Cant for the life of me understand this one, maybe someone will know 
Harvey
She shouldnāt worry, theyāre not related.
HRS:
Cant for the life of me understand this one, maybe someone will know
Following Brexit our Royals will be excluded from marrying European Royals. And needing to forge new trade deals theyāll be helping by marrying into noble families from further afield. Taking control of our borders means we can keep out the East Europeans to make vacancies for more diverse nationals.
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whiplash:
Very good Buzzer.
On a sidenote,and I suppose its difficult to take a person out of politics,when politics is what theyre known for,but isnt Ms Foster one twisted,evil,sour looking woman? Id say the big reverand himself smiled more than she does.
Politics certainly seems to attract those females who fell out of the ugly tree. 
Some of them managed to hit every branch on the way down.
All joking aside - I think that if I lived in Northern Ireland, Iād be pretty miffed at the thought of a āhardā border being installed - after years of the ātroublesā, I would be relishing the peace & new found freedom.
I certainly donāt know what the answer is - presumably those of you who voted āoutā would have considered issues like this - and would have an answer to the problem?
Just wondering. ā¦
kmills:
All joking aside - I think that if I lived in Northern Ireland, Iād be pretty miffed at the thought of a āhardā border being installed - after years of the ātroublesā, I would be relishing the peace & new found freedom.
I certainly donāt know what the answer is - presumably those of you who voted āoutā would have considered issues like this - and would have an answer to the problem?
Just wondering. ā¦
But like perpetual motion:
Loads of ideas and suggestions, but none of them work.
EDIT.
Treat it like a logic puzzle.
Draw a diagram. 4 areas represented by columns.
If the areas are in same customs areas, then draw them the same height. (You slide between them easily).
Different customs different height .
EU same as Eire.
Eire same as NI.
NI same as U.K.
All ok so far?
Now at the same time, make the UK a different height to the EU.
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kmills:
All joking aside - I think that if I lived in Northern Ireland, Iād be pretty miffed at the thought of a āhardā border being installed - after years of the ātroublesā, I would be relishing the peace & new found freedom.
I certainly donāt know what the answer is - presumably those of you who voted āoutā would have considered issues like this - and would have an answer to the problem?
Just wondering. ā¦
Morning"Kmills".
The border, Known locally as Warren point was not a cliff edge before the troubles, just like any customs, you may or may not get checked.
To day all customs can ( if the will is there ) be cleared by computor clicks from sender to recipient for customs clearance, Northan Ireland is just another attempt to stop Brexit.
Remoaners on here who know everything about everything, even who will be able to marry who, will of course find fault with this, even though they havānt a bl***y clue.
Hard hat on and into my Anderson shelter. Harvey
Harvey why do you need a hard hat ? you can have an opinion. After watching the news this morning I think Mrs May a remainer at heart is just trying to elongate this whole affair which will cost us billions as a country, this is far from what was voted for by the majority and I do believe that her cabinet will round on her and it could be curtains for her, now who would replace her is a debateable question or it could force and election which at this stage would be far worse. This needs to be sorted and pronto as the longer it goes on the worse it will get, sure as hell this would not happen in a war situation so lets get it done and dusted, Buzzer.
From my own post:
Refuse lorries into the UK unless their goods status has been declared electronically in advance. No declaration ticket, no ferry booking. Businesses will be falling over themselves to pre clear their goods once it has departed from the loading point. De Ja Vu! rather than when they arrive at the point of entry. TIR still exists for the non EU countries if they donāt want to play that way.
We did it in the past without the aid of computers, hence the queues in Dover/Pompey/etc. Pre cleared goods Sir? Just a registration checkā¦carry on. Maybe an inspection on a bayā¦that still happensā¦a scan in the X-Ray machineā¦āTally with the declared goods?āā¦Carry onā¦Instant BACS payment when the vehicle gets on the ferry/train or maybe before it gets itās ticket (as above). No queues in Dover/Pompey/etc or even Ballykissangel. BTW, fruit and veg was exempt taxes anyway wasnāt it. Still had to be declared and cleared (R&G/Coopers/etc) as fast as they could type it out!
Sure there will be the fraudsters in BOTH directions (empty cows from the UK/Belgium??) but technology is hard on their heels. Small beer really. UK VAT fraud on mobile phones, donāt hear much about that but we owe the EU lots of dosh. Criminals will declare Cognac as cabbages from Brittany no doubt so itās up to Border Force to be up on the game. Gonna be expensive to ship via Eire to get to mainland UK. N.I. does not need a hard border. Random checks, the same as the Kermits and Dagos do, just up the road from the frontier. Donāt see that discussed on the media do you? We know it exists, Joe Public at Large doesnāt. Truth is WE in the UK donāt do the inland random checks, itās existed for donkeys in mainland Europe hasnāt it?
For what my opinion is worthā¦
gazzer:
From my own post:Refuse lorries into the UK unless their goods status has been declared electronically in advance. No declaration ticket, no ferry booking. Businesses will be falling over themselves to pre clear their goods once it has departed from the loading point. De Ja Vu! rather than when they arrive at the point of entry. TIR still exists for the non EU countries if they donāt want to play that way.
We did it in the past without the aid of computers, hence the queues in Dover/Pompey/etc. Pre cleared goods Sir? Just a registration checkā¦carry on. Maybe an inspection on a bayā¦that still happensā¦a scan in the X-Ray machineā¦āTally with the declared goods?āā¦Carry onā¦Instant BACS payment when the vehicle gets on the ferry/train or maybe before it gets itās ticket (as above). No queues in Dover/Pompey/etc or even Ballykissangel. BTW, fruit and veg was exempt taxes anyway wasnāt it. Still had to be declared and cleared (R&G/Coopers/etc) as fast as they could type it out!
Sure there will be the fraudsters in BOTH directions (empty cows from the UK/Belgium??) but technology is hard on their heels. Small beer really. UK VAT fraud on mobile phones, donāt hear much about that but we owe the EU lots of dosh. Criminals will declare Cognac as cabbages from Brittany no doubt so itās up to Border Force to be up on the game. Gonna be expensive to ship via Eire to get to mainland UK. N.I. does not need a hard border. Random checks, the same as the Kermits and Dagos do, just up the road from the frontier. Donāt see that discussed on the media do you? We know it exists, Joe Public at Large doesnāt. Truth is WE in the UK donāt do the inland random checks, itās existed for donkeys in mainland Europe hasnāt it?
For what my opinion is worthā¦
Gazzer your wasted driving a truck you ought to have a job in Brussels mate, iāll get T MAY to give you the nod and the pay would be better than on bulk, Buzzer
HRS:
kmills:
All joking aside - I think that if I lived in Northern Ireland, Iād be pretty miffed at the thought of a āhardā border being installed - after years of the ātroublesā, I would be relishing the peace & new found freedom.
I certainly donāt know what the answer is - presumably those of you who voted āoutā would have considered issues like this - and would have an answer to the problem?
Just wondering. ā¦Morning"Kmills".
The border, Known locally as Warren point was not a cliff edge before the troubles, just like any customs, you may or may not get checked.
To day all customs can ( if the will is there ) be cleared by computor clicks from sender to recipient for customs clearance, Northan Ireland is just another attempt to stop Brexit.
Remoaners on here who know everything about everything, even who will be able to marry who, will of course find fault with this, even though they havānt a bl***y clue.
Hard hat on and into my Anderson shelter. Harvey
It certainly wasnt on a cliff edge BEFORE the troubles Harvey. But during the troubles,trust me it was.While admittedly it was years after the event,an Irish customs officer showed me the exact spot at "the point" where 18 British soldiers were killed,in 2 bombings.The border wasnt just at Warrenpoint,with many many hundreds of crossings to and fro, through Ireland/UK and vv. They were always a place of heightened tensions in my opinion.
(Just on a sidenote,did youknow that the UK foreign lorry tax is not in place on certain roads in NI,because of constant changing between territories?ie Irl/UK/Irl/UK?)It goes to show how terribly complicated the whole issue is.
With regard to Kmills question of whether leave voters,considered issues like this,I doubt it,because in fairness to ALL voters,in or out,it wan`t raised as an issue.(Possibly because remainers thought that the result would be a foregone conclusion).
When the likes of the buffoon Johnson,compares it to crossing from one London borough to another,or the Leicestershire mp who reckons that a British citizen can simply apply for an Irish passport (or vv),or buffoon senior Johnson stating that sterling is accepted everywhere in the south(or euros in the north),I think it does show the level of ignorance surrounding the border issue,certainly within the political circles.
Whiplash:
It certainly wasnt on a cliff edge BEFORE the troubles Harvey. But during the troubles,trust me it was.While admittedly it was years after the event,an Irish customs officer showed me the exact spot at "the point" where 18 British soldiers were killed,in 2 bombings.The border wasnt just at Warrenpoint,with many many hundreds of crossings to and fro, through Ireland/UK and vv. They were always a place of heightened tensions in my opinion.When the likes of the buffoon Johnson,compares it to crossing from one London borough to another,or the Leicestershire mp who reckons that a British citizen can simply apply for an Irish passport (or vv),or buffoon senior Johnson stating that sterling is accepted everywhere in the south(or euros in the north),I think it does show the level of ignorance surrounding the border issue,certainly within the political circles.
Youāre right, Whiplash. The tension was palpable in those days. My first crossing between Newry and Dundalk was fraught with it, especially after I had had to pick my way in and out of the bits of a car bomb in Banbridge on the way. I cleared at that barbed wire fortress in Newry only to be turned back for lack of a permit at the border. Eventually, after a return to the āfortressā it was sorted and I continued on my way.
I have never felt so relieved in my life. That dual carriageway looks calm and peaceful now, but back in the 70s the shack at the side of the single track road held the difference between life and death it seemed to me. No less than 3 times I crossed and re-crossed that border that day, each time swinging a big Uie between the muddy shoulders. Ireland definitely does not want to go back to that.
As for Bridgen, Johnson and the rest of the loonies, words fail me.
gazzer:
From my own post:Refuse lorries into the UK unless their goods status has been declared electronically in advance. No declaration ticket, no ferry booking. Businesses will be falling over themselves to pre clear their goods once it has departed from the loading point. De Ja Vu! rather than when they arrive at the point of entry. TIR still exists for the non EU countries if they donāt want to play that way.
We did it in the past without the aid of computers, hence the queues in Dover/Pompey/etc. Pre cleared goods Sir? Just a registration checkā¦carry on. Maybe an inspection on a bayā¦that still happensā¦a scan in the X-Ray machineā¦āTally with the declared goods?āā¦Carry onā¦Instant BACS payment when the vehicle gets on the ferry/train or maybe before it gets itās ticket (as above). No queues in Dover/Pompey/etc or even Ballykissangel. BTW, fruit and veg was exempt taxes anyway wasnāt it. Still had to be declared and cleared (R&G/Coopers/etc) as fast as they could type it out!
Sure there will be the fraudsters in BOTH directions (empty cows from the UK/Belgium??) but technology is hard on their heels. Small beer really. UK VAT fraud on mobile phones, donāt hear much about that but we owe the EU lots of dosh. Criminals will declare Cognac as cabbages from Brittany no doubt so itās up to Border Force to be up on the game. Gonna be expensive to ship via Eire to get to mainland UK. N.I. does not need a hard border. Random checks, the same as the Kermits and Dagos do, just up the road from the frontier. Donāt see that discussed on the media do you? We know it exists, Joe Public at Large doesnāt. Truth is WE in the UK donāt do the inland random checks, itās existed for donkeys in mainland Europe hasnāt it?
For what my opinion is worthā¦
There is a lot of sense in that, but I would question some aspects of it.
āBusinesses will be falling over themselves to pre clear their goods once it has departed from the loading point.ā Yep, shouldnt cost a lot, but it is an extra expense for all exporters and importers. More red tape, we dont have at the moment.
āWe did it in the past without the aid of computers, hence the queues in Dover/Pompey/etc. Pre cleared goods Sir? Just a registration checkā¦carry on. Maybe an inspection on a bayā¦that still happensā¦a scan in the X-Ray machineā¦āTally with the declared goods?āā¦Carry onā¦Instant BACS payment when the vehicle gets on the ferry/train or maybe before it gets itās ticket (as above). No queues in Dover/Pompey/etc or even Ballykissangel. BTW, fruit and veg was exempt taxes anyway wasnāt it. Still had to be declared and cleared (R&G/Coopers/etc) as fast as they could type it out!ā
Switzerland has close ties with the EU and is part of the Schengen agreement. It takes about 20mins to process papers there I think? They have years of experience and all the systems are up and running already. We currently have no systems, insufficient personnel, either as HMC&E officers or clearing agents, and the clock is ticking. How long will it take for us? With close ties to the EU, 20mins, same as Swiss? Without close ties, a hard Brexit?? I hope we dont find out! Any queues are likely to be in BOTH directions: even if our civil service were showered with billions in cash (defeats one reason to leave?) and were running perfectly from day one, what of exports? Any paperwork in EU ports would lead to delays there. If Calais is full of trucks on the quay awaiting clearance, the queues will be on the Dover approaches wont they? Any extra transport costs and delays will make us a less attractive home to multinationals such as Honda, Toyota, NIssan, LandRover etc. They rely on quick, cheap, ājust in timeā transport by truck. Change may mean them using slower more expensive transport at first. But in the long term, when building new factories, or expanding, theyll be doing it with cheap, quick, transport inside the EU. They will eventually leave the UK. Dont look like a healthy future to me.
āTruth is WE in the UK donāt do the inland random checks, itās existed for donkeys in mainland Europe hasnāt it?ā
True. Leaving could mean even more need to employ, extra civil servants to increase roadside checks with all the expense and time wasting thatll involve. As the Leave politicians promised: "less EU red tape". They kept their mouths shut on all the extra hassle, red tape, and expense that UK domestic laws will require, didnt they? Or just said āproject fearā and hoped by hiding their heads in the sand and singing āLand of Hope and Gloryā we`d ignore it.
Leaving will probably see transport get dearer, (more paperwork and checks) (more need for officials to stop fraud) and we`ll pay, as consumers in cash, and as a country in fewer jobs.
Hi Whiplash,
As the troubles are over (to a great extent) I saw no reason to compare the future with a bad part of the āPastā, we must compare the future with what went before all that but with modern technology.
Respect for the past will help us move forward but fear of the past will only lead to bad decisions.
I have a picture in my mind of all that had to be done in this country after the last war, building literally everything back up, homes,factorys, roads, hospitals, the whole country had to be rebuilt,am I ever so glad that Franglaise was not at the helm. I am sure he is on commission with the Samaritans. Harvey
Spardo:
Whiplash:
It certainly wasnt on a cliff edge BEFORE the troubles Harvey. But during the troubles,trust me it was.While admittedly it was years after the event,an Irish customs officer showed me the exact spot at "the point" where 18 British soldiers were killed,in 2 bombings.The border wasnt just at Warrenpoint,with many many hundreds of crossings to and fro, through Ireland/UK and vv. They were always a place of heightened tensions in my opinion.When the likes of the buffoon Johnson,compares it to crossing from one London borough to another,or the Leicestershire mp who reckons that a British citizen can simply apply for an Irish passport (or vv),or buffoon senior Johnson stating that sterling is accepted everywhere in the south(or euros in the north),I think it does show the level of ignorance surrounding the border issue,certainly within the political circles.
Youāre right, Whiplash. The tension was palpable in those days. My first crossing between Newry and Dundalk was fraught with it, especially after I had had to pick my way in and out of the bits of a car bomb in Banbridge on the way. I cleared at that barbed wire fortress in Newry only to be turned back for lack of a permit at the border. Eventually, after a return to the āfortressā it was sorted and I continued on my way.
I have never felt so relieved in my life. That dual carriageway looks calm and peaceful now, but back in the 70s the shack at the side of the single track road held the difference between life and death it seemed to me. No less than 3 times I crossed and re-crossed that border that day, each time swinging a big Uie between the muddy shoulders. Ireland definitely does not want to go back to that.
As for Bridgen, Johnson and the rest of the loonies, words fail me.
We were both in the EU during most of the 70ās.No surprise that remainers would deliberately try to confuse security issues specifically related to the troubles regardless of EU membership, while ignoring the fact that the CTA provides a similar arrangement between Eire and Northern Ireland as the freedom of movement provided by the EU.
HRS:
Hi Whiplash,
As the troubles are over (to a great extent) I saw no reason to compare the future with a bad part of the āPastā, we must compare the future with what went before all that but with modern technology.
Respect for the past will help us move forward but fear of the past will only lead to bad decisions.
I have a picture in my mind of all that had to be done in this country after the last war, building literally everything back up, homes,factorys, roads, hospitals, the whole country had to be rebuilt,am I ever so glad that Franglaise was not at the helm. I am sure he is on commission with the Samaritans. Harvey
I think Franglais speaks mostly sense Harvey,in my opinion.
I also think your middle sentence āRespect for the pastāā¦ makes so much sense,and is so true.
Maybe the fact that the history is so recent and alive (if only in our minds),is the fear most normal humans have.
However,as a driver āon the other sideā of the divide said to me once,it`s not about religion,or politics,its about money.And money is power.
gazzer:
Buzzer asked me to link this hereā¦have a listen!
Sheās calling for a Confederal Europe in which the National MEP groups have the right of National opt out and hold the supreme legislature over the Commissioners.Sheās obviously been reading my posts.On that note no we voted for an end to free movement including workers.But Germany can obviously agree to disagree and do its own thing as can we under the Confederal system that sheās describing.
HRS:
I know we have heard most of these quotes, but this one stands out very clear to me. Harvey
Did you check out the AfD speech video.Itās more an issue of what type of Europe do we all want to live in and on that we have pro Nation State allies in Germany just as we have pro Federal EU anti nation state enemies like Blair,Cable,May and Hammond among others at home.