Own Account Driver:
It won’t be a popular view but I think 24 is too young for driving coaches full of people. Most of your driving commonsense comes from the years on the road and near misses.
It probably won’t go down to well with SmashedCrabFace and some other members of this forum who are lucky to be young enough to know everything, but I completely agree with you.
Is everyone sure he didn’t plead guilty to “causing death by CARELESS driving”? 
I wouldn’t have thought anyone would plead guilty to DANGEROUS driving, anymore than someone would likely say “I didn’t kill anyone, but I plead guilty to being a ■■■■■”…
Appears he changed his plea to guilty at the start of the trial so he shouldn’t have been given any credit for an early guilty plea
Whatever anyone says this fella got a very light sentence and in no way does it reflect the seriousness of the offence 
The BBC news website does report it as saying he admitted ‘causing death by dangerous driving’
Regards
Dave Penn;
Own Account Driver:
It won’t be a popular view but I think 24 is too young for driving coaches full of people. Most of your driving commonsense comes from the years on the road and near misses.I also don’t understand the sentences it’s like a sacrifice on the altar of the victims family’s grief/closure that I can’t really get my head round how it stops it happening again. What’s an extended re-test going to do either unless it goes on so long until it gets foggy at some point.
I do not agree with your opinion about 24 being too young,i was driving lorries @ 21 all over the Uk & Europe with no problems,i had been bought up in & around lorries & all i wanted to do was drive them.While i agree that the coach driver was going too quick for the conditions,coach driving was his chosen career & had taken the training & passed the required test.
Out of curiosity what age do you propose new drivers should be,coach or lorry ?
Will:
Own Account Driver:
It won’t be a popular view but I think 24 is too young for driving coaches full of people. Most of your driving commonsense comes from the years on the road and near misses.I also don’t understand the sentences it’s like a sacrifice on the altar of the victims family’s grief/closure that I can’t really get my head round how it stops it happening again. What’s an extended re-test going to do either unless it goes on so long until it gets foggy at some point.
I do not agree with your opinion about 24 being too young,i was driving lorries @ 21 all over the Uk & Europe with no problems,i had been bought up in & around lorries & all i wanted to do was drive them.While i agree that the coach driver was going too quick for the conditions,coach driving was his chosen career & had taken the training & passed the required test.
Out of curiosity what age do you propose new drivers should be,coach or lorry ?
I truanted from school and worked on a farm at 14 and illegally drove tractors on the public highway and it was all fine. I still don’t advocate this being a generally good idea that should be rolled out nationwide.
I don’t see the point of posts like ‘I did this, it was fine, are you saying I shouldn’t have been able to etc.’ I can’t get insurance for anyone under 25 to drive any vehicle whatever class and most that are out there are the gaffer’s kids when the gaffer can twist the insurers arm. Clearly, is this some sort of sinister agenda on the part of insurers to have a downer on young people?
Out of curiosity what age do you propose new drivers should be,coach or lorry ?
DEFINATLEY NOT 18
Own Account Driver:
It won’t be a popular view but I think 24 is too young for driving coaches full of people. Most of your driving commonsense comes from the years on the road and near misses.
I was 23 when I passed my manual PSV in a ‘crash box’ Leyland Leopard and drove services busses and national coaches for 7yrs before going HGV - age is just a number, some people are just more mature than others.
davepenn54:
Er NOAdmitting to causing death by dangerous driving usually carries a much heavier sentence even when showing remorse.
sentencingcouncil.judiciary.gov. … deline.pdf
He got a very light sentence for deliberately driving dangerously in poor road conditions
Regards
Dave Penn;
Sorry mate, but that’s BULL CRAP! Next time it’s foggy, just look at the furthest point you can see and ask if you could stop before your vehicle passed it, the answer will be no, in fact, you’ll have passed it whilst thinking about that question.
I’ve already said that being on the limiter was a bad choice, but you and I also wouldn’t have been down to 10 - 15mph on a motorway, we’d have been most likely around 30 - 40mph.
Now, about the scheduling, of course it shouldn’t define how you drive, but it does affect all of us in our jobs, nobody can deny that. I’m not saying it turns us into dangerous drivers, but even our tacho’s affect the way we drive when ‘break’ is flashing up and that micra is doing 45 in the roadworks or whatever.
waynedl:
62mph - the legal limit for his vehicle?? No it’s not, 70mph is, it’s limited to around 62mph (100kpm) muppets.Tough call, he SHOULD have slowed down, but scheduling often cencourages people to go quicker than they should.
When on busses, we always sped, it was that bad that at the top of the running board it said “observe all speed limits” and when a camera van was on a route it used to come over the radio “all drivers on the 192’s, observe the instructions at the top of your running board” - code for watch out for a copper.
When I went onto coaches, I slowed down a lot, but when I went onto multi-drop I sped up again, then containers slowed me right down.
Scheduling pressures, tacho and wtd limits etc all play a massive part in how fast people drive when the conditions aren’t suitable, but also some people are just idiots and will drive too quick anyway - and I probably still do if I’m honest. Who REALLY slows down to a speed where they’d be capable of stopping in the distance they can see in dense fog? If you did, you’d have someone hit you from behind, so you make a risk assessment and run at a speed where HOPEFULLY you can stop but if not you’d not be going flat out, but also nobody HOPEFULLY will hit the rear of you flat out.
The limit was too fast, there’s no doubting that, and he did cause the deaths by his driving, but I’d like the scheduling to be taken into consideration.
Anyone of any age that drives to fast for the conditions are completely utter and dangerous idiots.
Schedules, tacho’s, jit deliveries dont matter one iota compared to injuries, accidents or deaths.
My mantra is and always will be ARRIVE ALIVE.
why did he admit to it?
obviously had a [zb] brief.
he was driving at the legal limit for his vehicle, and there was slow moving traffic in front of him.
who’s fault was it really? if they didn’t travel so slow, then it wouldn’t have happened.
but if the guy wants to talk himself into 12 months behind bars, then that’s up to him.
limeyphil:
why did he admit to it?
obviously had a [zb] brief.
he was driving at the legal limit for his vehicle, and there was slow moving traffic in front of him.
who’s fault was it really? if they didn’t travel so slow, then it wouldn’t have happened.but if the guy wants to talk himself into 12 months behind bars, then that’s up to him.
Are you for real you idiot. Haven’t you got some ■■■■ to smuggle or something, rather than hit out with that verbal turd of a statement
When I drove buses I was always late as I wouldn’t speed or jump lights and guess what nothing happened the planet kept on spinning. My point is if a schedule is too tight then sod it, that’s the company’s fault not yours
nearly there:
limeyphil:
why did he admit to it?
obviously had a [zb] brief.
he was driving at the legal limit for his vehicle, and there was slow moving traffic in front of him.
who’s fault was it really? if they didn’t travel so slow, then it wouldn’t have happened.but if the guy wants to talk himself into 12 months behind bars, then that’s up to him.
Are you for real you idiot. Haven’t you got some ■■■■ to smuggle or something, rather than hit out with that verbal turd of a statement
do we know how long he’d been in the fog? a few seconds? several minutes? no.
Forget it …Not worth it!
bigvern1:
For someone who is a top driver…You spend an insane amount of time on this forum. Careful now LyingPhil.
like you’ve been told before.
there’s a very good reason why i’m not working, and it’s because someone needs looking after.
something you of all people should know about.
I do know. That’s why I tried to edit out. I apologize.
bigvern1:
I do know. That’s why I tried to edit out. I apologize.
[zb] me, that’s a first. 
Nah, when I’m wrong…I’m wrong.
Harry Monk:
Own Account Driver:
It won’t be a popular view but I think 24 is too young for driving coaches full of people. Most of your driving commonsense comes from the years on the road and near misses.It probably won’t go down to well with SmashedCrabFace and some other members of this forum who are lucky to be young enough to know everything, but I completely agree with you.
Well what age should you be able to do your test 30 40 50?
I passed my hgv at 21 and managed not to commit to much carnage a new driver is still laming in road experience wether there 18 or 58
kr79:
Harry Monk:
Own Account Driver:
It won’t be a popular view but I think 24 is too young for driving coaches full of people. Most of your driving commonsense comes from the years on the road and near misses.It probably won’t go down to well with SmashedCrabFace and some other members of this forum who are lucky to be young enough to know everything, but I completely agree with you.
Well what age should you be able to do your test 30 40 50?
I passed my hgv at 21 and managed not to commit to much carnage a new driver is still laming in road experience wether there 18 or 58
i don’t agree. although they shouldn’t have dropped it to 18 as they have now.
but whatever age you pass your test, you still need experience in that type of vehicle.
so if you pass at 21, and crash at 23. or you pass at 30, and crash at 32. then either way you’ve only got 2 years experience.
I passed at Class 3 at 18 on the original Young Drivers Training Scheme. Never had a bump for years and years. I had a few near misses and sphincter clenching moments though… 
Like a previous poster, I was working on a farm at 13 or 14 and driving all manner of agricultural kit on the road without a problem. The best training possible, in my opinion…
Now, as we all know, kids aren’t allowed anywhere near any big, nasty smelly vehicles so don’t get a basic knowledge into the practicalities of the job at all…
