SmashedCrabFace:
bigvern1:
No knowledge…? No comment.You should take your own advice.
Err… he did. He has no knowledge of the incident so isn’t going to comment. I think it would be better if you followed the advice as you seem to have the driver tried, found guilty and executed.
I’m sure you are going to be invaluable at any enquiry into this incident with your extensive knowledge of exactly what happened.
SmashedCrabFace:
switchlogic:
Taking a mans livelihood away for damaging inanimate objects would be harsh. It’ll probably be a driving without due care and attention charge.Assuming he did fall asleep, he’s only got himself to blame. It was pure chance that he only hit the central reservation and not a car full of people. Thankfully he’s not looking at a causing death by dangerous driving charge but if it was up to me he wouldn’t get another chance. Lives are worth more than someone’s livelihood.
Well you missed my point entirely. The fact is he killed no one, didn’t even injure anyone. By your standards I should have my licence taken off me for my recent accident, because ‘I might have killed someone’. I actually had you down as a lot more intelligent than that. Possibly not. If the courts worked on the ‘what could have happened’ principle half of us wouldn’t have a licence.
switchlogic:
SmashedCrabFace:
switchlogic:
Taking a mans livelihood away for damaging inanimate objects would be harsh. It’ll probably be a driving without due care and attention charge.Assuming he did fall asleep, he’s only got himself to blame. It was pure chance that he only hit the central reservation and not a car full of people. Thankfully he’s not looking at a causing death by dangerous driving charge but if it was up to me he wouldn’t get another chance. Lives are worth more than someone’s livelihood.
Well you missed my point entirely. The fact is he killed no one, didn’t even injure anyone. By your standards I should have my licence taken off me for my recent accident, because ‘I might have killed someone’. I actually had you down as a lot more intelligent than that. Possibly not. If the courts worked on the ‘what could have happened’ principle half of us wouldn’t have a licence.
I’ll see your 50% and raise you to 95%. 
To clarify, I drove past about 15 minutes after it happened and spoke to an artic driver at my delivery point who was following directly behind him & stopped on the hard shoulder to see if he was ok.
I suppose the main point of my post was to remind folks to stop if they feel overly tired, this guy apparently said he was going to stop for a kip at the next services, he’d only done Liverpool to Birmingham and on his way back.
I agree it would be harsh for him to lose his licence and he’ll probly just get a driving without due care but it’s the what could have happened that makes me cringe, luckily it was Crimbo week at 5/6am odd without much on the roads but if he’d gone through the central reservation…
Sorry, I don’t normally get in volved in these type of dicussion, but last year I was involved in an accident, afterwhich I have no recollection of, which due to an injury to my “noggin” resulted in the diagnosis of me having had a minor stroke sometime in the past. End result courtesy of our friends in Swansea is that I’ve lost car licence for 1 year, LGV for min 10 Years. So, what I am trying to say is without the facts, Don’t jump to conclusions.
TTFN Tim
switchlogic:
SmashedCrabFace:
switchlogic:
Taking a mans livelihood away for damaging inanimate objects would be harsh. It’ll probably be a driving without due care and attention charge.Assuming he did fall asleep, he’s only got himself to blame. It was pure chance that he only hit the central reservation and not a car full of people. Thankfully he’s not looking at a causing death by dangerous driving charge but if it was up to me he wouldn’t get another chance. Lives are worth more than someone’s livelihood.
Well you missed my point entirely. The fact is he killed no one, didn’t even injure anyone. By your standards I should have my licence taken off me for my recent accident, because ‘I might have killed someone’. I actually had you down as a lot more intelligent than that. Possibly not. If the courts worked on the ‘what could have happened’ principle half of us wouldn’t have a licence.
That kind of thinking is endemic in today’s society. I don’t want to come over all daily mail or Jeremy Vine with Health and Saftey gone mad but it seems you can’t just have an accident happen someone has to be blamed and punished even if no one is hurt and it was a mistake.
If someone goes in the pub has 8 pints and drives off and crashes in to a bus stop they deserve to be nicked and punished even if no one is hurt but if someone swerved to avoid someone running in the road and hit a bus stop it’s just ■■■■ unlucky.
It’s like handing your keys in at an RDC incase you drive off with a forklift flying out the back. It may have happened a few times but but it hasn’t happened thousands of times but everyone suffers.
To use a cliche that’s rather tired on here it’s the whole think of the children thing.
Coffeeholic:
0
It’s like that every time a post like this crops up on here,the holier than thou brigade coming out in full force again
In early 80s when tachodiscs were used as frisbees, I was an owner driver, I had been on the go 24 hours to hand over to a mate, (And before you start it was a different job then with little regard to the law, I was early 20s knew it all , deserved to be caught, and wouldn,t dream of it today, and admit I needed my arse kicked, so don,t wear your fingers out giving me a hard time, Please)… Anyway coming down the hill 0600AM, M6 J42, a guy who was walking his 2 dogs in the adjacent field decided to take a short cut over the M6 
, I was airborne off the clock, braked, and locked up leaving skidmarks in slow lane, not to mention my undercrackers, I hit one dog and got up to the guy and he DISAPPEARS, thing is he and the two dogs didn,t exist, I was bloody hallucinating, I came round with a shock shaking like a leaf. Speaking about this years later with a medical guy, he told me I was basically asleep and dreaming, even though my eyes were open, a bit like hypnosis, from that day as soon as I feel tired now it,s into the services for a 10min power nap, sod the timed delivery, has anybody else had a similar experience.
similar experience with a cow in the road that wasn’t there
Silver_Surfer:
Bloke in an artic stuck in the central reservation this morning about 6am, m6 north of Birmingham, heard off another driver he’d allegedly fallen asleep at the wheel. Luckily no injuries but could have killed himself and many others, no problem. Probly lose his licence though.
My blood boils when I read this sort of post, then read another from some guy who doesn’t see why drivers should take compulary breaks after 4.5 hours ?
The driver was in this condition because of his lack of rest. How can anyone condemn a man for falling asleep on the job and in the next breath compain about VOSA or DOT hours of service laws ?
Pat Hasler:
The driver was in this condition because of his lack of rest.
You know this for a fact do you? Might be an idea to get in contact with the police investigating this incident, I’m sure your knowledge of the incident will be valuable to them.
Pat Hasler:
Silver_Surfer:
Bloke in an artic stuck in the central reservation this morning about 6am, m6 north of Birmingham, heard off another driver he’d allegedly fallen asleep at the wheel. Luckily no injuries but could have killed himself and many others, no problem. Probly lose his licence though.My blood boils when I read this sort of post, then read another from some guy who doesn’t see why drivers should take compulary breaks after 4.5 hours ?
The driver was in this condition because of his lack of rest. How can anyone condemn a man for falling asleep on the job and in the next breath compain about VOSA or DOT hours of service laws ?
Unless the law follows you around and makes sure you actually sleep you could have 4.5hrs rest after 45mins driving and it wouldn’t make a blind bit of difference, drivers will still fall asleep
I’m sure I’m not the only one who has had a good nights sleep and have been barely able to keep my eyes open after an hour but other days I’ve done 10 hours driving and feel full of beans and could carry on for another couple of hours.
You have to have rules as some people would take advantage and become a danger but obeying the tacho laws to the letter won’t make you a safer driver.
Pat Hasler:
Silver_Surfer:
Bloke in an artic stuck in the central reservation this morning about 6am, m6 north of Birmingham, heard off another driver he’d allegedly fallen asleep at the wheel. Luckily no injuries but could have killed himself and many others, no problem. Probly lose his licence though.My blood boils when I read this sort of post, then read another from some guy who doesn’t see why drivers should take compulary breaks after 4.5 hours ?
The driver was in this condition because of his lack of rest. How can anyone condemn a man for falling asleep on the job and in the next breath compain about VOSA or DOT hours of service laws ?
None of us know how much rest he had, only he does, it could most probably have been a reduced 9 hours, of which I have said before on here is simply not enough end of, just because it,s legal does not mean it is safe, I know some need less rest/sleep than others but all those 9hours are not spent sleeping, how many other jobs are you back in work after 9 off, eg leave the office/garage/shop/ bakers /candlestickmakers at 5pm and restart at 2am, it doesn,t happen but we are expected to drive 44 tonnes around in a state of 100% alertness safely,… Yeh right. H&S MY ARSE
bigvern1:
No knowledge…? No comment.
back in the late 70s a driver i know well had a few the night before and fell asleep on his way towards devon put the 8 wheeler in the telegraph pole, no one hurt but thought he would be clever and say he had blacked out, instead of addmitting he was tired and nodded off, result he has never got his truck license back to this day and because of the depression and trouble it all caused he now has drink driving as well. not once but twice. so better to admit the problem early than have it snowball out of control.
switchlogic:
Well you missed my point entirely. The fact is he killed no one, didn’t even injure anyone. By your standards I should have my licence taken off me for my recent accident, because ‘I might have killed someone’. I actually had you down as a lot more intelligent than that. Possibly not. If the courts worked on the ‘what could have happened’ principle half of us wouldn’t have a licence.
I’ve never understood why they don’t. If you’re punishing someone for falling asleep whether he killed a busload of children (lol) or just ran into the barriers should make no difference.
You’re position is, to me, as illogical as his.
I’d have a system by which the consequences are immaterial - the action is punished and yes I’d have had your liecence off you.
robroy:
Pat Hasler:
Silver_Surfer:
Bloke in an artic stuck in the central reservation this morning about 6am, m6 north of Birmingham, heard off another driver he’d allegedly fallen asleep at the wheel. Luckily no injuries but could have killed himself and many others, no problem. Probly lose his licence though.My blood boils when I read this sort of post, then read another from some guy who doesn’t see why drivers should take compulary breaks after 4.5 hours ?
The driver was in this condition because of his lack of rest. How can anyone condemn a man for falling asleep on the job and in the next breath compain about VOSA or DOT hours of service laws ?None of us know how much rest he had, only he does, it could most probably have been a reduced 9 hours, of which I have said before on here is simply not enough end of, just because it,s legal does not mean it is safe, I know some need less rest/sleep than others but all those 9hours are not spent sleeping, how many other jobs are you back in work after 9 off, eg leave the office/garage/shop/ bakers /candlestickmakers at 5pm and restart at 2am, it doesn,t happen but we are expected to drive 44 tonnes around in a state of 100% alertness safely,… Yeh right. H&S MY ARSE
We ain’t expected to do anything, nobody forces us to be lorry drivers 
switchlogic:
I actually had you down as a lot more intelligent than that. Possibly not. If the courts worked on the ‘what could have happened’ principle half of us wouldn’t have a licence.
I like you Switchy, but please don’t try to insult my intelligence just because our opinions differ.
The courts do work on the ‘what could have happened’ principle. Look at driving under the influence of drink/drugs. If you’re caught doing that you can expect to lose your licence even if nothing happened and rightly so. By your reasoning, a drunk driver could crash into a tree, hurt nobody and the shock of the accident be punishment enough?
Falling asleep at the wheel is just as bad as downing a pint of vodka before you set off. If you choose to ignore the warnings your body is giving you and press on regardless, you are no better than a drunk driver and deserve to have your licence revoked.
cieranc:
bigsidney:
Maybe his brakes failed…Very, very rare for both footbrake and secondary fail in such a fashion as the brakes won’t come on.
They’re designed to fail safe.DieselDemon:
Anything could have happened such as a blowout or steering failure.True, but if anyone ever finds thenselves in the situation described by the OP, PLEASE don’t tell the coppers the tyre blew out or the steering failed unless thats what happened. If you say the crash was caused by a mechanical failure, don’t think for one minute they’ll take your word for it. Once you motor is back in the contractors yard, the VOSA and police Collision Investigation Unit will go through it thoroughly.
I’ve known the CIU and VOSA remount tyres onto rims and inflate them to prove they hadn’t blown out (been knocked off the rims during the crash).
Likewise, they’ll check weather a steering linkage had dropped off causing the crash, or was smashed off in the crash.If they prove you were telling fibs they’ll be determined to hammer you.
as there where no other vehicles involved and no injuries i would be very suprised if the police would even get involved, would be just down to insurance paying for damage, they would not get ciu involved, now if he had hit someone, and god forbid injuried or kill them totally different,
i hit a car on a roundabout back in the summer on the A303 no one injuried, i did get the police to come out as soon as i told him the fact no one injuried he didn’t want to know, just told me to exchange details and get on my way, didn’t want to look at my cards or anything