOT. A car costs ÂŁ54.85, but how many times have you seen KwikFit and Halfords selling them below cost.
The question, How do the Euro boys do it was answered, they do keep the vehicles loaded, hence the reason for them not being as reliable as someone who will run empty half way across Europe.
If someone charges ÂŁ1000 from Lille to Milan, that is ÂŁ1 per kilometre, if they come back empty that is only 50p per kilometre.
If the East European picks a load up from a speditor in Milan and delivers to Dijon for 50p per km and then returns to Lille he has already made ÂŁ250 more and maybe taken half a day longer.
Return loads are an English disease and were offered by dozens of Ted & Fred in a shed clearing houses in the 60âs and distant hauliers took a local hauliers regular work for half the price
welshboyinspain:
maybe,just maybe orys your boss works on principals.
if where you were offered such a terrible rate that you were moved empty then the rate was very bad and if everybody said no and stuck to their principals the rate would eventually have to go up.
unfortunately there will always be some idiot whoâll do the job for such a bad rate
Off course, itâs his company, not mine. But then this gave us an answer: my boss quoting transport to Eastern Europe have to calculate into his costs that he will run back empty. Polish van can do it cheaper, as he will know that even if he wonât take profitable job, he wonât pay for fuel to get back.
And as for these return loads: before the era of the internet, you could find many sings for âreturn loadsâ in EE. Itâs deeply rooted in their transport culture: itâs just the place, when there is non-urgent freight lying about waiting for someone going empty its way willing to take it at fuel costs or other less-than-usual price. I see nothing wrong with it: itâs the same when the British shops selling stuff to get rid off it. I just found a special offer in interet and bought myself a pair of shoes. Was 27 then 15 now 4, free shipping. Shipping usually costs 3.90. Thatâs definitely below costs, should other shoe-sellers sue them? No, there is nothing wrong to virtually give away stuff which is lying in the warehouse and takes valuable space.
Edited: I see that Wheel Nut just said about the same
welshboyinspain:
maybe,just maybe orys your boss works on principals.
if where you were offered such a terrible rate that you were moved empty then the rate was very bad and if everybody said no and stuck to their principals the rate would eventually have to go up.
unfortunately there will always be some idiot whoâll do the job for such a bad rate
I think Orysâs boss probably declined to do the work because he didnât want to chase an invoice with an unfamiliar Company in an unfamiliar language. Especially if he has to charge VAT on, what sounds like, a poor paying job.
W
welshboyinspain:
maybe,just maybe orys your boss works on principals.
if where you were offered such a terrible rate that you were moved empty then the rate was very bad and if everybody said no and stuck to their principals the rate would eventually have to go up.
unfortunately there will always be some idiot whoâll do the job for such a bad rate
I think Orysâs boss probably declined to do the work because he didnât want to chase an invoice with an unfamiliar Company in an unfamiliar language. Especially if he has to charge VAT on the invoice.
W
a UK haulier working for a non UK client wouldnât put VAT on the invoice though would he
welshboyinspain:
maybe,just maybe orys your boss works on principals.
if where you were offered such a terrible rate that you were moved empty then the rate was very bad and if everybody said no and stuck to their principals the rate would eventually have to go up.
unfortunately there will always be some idiot whoâll do the job for such a bad rate
I think Orysâs boss probably declined to do the work because he didnât want to chase an invoice with an unfamiliar Company in an unfamiliar language. Especially if he has to charge VAT on the invoice.
W
Thats another good point. I guess that lack of knowledge of foreign languages in Britain can be also the issue.
Youâre probably right WBIS, I had my British van drivers head on then.
When we bought new bikes in Holland Iâm sure we paid some sort of VAT on them and claimed it back.
Iâm still pretty sure Orysâs boss would be reluctant to work directly for an unfamiliar client. Especially one on the other side of Europe.
AlexWignall:
Iâm still pretty sure Orysâs boss would be reluctant to work directly for an unfamiliar client. Especially one on the other side of Europe.
But what has he to loose? He have to choose between driving empty and then paying me for sitting and doing nothing for several hours in wait for my cargo to be ready or to drive loaded, add few miles to my trip and have pretty good chance to be paid for it at least some small money and, maybe, make himself a familiar, reliable client on the other side of Europe to work with in the future?
I rather have return loads somewhere from Slovakia to somewhere in Ruhr area or Frankfurt am Main area then collect the loads in Dusseldorf for England. I know Slovakian Speditioner dont pay well but could be cover for fuel running to Dusseldorf instead loss money! 
