Buzzer:
Does this mean that when Labour if they ever should win a general election and the Conservatives don’t like it we have a rerun till we get the result they want. What ever happened to democracy in this country, we voted to leave so lets get on with it.
That’s what democracy means, isn’t it? Or do you think that once you have a general election, that’s it, no need for another 5 years later? Changing your mind is forbidden in that brave new world.
So you’re saying that EU membership is automatically subject to continuous in v out referendum every 5 years. Let alone the result subject to a 5 year transition period. So what happened to all the missing referendums we should have had between 1975 to 2016 ?.
While strangely the referendum seems to have been confirmed here as having been deliberately drawn up by remainer Hammond to be non binding on the government anyway. Which explains why we are where we are.What a surprise and we can bet that wouldn’t have been the case if the vote went the remainers’ way.
In which case the British electorate have been lied to again by the Federalist scumbags just as in 1975.This time having been misled into thinking that we were actually voting on a binding referendum.Which also explains why the remainer dominated traitorous Parliament seemed rather strangely happy to pass it.IE obviously binding if it went their way but obviously now suddenly non binding when it didn’t and which all seems a bit suspiciously OTT if they just intended it as an opinion poll.
Spardo:
This isn’t the first referendum on the matter, again, by that reasoning the one in 2016 should never have happened either.
It’s clear that the matter was never going to be settled by referendum from the point when traitor Heath took us into it ( unless it went the remainers way as in 1975 of course ) bearing in mind that it was remainer Hammond who raised the 2015 referendum act bill.
This will either be settled democratically by constituency vote or violently and sadly it’s very rare historically that the Nationalist/Secessionist v Federalist argument is ever settled by the former.
I’m not sure what you’re saying here .If Labour change the leadership there’s every chance they could get re elected .You have to go with what the majority of voters want. I hated Tony Blair with a passion but didn’t want another vote to get shut . The problem is we have a majority of politicians doing whats best for them and not the country they dont give a toss about us just themselves thats why they want to remain and join the endless tribe of euro mp’s on the gravy train
Buzzer:
Does this mean that when Labour if they ever should win a general election and the Conservatives don’t like it we have a rerun till we get the result they want. What ever happened to democracy in this country, we voted to leave so lets get on with it.
That’s what democracy means, isn’t it? Or do you think that once you have a general election, that’s it, no need for another 5 years later? Changing your mind is forbidden in that brave new world.
So you’re saying that EU membership is automatically subject to continuous in v out referendum every 5 years. Let alone the result subject to a 5 year transition period. So what happened to all the missing referendums we should have had between 1975 to 2016 ?.
Not at all, merely pointing out that if another referendum is held, because the terms and circumstances are changed, then it isn’t anti-democratic. That’s all.
And by the way, people, be it members of parliament, leaders of government or just ordinary nobodies like us, are not traitors just because we believe differently. Otherwise, unless every single one of us agreed, and we obviously don’t, we would all be traitors.
Carryfast:
So you’re saying that EU membership is automatically subject to continuous in v out referendum every 5 years. Let alone the result subject to a 5 year transition period. So what happened to all the missing referendums we should have had between 1975 to 2016 ?.
Not at all, merely pointing out that if another referendum is held, because the terms and circumstances are changed, then it isn’t anti-democratic. That’s all.
And by the way, people, be it members of parliament, leaders of government or just ordinary nobodies like us, are not traitors just because we believe differently. Otherwise, unless every single one of us agreed, and we obviously don’t, we would all be traitors.
Make your mind up.Either you’re saying that EU membership should be subject to continuous regular referendum in which case how would that work assuming alternate in out in out results or you’re not.
As for traitors it is treason to hand the sovereignty of the country over to a foreign power and,without reform to a Confederal Europe,that was always the issue in this case from day 1.In which case no one actually even has the right to vote the country out of existence by handing its control over to an undemocratic foreign Federal zb pile even if the vote was 95% remain.That’s why this will more likely end up having to be settled by force than the ballot box just as the other numerous examples of Secession v Federalism throughout history were.While the fact that remainer Hammond etc have clearly misled the electorate into thinking that we were taking part in a binding referendum,when we clearly weren’t ( obviously as an insurance policy for if/when the remainers lost ),makes that scenario far more likely and the government knows it.Which is why it’s stuck with trying to play off Remain v Leave on a continous merry go round because it knows that if it delivers Brexit,or shows its preferred ( Remain ) hand,it’s not sure what the reaction will be in a country divided between Secessionist v Federalist.When history actually tells it all it needs to know in that regard.
Love it !!! its like question time.
How about this: Over the years I have ( and I am sure most on this thread have ) seen people in middle management leave a company because they are fed up and a year later come back with a much better package of employment. “why” because the company did not know how much they valued that person the first time round.
What do you think folks ■■? Harvey “just going to pop my hard hat on”
I have noticed your method of debate elsewhere, CF, and have no intention of saying anything to you further while you insist on misrepresenting what I have said. You, know very well the distortion that you have done to my words. So do I, So, enough.
Spardo:
I have noticed your method of debate elsewhere, CF, and have no intention of saying anything to you further while you insist on misrepresenting what I have said. You, know very well the distortion that you have done to my words. So do I, So, enough.
Spardo:
I have noticed your method of debate elsewhere, CF, and have no intention of saying anything to you further while you insist on misrepresenting what I have said. You, know very well the distortion that you have done to my words. So do I, So, enough.
Good because I have & so has every ■■■■■■ else has too, What ■■■■■■■ Planet is this CF From, Apart from Leatherhead.
Spardo:
I have noticed your method of debate elsewhere, CF, and have no intention of saying anything to you further while you insist on misrepresenting what I have said. You, know very well the distortion that you have done to my words. So do I, So, enough.
Have you just noticed “Spardo” ? Cheers Bewick.
No Dennis, I tend to discover long threads years after they have been going and then, getting interested, steadily plough through them till I catch up.
And one thread that had me transfixed over the last couple of months was the AEC V8 one, and I saw how one individual completely disrupted it by twisting the words that were put up to counter his arguements.
Most of us know who that was but I treat as I find and in this thread was prepared to give a reasonable explanation of my point of view as opposed to his. I then found that my words were wilfully misrepresented.
Reasoned discussion is one thing, but accusing me of advocating 5 yearly referendums when I clearly hadn’t, is not worth continueing with.
So, as I said, Dennis and Lawrence, no I haven’t just realised but gave him one chance, just one, to be worthy of talking to.
Spardo:
I have noticed your method of debate elsewhere, CF, and have no intention of saying anything to you further while you insist on misrepresenting what I have said. You, know very well the distortion that you have done to my words. So do I, So, enough.
Have you just noticed “Spardo” ? Cheers Bewick.
Blimey Bewick you do know that he’s clearly saying that he didn’t like the result so he wants to have another vote.Then when he’s challenged on what happens if the next vote says Remain then we ask for another vote and that says Leave so on and so forth he runs off crying to his mates.Obviously you being one of them you treacherous remoaner zb.
I heard on the news this morning that the Dutch are encouraging car manufacturers to use non British suppliers when we leave the EU .Maybe Trump could persuade Paccard to relaunch the Foden or Leyland name and build all their DAF vehicles in Lancashire even if it is only badge engineering
In return we could tell the Cloggie’s to stick there tomatoes and other fresh veg and frozen chips up there Jacksie and see where that gets them, in the EU we still buy more from remaining members than they do from us, cant see that changing even if we do eventually break free, Buzzer.
Buzzer:
In return we could tell the Cloggie’s to stick there tomatoes and other fresh veg and frozen chips up there Jacksie and see where that gets them, in the EU we still buy more from remaining members than they do from us, cant see that changing even if we do eventually break free, Buzzer.
Spot on Buzzer !! and tell the Cloggies to stick their Flowers and Plants up their “orifices” as well 'cause they are always here with their artics blocking up streets outside Florists selling their wares ! Bit like French Onion sellers years ago but I suppose those Lads were acceptable at the time! Oh! ■■■■ it I’ve said the wrong thing here !! we’ll have Dave Fergie coming across next selling Rough Red and festering Brie on his Shop Bike ! If all those that voted to leave stand their ground we will get the result we voted for and at least Labour looks like being in turmoil so that is a plus factor but the Irish are going to cause problems, which they have done for years ! So why can’t we just invade again and sort them out !!! Cheers Dennis.
I fear that, argue it how you want, none of us, leavers or remainers, is going to get what they thought they were going to get.
Due to the stunning incompetence of our ‘leaders’ (either party) absolute disaster awaits which will take many years to recover from. I voted leave but if I had the chance now I would be voting ‘forget it’.
David Miller:
I fear that, argue it how you want, none of us, leavers or remainers, is going to get what they thought they were going to get.
Due to the stunning incompetence of our ‘leaders’ (either party) absolute disaster awaits which will take many years to recover from. I voted leave but if I had the chance now I would be voting ‘forget it’.
David
Quite right. The stunning incompetance is down to 3 people when it comes to it. Blair for allowing unstricted access from the east immediately while the other western nations took a more cautious approach, Clegg for his disastrous about face over student fees which destroyed his party and denied it the chance to put the brake on Cameron, who only promised a referendum because he was running scared of UKIP at the time.
Britain has never been a referendum country. All this one did is split the country almost down the middle causing anguish and hatred for years to come (if you don’t believe me, read through as I have, all the extreme right wing posts in this thread).
It has been said that it was a democratic vote, thus sacrosanct, but that is not the British way. If democracy was so important the absolutely criminally incompetant and skewed voting system would have been changed years ago. A system that creates a house of commons and government and leader who have not necessarily recieved the most votes, and an upper chamber which isn’t voted in at all.
David Miller:
I fear that, argue it how you want, none of us, leavers or remainers, is going to get what they thought they were going to get.
Due to the stunning incompetence of our ‘leaders’ (either party) absolute disaster awaits which will take many years to recover from. I voted leave but if I had the chance now I would be voting ‘forget it’.
Let’s get this right.The Cons,being the same ideologically remain Party that took us into it,predictably go and sabotage Brexit from the start firstly in the form of Hammond’s non binding sham referendum and then when they lose it using delaying tactics and throwing a spanner in the works of the Leave process.How does saying let’s allow the remainers to win by staying in the EU fix that.As opposed to voting UKIP to get the job done properly which was always going to be the only realistic way that it would happen rather than believing that zb Cameron and his stinking party and expecting people like May and Hammond to deliver it.
While having lost the referendum why would remain voters expect to ‘get’ anything that they wanted.Just as we don’t expect the losers in any election to get the government that they voted for.
Spardo:
Quite right. The stunning incompetance is down to 3 people when it comes to it. Blair for allowing unstricted access from the east immediately while the other western nations took a more cautious approach, Clegg for his disastrous about face over student fees which destroyed his party and denied it the chance to put the brake on Cameron, who only promised a referendum because he was running scared of UKIP at the time.
Britain has never been a referendum country. All this one did is split the country almost down the middle causing anguish and hatred for years to come (if you don’t believe me, read through as I have, all the extreme right wing posts in this thread).
It has been said that it was a democratic vote, thus sacrosanct, but that is not the British way. If democracy was so important the absolutely criminally incompetant and skewed voting system would have been changed years ago. A system that creates a house of commons and government and leader who have not necessarily recieved the most votes, and an upper chamber which isn’t voted in at all.
Yes the electoral system should have been changed years ago to one of PR.You know the same type of aggregate based system that provides the UKIP vote in the European parliament and the one that delivered the Brexit majority that you obviously despise when it doesn’t go your way.On that note no 52/48 % isn’t ‘split down the middle’ and the only hatred and division going on is that which the zb far left Communists like Corbyn and their far right Globalist allies like Starmer,May,Blair and Macron and Soros,who are all trying to take over the country and subvert the Leave process,are creating.On that note you do know that the same Nationalist v Globalist/Socialist argument applies just the same within Europe as a whole and good luck with trying the same stunt of trying impose the will of the Communist/Globalist minority on the Nationalist majority if you succeed in your aim of derailing Brexit.So bring it on.
As for the so called ‘cautious approach’ to eastward enlargement which part of,free movement rules would have applied by now long ago regardless,let alone Merkel etc enforcing their Kalergi style plan right across Europe using the dictatorial EU government system to do it,don’t you understand.More like you do understand and support it.
Let alone the result subject to a 5 year transition period. 
Which explains why we are where we are.What a surprise and we can bet that wouldn’t have been the case if the vote went the remainers’ way.
If all those that voted to leave stand their ground we will get the result we voted for and at least Labour looks like being in turmoil so that is a plus factor but the Irish are going to cause problems, which they have done for years ! So why can’t we just invade again and sort them out !!! 
