ERF-NGC-European:
Carryfast:
dave docwra:
Carryfast:
Oh, lordy I’ve gone and mentioned Rover. We’ll get the 3500 P4 and the P5 thrown in now. What have I doneRo
Indeed this is going to cause problems, I knew I was wrong with my views when I saw our dear CF had used the word logical in his reply.
ERF-NGC-European:
Fair enough Robert.At least it’s a better discussion than Bewick just saying it’s a misprint it should say 180. 
…
David
Carryfast:
ERF-NGC-European:
Fair enough Robert.At least it’s a better discussion than Bewick just saying it’s a misprint it should say 180.
By the way, the only Big-J I ever drove was on yard shunting duties with an ex-BOC unit. It had a 180 Gardner, 6-sp DB box and no power steering because apparently it was a cancelled export order! My last Rover was a P4 Btw, loved 'em! Ro
ERF-NGC-European:
Carryfast:
ERF-NGC-European:
Fair enough Robert.At least it’s a better discussion than Bewick just saying it’s a misprint it should say 180.
By the way, the only Big-J I ever drove was on yard shunting duties with an ex-BOC unit. It had a 180 Gardner, 6-sp DB box and no power steering because apparently it was a cancelled export order! My last Rover was a P4 Btw, loved 'em! Ro
Are you sure that the Big J had the DB box and not the Thorneycroft 6 speed which was the standard fitting in the Big J & 180 LXB ? Cheers Bewick.
Bewick:
ERF-NGC-European:
Carryfast:
ERF-NGC-European:
Fair enough Robert.At least it’s a better discussion than Bewick just saying it’s a misprint it should say 180.
By the way, the only Big-J I ever drove was on yard shunting duties with an ex-BOC unit. It had a 180 Gardner, 6-sp DB box and no power steering because apparently it was a cancelled export order! My last Rover was a P4 Btw, loved 'em! Ro
Are you sure that the Big J had the DB box and not the Thorneycroft 6 speed which was the standard fitting in the Big J & 180 LXB ? Cheers Bewick.
No Bewick, I’m not sure! It was very early '80s, when I knew a lot less about what 'boxes went with what lorries.I recorded it in my driver’s diary as a 6-sp box. I would then have gone home and looked up what Big-Js had by way of 6-sp transmission, blissfully unaware in those days that certain engine/gearbox combinations were the norm. So I’ll bet you are right! As I never got it out on the road I can’t report on its performance but it was deffo not synchomesh. Anyone on here who drove for BOC Transhield out of the Oare depot in Faversham in the '70s should be able to testify one way or the other. It was the shunter at A&RJ Woods at Teynham when I drove it. It’s reg was TKO 467S (the late ‘S’ - long after Big-Js finished, reflects that it was a cancelled order batch). Here’s a pic I took after I had parked it. Not very clear I’m afraid.
Ro.
I believe that Guy Motors in pre Big J days used the DB box behind the Gardner engined Invincibles and the Turner 5 speed behind the 7:7 AEC engine Warriors. I think that once Guy Motors via Jaguar ownership joined the Leyland Group they started using the Thorneycroft 6 speed box as well as the Eaton Fuller 610 particularly behind the ■■■■■■■ 205/220. I stand to be corrected but Thorneycroft had originally been taken over by AEC so I assume it was their “in house” axles and gearboxes were the cheaper alternative. I stand to be corrected although all six of the Big J’s we ran at Bewick Transport all had the 180LXB and the “Thorney” 6 speed box. Cheers Bewick.
Bewick:
I believe that Guy Motors in pre Big J days used the DB box behind the Gardner engined Invincibles and the Turner 5 speed behind the 7:7 AEC engine Warriors. I think that once Guy Motors via Jaguar ownership joined the Leyland Group they started using the Thorneycroft 6 speed box as well as the Eaton Fuller 610 particularly behind the ■■■■■■■ 205/220. I stand to be corrected but Thorneycroft had originally been taken over by AEC so I assume it was their “in house” axles and gearboxes were the cheaper alternative. I stand to be corrected although all six of the Big J’s we ran at Bewick Transport all had the 180LXB and the “Thorney” 6 speed box. Cheers Bewick.
It was the Thorneycroft / AEC D203 6-speed gearbox, used in Mandators, Mammoth Majors, Marshal Majors, also used behind the Leyland O.680 in the Scammell Handyman. And probably something else I can’t remember now. You are quite correct it was BL group policy to use components from within the group if possible. They did have range change and splitter multi-ratio versions of the Thorneycroft / AEC “D” series 'boxes but they weren’t beefy enough for the torque of the big ■■■■■■■ engines.
And a bit of useless information, I was looking something up today and came across some publicity for the DB 6-speed 'box. It was available from 1962, I hadn’t realized it was as early as that.
With regard to the Thorney box GF you stirred the old brain cell and although I can’t recall the circumstances exactly but we did have a problem, not serious IIRC, but it concerned oil capacity in one of the gearboxes and I contacted the factory at Fallings Park who couldn’t have been more helpful with the upshot being they sent us F.O.C. an “elbow” with which to replace the existing flat oil filling “bung” which in turn increased the oil capacity of the box. But for the life of me I can’t recall if it was just the one Big J or we fitted all 6 boxes with the “mod”. If I was to dig out my old telephone contact book I’m sure I could quote Guy Motors telephone no. and possibly the name of the Chap I dealt with. But I can say again they couldn’t have been more accommodating ! Cheers Dennis.
Not an 8LXB engined Guy, but we were a Guy sub-agent and serviced a four wheeler with (I think?) an Eaton 5 speed box and to check the oil on that you removed the level plug and let the excess run out, then remove the filler and add 1 pint! I could never quite see the reasoning in that? 
Pete.
By the way, the only Big-J I ever drove was on yard shunting duties with an ex-BOC unit. It had a 180 Gardner, 6-sp DB box and no power steering because apparently it was a cancelled export order! My last Rover was a P4 Btw, loved 'em! Ro
[/quote]
Are you sure that the Big J had the DB box and not the Thorneycroft 6 speed which was the standard fitting in the Big J & 180 LXB ? Cheers Bewick.
[/quote]
No Bewick, I’m not sure! It was very early '80s, when I knew a lot less about what 'boxes went with what lorries.I recorded it in my driver’s diary as a 6-sp box. I would then have gone home and looked up what Big-Js had by way of 6-sp transmission, blissfully unaware in those days that certain engine/gearbox combinations were the norm. So I’ll bet you are right! As I never got it out on the road I can’t report on its performance but it was deffo not synchomesh. Anyone on here who drove for BOC Transhield out of the Oare depot in Faversham in the '70s should be able to testify one way or the other. It was the shunter at A&RJ Woods at Teynham when I drove it. It’s reg was TKO 467S (the late ‘S’ - long after Big-Js finished, reflects that it was a cancelled order batch). Here’s a pic I took after I had parked it. Not very clear I’m afraid.
Ro.
0
[/quote]
Going slightly off -topic here, but is that a curtainsider with a fridge unit mounted Robert? That must have been quite something back in the day? Even nowadays it’s bit of a unusual setup? Please forgive me my sheer ignorance regarding fridge trailers…
Cheers, Patrick
Yikes Dennis, imagine how close we have come to concluding the 8LXB / Big j mystery if your black phone book contained a mobile no for Fallings Park contact!!!
Maybe our closest near miss yet ? 
Hope you are continuing with your good lady to remain safe in these difficult times, been quite nice on me last 5 weeks with sunshine and a rather large garden to enjoy it in, last 2 days total misery i must add 
due to rain!
Be safe& KEEP RACKING THE BRAIN ON THIS TOPIC…….you know it makes sense.
E.W.
EW car truck & bus:
Yikes Dennis, imagine how close we have come to concluding the 8LXB / Big j mystery if your black phone book contained a mobile no for Fallings Park contact!!!Maybe our closest near miss yet ?
Bewick is hiding the fact that he did ask if he could have some 240 BigJ’s and they told him only retrofit special order with a long wait so he let it go.Some say he still sits there to this day counting his lost earnings and swearing about Gardner’s rationing policy.
EW car truck & bus:
Yikes Dennis, imagine how close we have come to concluding the 8LXB / Big j mystery if your black phone book contained a mobile no for Fallings Park contact!!!Maybe our closest near miss yet ?
Hope you are continuing with your good lady to remain safe in these difficult times, been quite nice on me last 5 weeks with sunshine and a rather large garden to enjoy it in, last 2 days total misery i must add
Be safe& KEEP RACKING THE BRAIN ON THIS TOPIC…….you know it makes sense.
E.W.
Mobile number??!! 
David
Bewick:
I believe that Guy Motors in pre Big J days used the DB box behind the Gardner engined Invincibles and the Turner 5 speed behind the 7:7 AEC engine Warriors. I think that once Guy Motors via Jaguar ownership joined the Leyland Group they started using the Thorneycroft 6 speed box as well as the Eaton Fuller 610 particularly behind the ■■■■■■■ 205/220. I stand to be corrected but Thorneycroft had originally been taken over by AEC so I assume it was their “in house” axles and gearboxes were the cheaper alternative. I stand to be corrected although all six of the Big J’s we ran at Bewick Transport all had the 180LXB and the “Thorney” 6 speed box. Cheers Bewick.
Thanks Bewick, for that. In a way I’m quite chuffed it was a Thorny box because, ironically, I’ve always fancied using one. Pity, then, I didn’t take it out on the road! Cheers, Ro
tounge in cheek David 
(or stoking the fire )
take care E.W.
gingerfold:
Bewick:
I believe that Guy Motors in pre Big J days used the DB box behind the Gardner engined Invincibles and the Turner 5 speed behind the 7:7 AEC engine Warriors. I think that once Guy Motors via Jaguar ownership joined the Leyland Group they started using the Thorneycroft 6 speed box as well as the Eaton Fuller 610 particularly behind the ■■■■■■■ 205/220. I stand to be corrected but Thorneycroft had originally been taken over by AEC so I assume it was their “in house” axles and gearboxes were the cheaper alternative. I stand to be corrected although all six of the Big J’s we ran at Bewick Transport all had the 180LXB and the “Thorney” 6 speed box. Cheers Bewick.It was the Thorneycroft / AEC D203 6-speed gearbox, used in Mandators, Mammoth Majors, Marshal Majors, also used behind the Leyland O.680 in the Scammell Handyman. And probably something else I can’t remember now. You are quite correct it was BL group policy to use components from within the group if possible. They did have range change and splitter multi-ratio versions of the Thorneycroft / AEC “D” series 'boxes but they weren’t beefy enough for the torque of the big ■■■■■■■ engines.
And a bit of useless information, I was looking something up today and came across some publicity for the DB 6-speed 'box. It was available from 1962, I hadn’t realized it was as early as that.
Thanks GF! All grist to the mill. We are still living and learning, long after we hung up our overalls! Ro
pv83:
By the way, the only Big-J I ever drove was on yard shunting duties with an ex-BOC unit. It had a 180 Gardner, 6-sp DB box and no power steering because apparently it was a cancelled export order! My last Rover was a P4 Btw, loved 'em! Ro
Are you sure that the Big J had the DB box and not the Thorneycroft 6 speed which was the standard fitting in the Big J & 180 LXB ? Cheers Bewick.
[/quote]
No Bewick, I’m not sure! It was very early '80s, when I knew a lot less about what 'boxes went with what lorries.I recorded it in my driver’s diary as a 6-sp box. I would then have gone home and looked up what Big-Js had by way of 6-sp transmission, blissfully unaware in those days that certain engine/gearbox combinations were the norm. So I’ll bet you are right! As I never got it out on the road I can’t report on its performance but it was deffo not synchomesh. Anyone on here who drove for BOC Transhield out of the Oare depot in Faversham in the '70s should be able to testify one way or the other. It was the shunter at A&RJ Woods at Teynham when I drove it. It’s reg was TKO 467S (the late ‘S’ - long after Big-Js finished, reflects that it was a cancelled order batch). Here’s a pic I took after I had parked it. Not very clear I’m afraid.
Ro.
0
[/quote]
Going slightly off -topic here, but is that a curtainsider with a fridge unit mounted Robert? That must have been quite something back in the day? Even nowadays it’s bit of a unusual setup? Please forgive me my sheer ignorance regarding fridge trailers…
Cheers, Patrick
[/quote]
They were called Insuliners, PV, and were commonplace in the '80s but they were not efficient for constant opening and shutting of the curtains such as you get with farm collection work. IIRC they eventually fell foul of food safety regs. Someone’ll put us right! Ro
ERF-NGC-European:
pv83:
By the way, the only Big-J I ever drove was on yard shunting duties with an ex-BOC unit. It had a 180 Gardner, 6-sp DB box and no power steering because apparently it was a cancelled export order! My last Rover was a P4 Btw, loved 'em! RoAre you sure that the Big J had the DB box and not the Thorneycroft 6 speed which was the standard fitting in the Big J & 180 LXB ? Cheers Bewick.
No Bewick, I’m not sure! It was very early '80s, when I knew a lot less about what 'boxes went with what lorries.I recorded it in my driver’s diary as a 6-sp box. I would then have gone home and looked up what Big-Js had by way of 6-sp transmission, blissfully unaware in those days that certain engine/gearbox combinations were the norm. So I’ll bet you are right! As I never got it out on the road I can’t report on its performance but it was deffo not synchomesh. Anyone on here who drove for BOC Transhield out of the Oare depot in Faversham in the '70s should be able to testify one way or the other. It was the shunter at A&RJ Woods at Teynham when I drove it. It’s reg was TKO 467S (the late ‘S’ - long after Big-Js finished, reflects that it was a cancelled order batch). Here’s a pic I took after I had parked it. Not very clear I’m afraid.
Ro.
0
[/quote]
Going slightly off -topic here, but is that a curtainsider with a fridge unit mounted Robert? That must have been quite something back in the day? Even nowadays it’s bit of a unusual setup? Please forgive me my sheer ignorance regarding fridge trailers…
Cheers, Patrick
[/quote]
They were called Insuliners, PV, and were commonplace in the '80s but they were not efficient for constant opening and shutting of the curtains such as you get with farm collection work. IIRC they eventually fell foul of food safety regs. Someone’ll put us right! Ro
[/quote]
And the curtains were bloody heavy to drag back and forth as well!
Bewick:
With regard to the Thorney box GF you stirred the old brain cell and although I can’t recall the circumstances exactly but we did have a problem, not serious IIRC, but it concerned oil capacity in one of the gearboxes and I contacted the factory at Fallings Park who couldn’t have been more helpful with the upshot being they sent us F.O.C. an “elbow” with which to replace the existing flat oil filling “bung” which in turn increased the oil capacity of the box. But for the life of me I can’t recall if it was just the one Big J or we fitted all 6 boxes with the “mod”. If I was to dig out my old telephone contact book I’m sure I could quote Guy Motors telephone no. and possibly the name of the Chap I dealt with. But I can say again they couldn’t have been more accommodating ! Cheers Dennis.
Morning Dennis, yes that was the factory modification to increase oil capacity, a simple, cheap and effective solution.
Something else that came to mind overnight… it’s amazing what pops into my head when I wake up in a morning… the AEC gearbox “D” prefix went all the way back to the early years of the company, I think the earliest gearbox was a D124.
