For what it’s worth, my instructor stated that experienced class 2 drivers passed their class 1’s more often than the car-to-class 1 people.
This could be that they were used to manouvering large vehicles in general.
Class 2 may be the best move for now…
I passed my class 1 2.5 yrs ago. My class 2, 5 months before that.
Can’t believe how much costs have risen in 2.5 yrs.
The combined cost of both licences was a long way from the £3000 being shouted about on here!
trevorking1964:
I passed my class 1 2.5 yrs ago. My class 2, 5 months before that.
Can’t believe how much costs have risen in 2.5 yrs.
The combined cost of both licences was a long way from the £3000 being shouted about on here!
Deals can be had. Cash always talks
If you have already been training in a class 1 and have already passed the reverse, don’t let them talk you into doing class 2 instead, and as for reversing in the real world nearly everyone struggles with that until it ‘‘clicks’’. All three majors that you got you could have done exactly the same if you had been in a class 2, stick with class 1, go for a class 1 assessment drive with a different trainer and see how many hours they reckon and go from there.
Anyway if you are making 30k for only 28.5 hours work a week, you would be better off staying put.
Don’t beat yourself up pal, you gave it a shot. The company should have never put you straight into a C+E you should have had 15 hours minimum in the class C(2).
All training providers make it seem like it’s a full blown conclusion but I can tell you, I work for one of the biggest providers and we’re finding first time passes from B - C+E is around 9% for 30 hours or less (out of around 300 students.
It’s a meat grinder I’ve seen good people come to me pay for the lessons and test, fail it then be stuck in the vicious cycle of I’ve invested to much to quit so I’ll save up again and be back in two weeks (with two hour refresher before their test) because that’s all they can afford…
Asoon as the examiner sees your license knows that you haven’t paid your dues with C or D and you better drive near perfect because in their eyes they are signing you off to be in charge of a 44ton killing machine.
Harsh but true
Trance185:
As soon as the examiner sees your licence knows that you haven’t paid your dues with C or D and you better drive near perfect because in their eyes they are signing you off to be in charge of a 44 tonne killing machine.Harsh but true
When I did my Class 1 test, the nice lady examiner who passed me asked what I had driven previously. Oh I said, I’ve driven red buses around London. Double deckers■■?..double deckers■■?..she enquiried■■? mmmm…I said, while nodding at the same time. That seemed to settle her concerns about whether she should give me a licence.
Little did she know, that I had only driven buses for 4 weeks. She didn’t ask how long and I wasn’t telling. I must admit though, I did make a lot of progress in those 4 weeks and my newly found professionalism did show in the test.
Anonymous86x:
Hello mate, and thankyou very much for your measured response.
No problem pal
Anonymous86x:
I am gonna take your advice and try-out Class 2 training + test | See how that goes | And then take things from there.
(Hopefully will pass my Class 2 ~ Gain a few months experience ~ And then decide upon revisiting Class 1)
Again, I can only comment on what I would do if it were me. At the end of the day you must make a decision based on what you feel comfortable doing. If you are not confident you will pass if you book a second C+E test then don’t waste your money. For me, there was a strong feeling I would’ve passed the second time because the things I failed on were not terrible. Apart from my first day out under instruction when I was a little nervous I was comfortable pulling a trailer. I quickly got used to it as I was transitioning from 32t 4 axle with a Moffett. Noted, there were some differences, but it wasn’t as daunting as going from a car to an artic.
Anonymous86x:
I have also viewed my position with a bit more perspective, and realised that given I’m only in my early/mid 30s currently, just because I (hopefully) start on Class 2 & doing Class-2 work now… Doesn’t mean I have to commit to doing nothing except that for the next 30-years of my working life!lol
But so hopefully I will find the handling + manoeuvrability of rigids much easier vs artics (*specifically when turning right on busy multi-lane roundabouts)…
As even though I navigated all of them (without my trailer wiping-out any cars on my left) during my training + test :: The ‘sensation’ while pulling an artic around a roundabout to take a 3rd/4th/5th exit on busy roundabout is a horrible feeling, as I constantly feel (fear) that my trailer swing may wipe-out a car coming around on my left side / when I have to drift left to get into lane for my own exit, that I may knock-out cars who are in that lane already!
-But so hopefully I will find these elements (while driving a rigid) much more similar to driving a car, and thus left ‘constantly daunting’, as they are when trying to drag an artic around!
There is nothing wrong with looking at your situation like that. Your next steps should be whatever will work best for you. I think it is more likely someone will pass going from car/van to class 2.
Looking back at what you failed on:
Not cancelling your indicator is probably something you won’t forget in future. To me it might suggest that you are so focused on other aspects of your driving that you overlooked it. So in future take a more rounded approach to indicator usage; once you have manoeuvred ensure your signal is cancelled every time. A lot of units I have driven have ear piercing buzzers in the cab that sound when the indicator has been on for a while. It serves as a reminder to cancel it, and honestly even with that thing popping my eardrums I have at times forgotten to cancel my turn signal.
The dual carriage way thing can be solved by changing lane if it is safe to do so, passing the point of merging traffic, then safely moving back to the near side lane. If you do this in advance you probably won’t have to alter your speed. You will do this a lot on motorways.
Lastly, accurately judging the width of your vehicle comes with time out on the road. I’ve smacked many a mirror. It all changed when I was given a brand new vehicle for the first time. As I was the sole driver, anything that happened to it was my fault, so I had to start respecting gaps more, especially when passing other vehicles. I’m not afraid to stop and wait or swing out very wide. My mirrors still end up in bushes on country lanes when another HGV is bombing in the opposite direction but not enough that I have to get out and adjust it
It seems if you can iron out those kinks then you will probably be ready for your Class 1 test again. Also think about the fact your reverse pass has an expiration date before you have to do it again.
Even when you pass and get your license, the real driving starts when you get a job and the pressure is on. For some people, getting tossed in at the deep end is what is required to make them perform their best.
Best of luck with your decision
Sorry you failed. It is a horrible feeling combined with the feeling of being in limbo and not quite knowing what will be the quickest way out of that limbo.
You have had some great advice already. Here’s what I think, based on my experience as a relatively new pass. (Class 2, passed 4th time, Class 1 passed 1st time).
Firstly, you say you deeply enjoy driving but I kind of got the feeling there was nothing much you enjoyed about driving an artic. As you have discovered, artics don’t handle like cars. If you are sure that once you have your license you will develop a love of driving artics then….I’m also inclined to say stick with the Class 1. Don’t waste that hard won reversing pass! If you do go for Class 2, don’t do it thinking it will be easier and it will definitely be a better experience than you’ve had in the artic. It might not be.
It’s already been said, but I’ll say it again, you are not alone. No one can reverse an artic until they’ve had plenty of real world experience. There are a multitude of threads on here about reversing and ALL the experienced drivers say that doing it a lot is the only way to learn it and that they also still have off days. I personally have not driven a Class 1 commercially yet and I know and accept it’s going to be painful and embarrassing so I don’t worry about it (anymore). Whatever you drive, there is an awful lot of post test learning to be done and a lot of pain and embarrassment to be gone through.
If you have a fear of crushing vehicles to your left in an artic on a roundabout, you will still have that fear in a rigid. Until….you have looked in your mirrors enough to know that you won’t crush anything because you know exactly what is or isn’t there. Instead of viewing the training and test as one for driving a lorry, see it as training and test for looking in your mirrors. Believe me. It’s all about the mirrors.
Re the merging traffic an a dual carriageway, just to add to Shullbits post, you do need to do much more planning in a large vehicle. If you go past a junction, you know there will be a slip road coming up. Start looking in your right mirror as you pass the junction to be able to plan a move into the middle lane if you need to and to know plenty in advance what’s behind you and what they are doing.
The reason people pass Class 1 first time after doing Class 2 is because they have already got used to the fundamentals of driving a large vehicle. It follows then that going straight from car to artic you need double the training to be as successful because you have a lot to learn and practice. When I passed my Class 1, I had only had 2 days driving a Class 2 commercially since passing my Class 2 test.
Good luck and let us know how you get on.
Training provider here, averaging 15-20 driving tests per week, with around half being B to CE. With the greatest of respect…
Trance185:
The company should have never put you straight into a C+E you should have had 15 hours minimum in the class C(2).
Nonsense.
Trance185:
Asoon as the examiner sees your license knows that you haven’t paid your dues with C or D and you better drive near perfect
Nonsense.
Trance185:
…we’re finding first time passes from B - C+E is around 9% for 30 hours or less (out of around 300 students.
I think that says more about your school. Yes, B to CE is a big jump, but there is no extreme difference in pass rates. 9% is alarming.
To use your own words, “harsh but true.”
Trance185:
we’re finding first time passes from B - C+E is around 9% for 30 hours or less (out of around 300 students.
300 students, and only 27 passed. When are you going to start teaching them better?
BishBashBosh and stu675 have stopped me having to write an epistle! It beggars belief that someone with evidently little experience or knowledge should come on here and make such sweeping statements.
I come from a background of teaching car to artic (indeed, quite often not even car!) from the early seventies. So, until 1997, it was common practice and few schools ran a “Class 3” now known as CAT C. Some bright spark thought it would be a could plan to make everyone do 2 courses and take 2 tests and that’s how we ended up with staged training. Personally, I always considered that to be a total waste of time. (IF there had been a requirement to demonstrate 200 hours of CAT C driving, then there might just have been a tiny scrap of sense. But we all know that wasn’t the case and folks were regularly passing CE a month after C).
The driving test has softened almost beyond belief. In the past, we had a forward steer exercise (on the reversing pad), a much bigger reversing area (same exercise - but bigger), a gearchanging exercise (a common cause of test fail), a braking exercise, a “proper” downhill start. And, of course, no power steering. Sometimes the luxury of syncro gearbox but not always. Go back to the early seventies, we didn’t always have air brakes! The task for a trainee now is so easy compared to 50 years ago. And that’s not a bad thing. But it’s baffling that anyone should have an issue with the course and test. Yes, there’s a bit more traffic. O dear! The trailers now HAVE to be enclosed. I used a 40’ box consistently for many years. And there’s a bit of a load. A whole 8 tonnes - - on a vehicle probably capable of dragging 25 tonnes about. So it’s virtually irrelevant. All this contributes to the fact that weeks of training are not normally required and it’s perfectly possible for the average driver with reasonable aptitude to pass the test on around 20 hours - having got the reverse and upcoupling out of the way first.
My success rate for B to CE is second to none. Maybe that’s down to close on 50 years practice and a bit of knowledge as well. Our friend has demonstrated in his post that not all instructors are capable of working to the same high standards. Pity.
The caveat: CE is not for everyone. For some, the very thought of it strikes panic. Rather than criticize these people, let them take the alternative which is C. If a candidate starts a B to CE course and their (properly qualified, trained and experienced) instructor recommends a move to C, the candidate does well to listen and take that on board. Over the years, I’ve had this a handful of times. Sometimes the candidate will return a year or two later to upgrade their licence. For others, C is enough. And that’s totally fine in my book.
In the meantime folks, take care who you listen to on the forum!! Some of us have been here a lot of years and have an idea of what it’s all about!
Pete S 
As regards car to C+E, if every truck driver going forward takes this route, there will obviously be excess entitlement out on the roads. This is because of the volume of rigids being used commercially nationwide. Considering it takes nearly double the training time to achieve C+E as opposed to just C, it also seems that there will be excess cost and time spent training truck drivers to C+E level.
A C+E pass will also have a natural inclination to wish to drive to maximum entitlement. If every truck driver is qualified to C+E level, obviously there will be some that will be disappointed.
As the last acquired rights 7.5 tonne licence holders are now in their forties, the multitude driving this category will gradually have to be replaced, so it could end up candidates are getting C+E to end up driving a 7.5 tonne vehicle. More likely candidates with C+E will decide it is either maximum entitlement driving or nothing, so they may exit the industry with a fully fledged and unused C+E licence.
BishBashBosh:
Training provider here, averaging 15-20 driving tests per week, with around half being B to CE. With the greatest of respect…
So your @ the training centre for say 30 mins before waiting to go in then the new cut down tests are an hour so you spend a minimum of 30 hours a week at the test centre?..and you still find time to fully train them from B…
I’m not saying I’m a great instructor but I am realistic and truthful the current narrative is I can take you from car to class 1 in 20 hours and it’s ■■■■■■■■. It isn’t safe
I forgot all you guys have been doing this for 50 years and have made a pacts with the god of driving for a 99.9% pass rate.
The 300 people I am referring to are from a well known delivery/warehouse company that receive money towards further training/education…those in the know have already twigged who it is.
Yes 27 people passed their class C+E on the first attempt with previously only driven a class B with 20 hours in C+E and 10 hours in C.
I received a letter last week stating due to the increased profits we have had since the rules changed I’m getting a bonus at the start of the new financial year…wtf
Not got anything to do with my pass rate its simply because this industry has changed alot over the last couple of years. We are now used car salesmen (promising, what can’t be delivered)
The author of the post has been made to feel like a failure because he believes the ■■■■ he’s heard on here, from people milking the golden cow and getting fat from it.
Trance185:
BishBashBosh:
Training provider here, averaging 15-20 driving tests per week, with around half being B to CE. With the greatest of respect…So your @ the training centre for say 30 mins before waiting to go in then the new cut down tests are an hour so you spend a minimum of 30 hours a week at the test centre?..and you still find time to fully train them from B…
Training provider - I am speaking about the school as a whole, not just myself.
have made a pacts with the god of driving for a 99.9% pass rate.
Not aware that I ever claimed that! Prior to my retirement a couple of years ago, I was running iro 90%. Anyone with experience in this industry will know that 90% is exceptional - so I feel justified in saying I know what I’m talking about. Very occasionally, I’ll cover retest training; 100% pass rate over the last year or so.
people milking the golden cow and getting fat from it.
Maybe tell me who. The fact is that most fleets have had huge investment in a predominantly artic fleet. And that puts a dent in anyone’s profitability.
We are now used car salesmen (promising, what can’t be delivered)
What a statement/attitude! If you really believe that, please leave the industry as a matter of urgency and find something you’re good at. Leave it to those who actually know and understand the task in hand and can produce results. You should change your statement to “I”, not “we”.
It isn’t safe
B to CE course, run iro 20 hours + reverse + uncouple etc is perfectly safe and very successful. IF DELIVERED PROPERLY by an expert trainer.
I wish you joy in your new career. In the meantime, stop decrying the professional efforts of real instructors.
Pete
Quentin “2nd coming of the messiah” has spoken!
We’re at 64% compared to your 68% and doing it out of statistically the hardest test centre… I can hear the messiah speaking…your right for once!
It doesn’t matter if you can drive safely but the wiggle room for flukes.
Tests around the mean streets of Watnall, Come to a real city where your students melt.
Can’t wait until the new financial figures come out… I’ll show you who’s getting fat from the golden cow.
So14 hasn’t got a 2nd time 100% pass rate for C+ (the literal cream of the crop) but you have…ok Pete, I know your getting on in life but please take them rose tinted glasses off.
Haha! You clearly dont know me at all. I spent some 20+ years testing on the mean streets of Watnall. And nearly as long in Sheffield. So dont talk to me about training in cities.
The fact that I opened the very first private driving test centre in the UK during 2008 meant that we ended up testing in a much more favourable area.
BTW, no rose tinted glasses here.
Pete S
I also used Chevron and they were terrible!! Like the OP I also had to complain about the first instructor I had and get a new one. Don’t waste your money with them.
I also used Chevron and they were terrible!! Like the OP I also had to complain about the first instructor I had and get a new one. Don’t waste your money with them.
As pointed out in another thread, major staff changes have taken place so that top quality trucks are matched with staff of the same calibre.
Pete S
Hi everybody. I didn’t want to start a new thread but my situation is pretty similar. I have made a comeback at getting hgv licence since I have tried unsuccessfully getting class2 some 8years ago.
I have failed my class1 test in some bizarre circumstances. I drove a regular size artic with tri axle box trailer.
I have been give a serious fault for straddling(splitting lanes) where examiner felt there was no need for that. I must add these were the places where I have never been before so I decided to play it safe and took both lanes. Especially one right turn where 2 lanes open up to 3 lanes shortly before traffic lights and the right turn lane is fairly short and narrowish and the turn itself rather tight with street furniture restricting the width. How on earth is this a serious fault? I am pretty sure that it should be a minor at the most. I was led to believe that a serious fault must be something potentially dangerous.
My confidence is destroyed, I have booked a retest but I question my decision ever since I’ve failed. This is extremely stressful situation for me now. What is the point of forking out a lot of money for retest where you can fail because you drive defensively. I have also been marked down on a few occasions for speed progress and hesitation. In my opinion it was slightly exaggerated as driving in London during school traffic with plenty of people and kids walking around residential streets justify to drop down the speed slightly and be prepared for anything.
My instructor was very surprised that I got a serious for such thing too and frankly couldn’t agree with the result.
I am not sure if I made a good decision. It cost me already best part of 5k and the stress is killing me now. I was pretty confident if I put on a good drive I will pass, in fact I thought I passed as I pulled up back at the test centre. Apart from serious fault nothing else was explained to me and I have had a couple of minors, around 8-9.
Is this normal practice? I am just trying to find strength to continue but it not easy. Especially knowing that getting a job as new pass is very difficult and getting qualified costs a lot of money and retests are difficult to get a date and they cost £400+