Nite Owl:
I did speak to the union rep who told me and I quote [zb] off your not in the union.
.
I missed that bit when I answered your o/p last night.
So you aint in the Union after all then…, presumably because of some drip fed induced ‘divide and conquer’ (apparently they work ) type principles? that we hear everyday, where you…
‘’’ Wouldn’t join a [zb] union if your life depended on it’‘/’‘look what happened in the 70s’‘/’‘only in it for themselves’‘/’‘do more harm than good’’ blah [zb] blah …type thing,
On the other hand though, it’s blatantly evident at your firm that the guys in the Union have better t’s. and c.s …(no [zb] , funny that eh?)
Then you say the Union rep aint intersted in your ‘‘plight’’ ■■ really ■■ :…can’t think why that is.
Maybe there’s a message in there somewhere.
So in one post you want everyone to have fair treatment, but then you write the above?
To summarise, your in favour of discrimination in the work place and every one deserves it if they didn’t join a union?
Any chance you can spend a few pages educating me and everyone else on why the unions came around and then apply that to what you have said. It seems that unless you pay money to a club then you deserve to be shafted, which in itself is elitist.
You would be happy to see a fellow worker paid less than you just because of his political or moral belief, that’s [zb] tragic in this day and age and exposes yet again the truth about unions, it’s not about us the working class, it’s about the members who pay for the privillege…sounds almost Tory?
For the record, I totally and utterly get why unions evolved in a time where there wasn’t even what you would call a “working class” , they were barely above slavery to be fair.
However in the modern world of rights and legal representation I don’t think they really have any function other than to exploit on a political basis. As was mentioned in a previous post, we should have representation in the work place, but on an individual business level , not an industry basis as each business faces different challenges in the world we live in.
I’m surprised no one has mentioned that when they whine on about the rail industry. In my view a driving reason train drivers are on such good terms is because they have no competition, yes they have regulations beyond belief but they have no threat so can demand what they need, there’s no track next to the ones they have that can undercut them, there is no track from Bulgaria that can swerve the regs and go cheaper. It’s a passenger/freight train, it’s the only one and it gets done the way they want it done.
Sorry Rob, we will always disagree on unions, I couldn’t give a [zb] about that awful woman Thatcher, I just believe you should be treated equally in the workplace in this day and age, as I have the means to do so myself then why should I be forced to join a union in order to be treated the same? It’s turned fully on its head…
I knew you’d be along eventually.
Calm down man.
Look…me and you are never going to agree with this, let’s just to agree to differ.
You think Unions are the pariah of the working people, where as I think that they are there to stop us being ■■■■ ed about by unscrupulous employers…, as long as they are applied in their originaland traditional concept that is, and not in the way that you see them.
So ‘‘never the twain will meet’’ eh?
Neither of us are going to win this argument, so why don’t we just leave it there.
Nite Owl:
A few years ago the company i work for had a big expansion and a load of new drivers including me were taken on. The new drivers pay and perks weren’t as good as the original drivers and there’s still a few of them left. Recentlyy the company decided to increase the wages of new drivers to bring parity with the old contract and the old drivers got no extra.
One of the old drivers complained it was unfair that a load of drivers got a pay rise and he didn’t even though he was on a higher rate than us anyway. He went to the union. The company point was that it was trying to fair and pay everyone as similar a wage as it could. The union argued that everyone should get a pay rise.
The company argued that to give everyone a pay rise would just increase the unfairness and tried to give the old contracts a lower pay rise than the newer ones. The union said no. In the end the company spat it’s dummy out and said no one gets a rise. That was apparently ok with the union.
Thank you union.
Where’s Rjan when we need him. The idea of not creating wage parity,let alone when an employer offers it,totally defeats the object of unions.
I agree. The union sold it’s soul (and it’s solidarity) when it accepted lower pay for new entrants doing equal work.
Norfolkinclue1:
Love the use of Bob Crow too, I’m sure any low wage worker with a family in need of authority housing in the North London borough where he lived will also agree he is a hero too
Why should Bob Crow have moved away from his friends and family, simply because the majority of people were voting for governments that refused to build more decent council housing?
Council housing wasn’t built for the low-paid or the lumpenproletariat. It was built for all working people, and Bob Crow worked for a living and fought for his members and for the interests of the working class generally.
If you think housing costs are a problem, then perhaps you agree (as Bob Crow did) that we should build more council housing and introduce rent controls?
Carryfast:
Where’s Rjan when we need him. The idea of not creating wage parity,let alone when an employer offers it,totally defeats the object of unions.
I agree. The union sold it’s soul (and it’s solidarity) when it accepted lower pay for new entrants doing equal work.
Firm I left 4 years ago had just introduced 3rd generation salaried contracts, 2nd gen were 10% lower than those there at the time, 3rd gen were another 10% lower. None of those employed, whether union members or not, seemed bothered that new starters would get £4-5k a year less than them for doing the same work.
Carryfast:
Where’s Rjan when we need him. The idea of not creating wage parity,let alone when an employer offers it,totally defeats the object of unions.
I agree. The union sold it’s soul (and it’s solidarity) when it accepted lower pay for new entrants doing equal work.
Firm I left 4 years ago had just introduced 3rd generation salaried contracts, 2nd gen were 10% lower than those there at the time, 3rd gen were another 10% lower. None of those employed, whether union members or not, seemed bothered that new starters would get £4-5k a year less than them for doing the same work.
It’s like a cross between planet Zog and the film Idiocracy.
So maybe the OP is telling a true story but how does not joining the Union fix it.When surely joining the Union and then asking the question at the top leadership,forget the shop steward,as to how such a situation is in any way consistent with the object of a union would be the first move.If you don’t then get a satisfactory answer then leave the union and you’ve only lost one subscription.While it would just confirm my view that Jimmy Hoffa’s disappearance was because he was doing a too good job of looking after the membership.
) type principles? that we hear everyday, where you…
, funny that eh?)
