Hi everybody. Hubby is having a few problems with the company that employs him, and I would appreciate any advice that any of you might be able to offer.
Because this is on-going, I won’t name names if you don’t mind.
12 months ago the company was bought over by a “foreign” company, which continued to keep operations based on the east coast side of the country.
Hubby all ready has quite a distance to travel from home to work, but it works out ok because quite often he is home with the truck.
Anyhow…a couple of weeks ago he was told that the company were closing this base, and re-locating all operations to their London depot.
This will be totally un-acceptable because of the distance from home to work. Not only that, but we aren’t too sure that this company will be in business for much longer anyhow.
All the office and warehouse staff were made redundant ,but the management stated that the drivers “would” be going with them, and that a “package” would be announced last week…which never happened for the drivers!
Hubby contacted the union for advice and was told he could apply to be made redundant because of the distance of the re-location. He was told to put it all in writing and hand it in to the management. This he did last Tuesday (10th).
He was told that a response to his letter was to be posted to him…not arrived yet!
He had his truck home last weekend and set off for his first delivery on Monday morning. Then it was back to the yard…where he discovered that everybody had GONE! The telephone’s had been turned off as well, so he had to wait for them to contact him! He has asked about the response to his letter and is now being told that the MD is back in his own country, but they will contact him.
He rang the union this evening and they now seem to be back tracking on what they told him last week!! They now tell him that he could walk off the job, but might not have a case if it all goes to court. Last week they were telling him he had a watertight case for constructive dismissal!! Now they are saying he has to wait for this mythical letter to arrive…which might be the 10th of never!!
Can this company do this?? What if they continue to ignore his request to be made redundant?? His car is stuck at the old yard, so what if they tell him to bring the truck to London…how is he supposed to get back to the old yard to pick his car up??
Right now my head is spinning because I smell a huge and dirty rat, and the union aren’t being much help at all!!
The attitude of the management of this company is that he should just be grateful that he still has a job!! I suspect they don’t intend putting their hands in their pockets at all…despite him having a valid request for redundancy, due to the amount of distance between his old place of work and the new place.
All thoughts and advice will be very much appreciated.
Thankyou.
Union backtracking when the situation approaches the ‘too difficult box’■■ What a suprise!!
Me, sceptical?? No!!! 
I’m sorry for getting that off my chest, Millie. I can only suggest that you try the CAB who I have seen in the past be a lot more help than some of the unions.
Or alternatively,ask the union,as he is paying their wages,what are THEY going to do.
Ken.
What a horrible situation to be in with the monthly bills still to be paid and Christmas approaching.
Definately one for a visit to the CAB.
I presume that when the company was purchased, his employment was transferred under TUPE Regs (not that I know anything about them) 
which, if I remember correctly, last for twelve months. Hence the transfer of location at this time.
I’s be inclined to park the vehicle up where it couldn’t be found and demand current wages plus wages for whatever period of Notice is written into the Employment Contract, and ensure that the cheque is cashed before you tell them where to collect it from.
Have you thought about taking the story to Commercial Motor or T&D. Very few employers enjoy seeing their names appearing in print in situations such as these, and it might just result in the wages being paid somewhat more promptly.
Let us know how you get on.
Thankyou…Marcus, Quinny and Krankee.
I know what you are saying re the union!! Believe me…it was a good job it wasn’t me that was speaking to the rep!! I think a phone call to CAB might be a very good idea.
I think the “tupe” regs were applied when the company was bought out. Up till now there hasn’t been any problems.
At the moment I don’t think there will be any problems with being paid for work all ready done. Having said that he isn’t due to be paid until the end of the month!!
The problem is going to be in obtaining redundancy, which he is entitled to, because of the distance of the re-location. Even if his job remains the same (though I fail to see how that can happen!), he is entitled to redundancy because of the unsuitabality of the new location. That would mean 12 years redundancy and 8 weeks notice pay. Not massive amounts of money but enough to keep us afloat until he finds a new job.
I wasn’t convinced about a claim for constructive dismissal…that was the union guy who said that!
Unfortunately, the truck still belongs to the ex-employer who was allways perfectly 100%. It is being leased by the new company, and even though they would be liable for it, hubby doesn’t feel he could do it…YET! 
As for writing to commercial motor…maybe in the future.
For now I think we will have to play the waiting game.
The union bloke said we have to wait for this “letter” to arrive!!! As I said it could be the 10th of never! We will give it until the weekend.
Ken…up to now the conversations (2) with the union, have been a waste of space. The third one…and yes there will be a third one…will definately include the advice you give.
Thanks so much for your replies.
It would appear that you are now part owners of a HGV unit… Park it safe until its sorted…I found that you have to hit some of these boss’s on the side of the head with a house brick before they see your point of view…Hope this helps…
A call to ACAS (in the phone book) should find you in full command of your position.
They’re really very helful.
Thanks Harry. 
I was going to ask if anybody had any work for a truck and garment trailer for next week.
Tagoat…I had forgotton all about ACAS. I will definately give them a ring as well.
Many thanks.
Millie you are saying the Union is backtracking?
Is this the Union Head Office or the Union Rep?
Personally I’d call the Union Head Office and ask to speak to a Union Solicitor, its free of charge and makes things a little more settling for you, the number of times over the past 25 yrs that I’ve heard a Union Rep say something then later back track is uncountable.
As for constructive dismissal, once you lodge a claim with the Employment Tribunal they are legally obliged to Respond, and despite what folks think, the Managing Director is PERSONALLY responsible for settling any award if the company is no longer trading (I know from first hand experience)
millie:
Thanks Harry.
Tagoat…I had forgotton all about ACAS. I will definately give them a ring as well.
Many thanks.
Maybe something useful on the website.
Tagoat:
A call to ACAS (in the phone book) should find you in full command of your position.
They’re really very helful.
Davey Driver:
Millie you are saying the Union is backtracking?Is this the Union Head Office or the Union Rep?
Personally I’d call the Union Head Office and ask to speak to a Union Solicitor, its free of charge and makes things a little more settling for you, the number of times over the past 25 yrs that I’ve heard a Union Rep say something then later back track is uncountable.
As for constructive dismissal, once you lodge a claim with the Employment Tribunal they are legally obliged to Respond, and despite what folks think, the Managing Director is PERSONALLY responsible for settling any award if the company is no longer trading (I know from first hand experience)
I was just going to say the same, ignore the rep they are usually ignorant [zb] who dont know the law from toilet paper.
can he organise it so he stays with the company as an outbased driver…parking the truck at road transport company ■■
How did they notify him? Is it part of his contract ot agree to move? What compensation are they offering? Are there other drivers in the same position?
By the sounds of it he wants the redudancy so id get on to your union and get them to sort this out.
I can only echo Tagoats and Davey Drivers advice. Its probably too complex for cab but nothing ventured etc…very sorry to hear your family being treated this way.
Thankyou to everybody who has since added to this. Hubby received a phone call off the “boss” today. He informed him that they were not making him redundant ,but he could resign if he wanted to!! He did say that he will have a meeting with him next Monday and see if they can sort something out. Mmmm.
I rang ACAS and on this occasion they were truly “helful” Tagoat! The woman I spoke to was really up her own backside and wasn’t too interested in what I had to say. Basically she was of the opinion that if the job still existed…no matter where the base had moved to…then there would be no claim for redundancy, unless it could be proven that it was impossible to continue working for the company. She pointed out that seeing as he was still driving the truck then it wasn’t impossible!! As for the distance for getting home for the weekend, or truck “downtime” etc…she wasn’t interested!
She said to write to the company…which we allready have done and still received no reply. Then she said to write to them again and send it recorded delivery! I asked what he was supposed to do in the meantime, and the reply was that the longer he works for them the better their case is, but if he walks then it is unlikely that he would have a claim! Catch 22?
I think the attitude seems to be that because a truck is mobile, then it is ok and doesn’t matter where “base” is. Not only that but the main of his job is delivering in Ireland. He goes over on a Thursday and back Friday night. Down to the yard…swaps trailer for uk delivieries on Monday, and is home for Saturday lunchtime. If he now has to go to London instead, he won’t be able to get home! The foreign company that now run this show, aren’t bothered about that because they keep their own drivers out, chasing their backsides for 3 weeks at a time!!
It was a union rep that hubby spoke to…but after listening to the woman at ACAS this afternoon, I am now even more confused and wonder if there is a claim or not. A call to the union solicitor sounds like a good bet though. At least they should know what they are talking about, unlike the rep who has given two versions up to now!
Hitch…I have a feeling that the “sorting something out”, might include basing the truck somewhere nearer to us, but I can’t see how it can happen. I suppose we will have to wait and see!
Ralliesport…They didn’t notify him. There were rumours but that was it…then they were gone!! Good eh? There is no offer of compensation at all…they just said they thought he should be grateful to still have a job! Two of the drivers have allready walked off the job, which leaves 2 uk drivers and 3 international. It isn’t part of his contract to move, but the actual wording is “international driver” who might be required to do uk work as well. He hasn’t been over the water since the takeover though! It could be interpreted to suit whatever ,I suppose, though in actual fact I thought a “mobility” clause was supposed to be included to avoid any problems when re-locating?
Well…thankyou all very much for your input. I think we probably don’t have any choice but to wait and see what the “chief clown” throws up next week!
I still suspect that things will be made as difficult as possible in the hope that hubby and the other remaining uk driver will walk…then they will replace them with their own drivers and it won’t have cost them a penny.
We will ring the union solicitor though and hope he can pull a rabbit or two out of the hat, because right now I feel as if we are on a no winner!
PS…before the takeover he was permanantly on continental work…that is now being done by foreign drivers.
all the best for the fight,as one of the posters
said keep your option to talk to the press open
as they will be intrested in this type of case,
A truck is not mobile, it will have an operating base. Your hubbys contract should state where he turns up each day to pick up his truck. There also should be mention about what happens if they want to move the trucks operating base (and move your hubby therefore) If there is no mention of this Id argue they have made your hubby redundant by moving the truck such a distance, afterall ther is no truck where he turns up to drive. Get hold of your contract of employment and go over it.
It sounds like they are trying to save a few thousand pounds by not offering him redundancy, they are probalby hoping he does walk.
The best bet is to get hold of the union, youve paid for them they can do the job.
If your union rep works within the company he is likely to take the view of sacrificing your hubbys job just to save his own and a few of his mates, so just ignore him.
Thankyou Pete…we will certainly keep that in mind,
Ralliesport. Hubby’s contract does have the old address on it, and also it has allways been the base for the truck ever since he started there which was 8 years ago. There is no mention at all of what might happen if they want to move the operating base. All details are very basic…unless there is more stuff in the magic handbook which is never on view!
The union rep doesn’t work for the company…he is just a ******.
I feel so strongly about this…it gave me one hell of a nights sleep/lack of it last night! He has been in this business for donkey’s years and has allways given his best…to be treated like this is a disgrace.
Having said that…when I read some of the posts on here about how all of you are treated it makes me fume!
millie:
Thank you to everybody who has since added to this. Hubby received a phone call off the “boss” today. He informed him that they were not making him redundant ,but he could resign if he wanted to!! He did say that he will have a meeting with him next Monday and see if they can sort something out. Mmmm.
I rang ACAS and on this occasion they were truly “helful” Tagoat! The woman I spoke to was really up her own backside and wasn’t too interested in what I had to say. Basically she was of the opinion that if the job still existed…no matter where the base had moved to…then there would be no claim for redundancy, unless it could be proven that it was impossible to continue working for the company. She pointed out that seeing as he was still driving the truck then it wasn’t impossible!! As for the distance for getting home for the weekend, or truck “downtime” etc…she wasn’t interested!
She said to write to the company…which we allready have done and still received no reply. Then she said to write to them again and send it recorded delivery! I asked what he was supposed to do in the meantime, and the reply was that the longer he works for them the better their case is, but if he walks then it is unlikely that he would have a claim! Catch 22?
I think the attitude seems to be that because a truck is mobile, then it is ok and doesn’t matter where “base” is. Not only that but the main of his job is delivering in Ireland. He goes over on a Thursday and back Friday night. Down to the yard…swaps trailer for uk delivieries on Monday, and is home for Saturday lunchtime. If he now has to go to London instead, he won’t be able to get home! The foreign company that now run this show, aren’t bothered about that because they keep their own drivers out, chasing their backsides for 3 weeks at a time!!
It was a union rep that hubby spoke to…but after listening to the woman at ACAS this afternoon, I am now even more confused and wonder if there is a claim or not. A call to the union solicitor sounds like a good bet though. At least they should know what they are talking about, unlike the rep who has given two versions up to now!
Hitch…I have a feeling that the “sorting something out”, might include basing the truck somewhere nearer to us, but I can’t see how it can happen. I suppose we will have to wait and see!
Ralliesport…They didn’t notify him. There were rumours but that was it…then they were gone!! Good eh? There is no offer of compensation at all…they just said they thought he should be grateful to still have a job! Two of the drivers have allready walked off the job, which leaves 2 uk drivers and 3 international. It isn’t part of his contract to move, but the actual wording is “international driver” who might be required to do uk work as well. He hasn’t been over the water since the takeover though! It could be interpreted to suit whatever ,I suppose, though in actual fact I thought a “mobility” clause was supposed to be included to avoid any problems when re-locating?
Well…thankyou all very much for your input. I think we probably don’t have any choice but to wait and see what the “chief clown” throws up next week!
I still suspect that things will be made as difficult as possible in the hope that hubby and the other remaining uk driver will walk…then they will replace them with their own drivers and it won’t have cost them a penny.
We will ring the union solicitor though and hope he can pull a rabbit or two out of the hat, because right now I feel as if we are on a no winner!
PS…before the takeover he was permanantly on continental work…that is now being done by foreign drivers.
That’s exactly the advice you need. (see the bit underlined)
Prove that it isn’t possible to continue doing the job as per.
That IS the advice to you! The ball is in your court now. You now know what you have to do.
From what you’ve said, I’d say that you could prove your case.
ACAS is there to GIVE advice. NOT to actually “do” anything for you. You have to do this for yourself.
They give FREE, up to date, impartial, legal employment advice (which is what they have done) And, by the way, that sort of advice is damned rare anywhere these days (as you’ve discovered via the union)
So, get about proving that the job is untenable, whilst you await “rabbits being drawn from hats!”
Employers (from any country) DEPEND upon employees doing NOTHING or knowing nothing.
To use the vernacular: you have a clown playing with his balls? Take them off him, and play with them yourself! 
Good luck.