Thought I had it all understood until I read someone elses thread on here. Sick of these hours…
I’m not worried about the driving time it’s the daily working time I’m worried about. Don’t ask why but I was under the assumption you can work max 15 hours a day and must have a 15 min break every 6 hours of work. Because of this I’m worried about if I have not have sufficient break time for my working hours or if I have gone over the max daily working time.
I’ve worked at Thursday, Friday and Saturday. I’ve attached pictures of each day as it’ll be easier for you to all see.
Here is a picture of my print out for Thursday:
Started at 05:56, 16 minute break at 11:19 then a 46 minute break at 14:28 and finished work at 17:08.
Started at 6:55, 1 hour break at 11:13, 1 hour break at 17:52 and finished at 19:46.
Started at 5:15, 1 hour 2 min break at 10:43, finished at 14.28.
Had Sunday and Monday off and working 5:10am tomorrow morning.
Okay thanks. So max is 13 hours a day which can be increased to 15 hours twice a week? Does that have to be compensated for after?
What about the 6 hourly rest. I thought every 6 hours I need a 15 minute break but found out that 6 hours is 15 mins, 6-9 hours is 30 mins?
Another question, if I have both my 4.5 hour driving rest and 6 hour break at the same time, my 15 minute break isn’t part of the 45 minute break is it? I’d have to have a 45 min and a 15 min break?
If you work as a driver for a company, duty time is any working time. If you’re self-employed, duty time is only time you spend driving the vehicle or doing other work related to the vehicle or its load.
Daily duty limit
You must not be on duty for more than 11 hours in any working day. This limit doesn’t apply on any working day when you don’t drive.
That means I have gone over my limits 2 days out of the 3? Or does my hour breaks get taken off my duty time?
If you work as a driver for a company, duty time is any working time. If you’re self-employed, duty time is only time you spend driving the vehicle or doing other work related to the vehicle or its load.
Daily duty limit
You must not be on duty for more than 11 hours in any working day. This limit doesn’t apply on any working day when you don’t drive.
That means I have gone over my limits 2 days out of the 3? Or does my hour breaks get taken off my duty time?
That’s for domestic regulations, are you on EU regulations or UK domestic regulations ?
All looks fine to me. If you are doing a 13 hour spread a 45 on it’s own wouldn’t be sufficient for your wtd breaks because you can’t work for more than 6 hours without a break. However if you split your 45 into a 15 and a 30 then you could technicaly do a 13hour or even a 15hour shift with just 45 minutes of breaks. There is no requirement to compensate for reduced daily rest periods.
If you work as a driver for a company, duty time is any working time. If you’re self-employed, duty time is only time you spend driving the vehicle or doing other work related to the vehicle or its load.
Daily duty limit
You must not be on duty for more than 11 hours in any working day. This limit doesn’t apply on any working day when you don’t drive.
That means I have gone over my limits 2 days out of the 3? Or does my hour breaks get taken off my duty time?
That’s for domestic regulations, are you on EU regulations or UK domestic regulations ?
How would I find out? It’s for AF Blakemore in Hastings delivering to Spar Services/Stores.
nurburg340:
Okay thanks. So max is 13 hours a day which can be increased to 15 hours twice a week? Does that have to be compensated for after?
No compensation for reduced daily rest - only for reduced weekly rest
nurburg340:
What about the 6 hourly rest. I thought every 6 hours I need a 15 minute break but found out that 6 hours is 15 mins, 6-9 hours is 30 mins?
You cannot work more than 6 hours without taking a break. The break must be at least 15 minutes in length. If working between 6-9 hours then your breaks must total 30 minutes (2×15 min or 1x30 - you cant do 3x10)
nurburg340:
Another question, if I have both my 4.5 hour driving rest and 6 hour break at the same time, my 15 minute break isn’t part of the 45 minute break is it? I’d have to have a 45 min and a 15 min break?
You can count the break towards both duty and driving time. If its for driving then the second break must be at least 30 minutes long in order to reset your drive time. (3x15 won’t reset your drive time. 1x30 followed by 1x15 won’t either. It must be 1x15 followed by 1x30 or 1x45)
If you work as a driver for a company, duty time is any working time. If you’re self-employed, duty time is only time you spend driving the vehicle or doing other work related to the vehicle or its load.
Daily duty limit
You must not be on duty for more than 11 hours in any working day. This limit doesn’t apply on any working day when you don’t drive.
That means I have gone over my limits 2 days out of the 3? Or does my hour breaks get taken off my duty time?
That’s for domestic regulations, are you on EU regulations or UK domestic regulations ?
How would I find out? It’s for AF Blakemore in Hastings delivering to Spar Services/Stores.
Pretty sure if it has a digi tacho then it falls under EU law?
dreamingofoz:
All looks fine to me. If you are doing a 13 hour spread a 45 on it’s own wouldn’t be sufficient for your wtd breaks because you can’t work for more than 6 hours without a break. However if you split your 45 into a 15 and a 30 then you could technicaly do a 13hour or even a 15hour shift with just 45 minutes of breaks. There is no requirement to compensate for reduced daily rest periods.
Okay so I do a 13 hour working shift, increased to 15 hours 2 days a week.
Every 6 hours working time I need 15 minutes break and every 4.5 driving time 45 minutes break?
So if I do a 12 hour day I would need a total of 30 minute break (2 x 15 min for each 6 hour) (excluding driving break).
nurburg340:
Okay thanks. So max is 13 hours a day which can be increased to 15 hours twice a week? Does that have to be compensated for after?
No compensation for reduced daily rest - only for reduced weekly rest
nurburg340:
What about the 6 hourly rest. I thought every 6 hours I need a 15 minute break but found out that 6 hours is 15 mins, 6-9 hours is 30 mins?
You cannot work more than 6 hours without taking a break. The break must be at least 15 minutes in length. If working between 6-9 hours then your breaks must total 30 minutes (2×15 min or 1x30 - you cant do 3x10)
nurburg340:
Another question, if I have both my 4.5 hour driving rest and 6 hour break at the same time, my 15 minute break isn’t part of the 45 minute break is it? I’d have to have a 45 min and a 15 min break?
You can count the break towards both duty and driving time. If its for driving then the second break must be at least 30 minutes long in order to reset your drive time. (3x15 won’t reset your drive time. 1x30 followed by 1x15 won’t either. It must be 1x15 followed by 1x30 or 1x45)
So in theory you only need 30 minutes for actual driving rest? So a 45 minute break would reset my driving time and duty time? Or first 15 mins (duty time) and 30 minutes (driving time)?
nurburg340:
So max is 13 hours a day which can be increased to 15 hours twice a week? Does that have to be compensated for after?
The maximum spread-over from the start of the shift to the end of the shift is 13 hours which can be increased to 15 hours three times between weekly rest periods.
As has been said no compensation is required for reduced daily rest periods.
I know this isn’t me being very helpful but just get yourself booked onto a Driver CPC course locally that covers drivers hours and ensure you ask all your questions rather than just sit here as some people do. It’ll be a lot easier than trying to decipher multiple answers you are going to get on here all saying the same thing in different ways.
I get this a lot at the moment as most drivers coming through DCPC at the moment are those returning to driving after years away or those just turning to driving having never done any before. I find the best sessions are where we simply go through their own working days and hours explaining how this fits (or in some cases doesn’t) the rules etc. Not all DCPC providers will operate this way though and some only know how to read off the powerpoint.
Everything you need to know is in this publication Sign in to GOV.UK - GOV.UK Signon but you will likely find it much easier to understand if you go and sit on a course where you can ask questions.
I don’t think you are fully understanding the answers you are getting on here even though most are very good answers.
nurburg340:
Okay thanks. So max is 13 hours a day which can be increased to 15 hours twice a week? Does that have to be compensated for after?
No compensation for reduced daily rest - only for reduced weekly rest
nurburg340:
What about the 6 hourly rest. I thought every 6 hours I need a 15 minute break but found out that 6 hours is 15 mins, 6-9 hours is 30 mins?
You cannot work more than 6 hours without taking a break. The break must be at least 15 minutes in length. If working between 6-9 hours then your breaks must total 30 minutes (2×15 min or 1x30 - you cant do 3x10)
nurburg340:
Another question, if I have both my 4.5 hour driving rest and 6 hour break at the same time, my 15 minute break isn’t part of the 45 minute break is it? I’d have to have a 45 min and a 15 min break?
You can count the break towards both duty and driving time. If its for driving then the second break must be at least 30 minutes long in order to reset your drive time. (3x15 won’t reset your drive time. 1x30 followed by 1x15 won’t either. It must be 1x15 followed by 1x30 or 1x45)
So in theory you only need 30 minutes for actual driving rest? So a 45 minute break would reset my driving time and duty time? Or first 15 mins (duty time) and 30 minutes (driving time)?
To reset your drive time you need to show a 45 minute break (this can be 1x15 and 1x30 or 1x45. It cannot be 1x30 followed by 1x15)
This also resets your working time clock as well. There is no need to have a break for your driving time followed by a seperate break for your WTD 6 hour rule.
You’re maybe over complicating it by thinking you need two types of break.
As your doing multidrop your 6 hour rule will most likely be needed before you get near 4.5 hours driving so heres an example.
Start 06:00 work until 10:00 (take 15 mins ) work until 12:45 (take 30 mins <this combined with your earlier 15 is the 45 required to reset your drive time> ) finish 19:00
Thats a 13 hour day all legal with only 45 minutes worth of breaks. This is also assuming you’re doing less than 4.5 hours driving between starting and your second break and between finishing your second break and going home.
EDIT: after looking at your printouts it looks like you do less than 5-6 hours driving the whole day so the above example should be OK.
nurburg340:
Okay thanks. So max is 13 hours a day which can be increased to 15 hours twice a week? Does that have to be compensated for after?
No compensation for reduced daily rest - only for reduced weekly rest
nurburg340:
What about the 6 hourly rest. I thought every 6 hours I need a 15 minute break but found out that 6 hours is 15 mins, 6-9 hours is 30 mins?
You cannot work more than 6 hours without taking a break. The break must be at least 15 minutes in length. If working between 6-9 hours then your breaks must total 30 minutes (2×15 min or 1x30 - you cant do 3x10)
nurburg340:
Another question, if I have both my 4.5 hour driving rest and 6 hour break at the same time, my 15 minute break isn’t part of the 45 minute break is it? I’d have to have a 45 min and a 15 min break?
You can count the break towards both duty and driving time. If its for driving then the second break must be at least 30 minutes long in order to reset your drive time. (3x15 won’t reset your drive time. 1x30 followed by 1x15 won’t either. It must be 1x15 followed by 1x30 or 1x45)
So in theory you only need 30 minutes for actual driving rest? So a 45 minute break would reset my driving time and duty time? Or first 15 mins (duty time) and 30 minutes (driving time)?
To reset your drive time you need to show a 45 minute break (this can be 1x15 and 1x30 or 1x45. It cannot be 1x30 followed by 1x15) This also resets your working time clock as well. There is no need to have a break for your driving time followed by a seperate break for your WTD 6 hour rule. You’re maybe over complicating it by thinking you need two types of break.
As your doing multidrop your 6 hour rule will most likely be needed before you get near 4.5 hours driving so heres an example.
Start 06:00 work until 10:00 (take 15 mins ) work until 12:45 (take 30 mins <this combined with your earlier 15 is the 45 required to reset your drive time>) finish 19:00
Thats a 13 hour day all legal with only 45 minutes worth of breaks. This is also assuming you’re doing less than 4.5 hours driving between starting and your second break and between finishing your second break and going home.
EDIT: after looking at your printouts it looks like you do less than 5-6 hours driving the whole day so the above example should be OK.
m1cks:
Start 06:00 work until 10:00 (take 15 mins ) work until 12:45 (take 30 mins <this combined with your earlier 15 is the 45 required to reset your drive time>) finish 19:00.
12:15 in that scenario. 12:45 would be 6.5 hours work.
m1cks:
Start 06:00 work until 10:00 (take 15 mins ) work until 12:45 (take 30 mins <this combined with your earlier 15 is the 45 required to reset your drive time>) finish 19:00.
12:15 in that scenario. 12:45 would be 6.5 hours work.
If he starts at 06:00 and has a 15 minute break at 10:00, assuming he doesn’t need a driving break he could work past 12:45 if he wanted to, he could go on until 16:15 before needing another WTD break.
m1cks:
Start 06:00 work until 10:00 (take 15 mins ) work until 12:45 (take 30 mins <this combined with your earlier 15 is the 45 required to reset your drive time>) finish 19:00.
12:15 in that scenario. 12:45 would be 6.5 hours work.
If he starts at 06:00 and has a 15 minute break at 10:00, assuming he doesn’t need a driving break he could work past 12:45 if he wanted to, he could go on until 16:15 before needing another WTD break.
Indeed, I didn’t think it through completely when I answered. It’s been a long day, I had to work fir three hours.
