I have to pick up on a statement from Spardo “So, we who believe in Europe, united and free…”. Surely, if we are ‘united’ (presumably he means with the rest of the EU), how can we also be ‘free’ when we have to abide by EU laws, directives and constraints? David Cameron must have had something of the same idea when he went to Brussels confident that he could get some reforms from within - he got next to no meaningful support and came back empty handed. In my opinion, Europe needs a good kick in the shins from not only the UK, but some of the other “unhappy” countries before any real reforming progress can be made. Can’t see that happening in what’s left of my lifetime though, the rot is too far entrenched.
fodenway:
I have to pick up on a statement from Spardo “So, we who believe in Europe, united and free…”. Surely, if we are ‘united’ (presumably he means with the rest of the EU), how can we also be ‘free’ when we have to abide by EU laws, directives and constraints?
Well, united in the EU, the 27 who are not breaking away, and free because we are as free as anyone can be in a civilised.
society.
So you think you are free if you live in a Britain outside of the EU do you? Really? Seems to me that you must be an anarchist, because living in a society without laws, directives and constraints is an anarchist society.
Best of luck with that, but not for me.
Spardo:
fodenway:
I have to pick up on a statement from Spardo “So, we who believe in Europe, united and free…”. Surely, if we are ‘united’ (presumably he means with the rest of the EU), how can we also be ‘free’ when we have to abide by EU laws, directives and constraints?Well, united in the EU, the 27 who are not breaking away, and free because we are as free as anyone can be in a civilised.
society.So you think you are free if you live in a Britain outside of the EU do you? Really? Seems to me that you must be an anarchist, because living in a society without laws, directives and constraints is an anarchist society.
Best of luck with that, but not for me.
Spardo I think a lot of UK citizens would like to be in control of our own law making and enforcement rather than being told what we have to do by the EU, a lot of the rules and regulations enforced on our society from Brussels is just making normal working lives here a nightmare, a lot are unnecessary and only frustrate the normal working day as it used to be in years gone bye, how the hell did we mange back then. The other problem here is that in this country we seem to follow these conditions put on us to the letter where in other member states they are not so rigidly enforced.
You in France do not run true to form here as seen in recent demonstrations, all the unions including the police gang together to make there point and over the years we have suffered with roadblocks by your countrymen. All well and good for us if you obey them and do what they request but I remember trucks with lamb aboard being stopped and there load thrown out on the road and burned with diesel and that is not so long ago so how did the French society with laws allow this behaviour, or is it just put down to your Gallick attitude and then move on and say no more as its just the way it is in France.
At the end of the day todays environment is vastly different than when I started out in my driving abroad in the early 70’s as in France a minor offence then a ten franc bung would suffice and you where on your way, life was far better back then and we just got on with the job with far less rules and regulations, Buzzer.
Buzzer:
Spardo:
fodenway:
I have to pick up on a statement from Spardo “So, we who believe in Europe, united and free…”. Surely, if we are ‘united’ (presumably he means with the rest of the EU), how can we also be ‘free’ when we have to abide by EU laws, directives and constraints?Well, united in the EU, the 27 who are not breaking away, and free because we are as free as anyone can be in a civilised.
society.So you think you are free if you live in a Britain outside of the EU do you? Really? Seems to me that you must be an anarchist, because living in a society without laws, directives and constraints is an anarchist society.
Best of luck with that, but not for me.
Spardo I think a lot of UK citizens would like to be in control of our own law making and enforcement rather than being told what we have to do by the EU, a lot of the rules and regulations enforced on our society from Brussels is just making normal working lives here a nightmare, a lot are unnecessary and only frustrate the normal working day as it used to be in years gone bye, how the hell did we mange back then. The other problem here is that in this country we seem to follow these conditions put on us to the letter where in other member states they are not so rigidly enforced.
You in France do not run true to form here as seen in recent demonstrations, all the unions including the police gang together to make there point and over the years we have suffered with roadblocks by your countrymen. All well and good for us if you obey them and do what they request but I remember trucks with lamb aboard being stopped and there load thrown out on the road and burned with diesel and that is not so long ago so how did the French society with laws allow this behaviour, or is it just put down to your Gallick attitude and then move on and say no more as its just the way it is in France.
At the end of the day todays environment is vastly different than when I started out in my driving abroad in the early 70’s as in France a minor offence then a ten franc bung would suffice and you where on your way, life was far better back then and we just got on with the job with far less rules and regulations, Buzzer.
Well if you were to mention a few of these so-called Brussels laws that the Brits are obeying and the French ignoring I may be able to answer your post intelligently, but you really shouldn’t believe everything you read in the papers or hear on the news, so a dose of reality from someone who is here, travelling around on the ground may enlighten you.
As far as the Gilly Joans are concerned, the day it started It took me an hour to get through Dreux/Nonancourt and I was pretty ■■■■■■ off, but as I’m sure you know, that sector is a notorious pinch point anyway due to multiple lanes narrowing to one, and at the only other serious holdups later, near Nimes, I was allowed priority because I was carrying live animals. Since then I have seen nothing just a few lost souls huddled round a fire at the side of the road, taking no notice of me at all.
The lorry blockades that you speak of were many years ago and while I was still driving for Gauthier. Sarko stopped all that by threatening to make the blockages traffic offences thus drivers would very quickly reach their limit and lose their HGV licences. No backing down there.
Oh, and btw, I am British citizen, not French, and they are not my fellow countrymen and I am not Gallic but English.
The link contains two videos worth watching, first from Mark Francois and particularly the second from Bernard Jenkin which sum up rather neatly what I’m sure many leavers feel about the current situation.
Spardo:
Buzzer:
Spardo:
fodenway:
I have to pick up on a statement from Spardo “So, we who believe in Europe, united and free…”. Surely, if we are ‘united’ (presumably he means with the rest of the EU), how can we also be ‘free’ when we have to abide by EU laws, directives and constraints?Well, united in the EU, the 27 who are not breaking away, and free because we are as free as anyone can be in a civilised.
society.So you think you are free if you live in a Britain outside of the EU do you? Really? Seems to me that you must be an anarchist, because living in a society without laws, directives and constraints is an anarchist society.
Best of luck with that, but not for me.
Spardo I think a lot of UK citizens would like to be in control of our own law making and enforcement rather than being told what we have to do by the EU, a lot of the rules and regulations enforced on our society from Brussels is just making normal working lives here a nightmare, a lot are unnecessary and only frustrate the normal working day as it used to be in years gone bye, how the hell did we mange back then. The other problem here is that in this country we seem to follow these conditions put on us to the letter where in other member states they are not so rigidly enforced.
You in France do not run true to form here as seen in recent demonstrations, all the unions including the police gang together to make there point and over the years we have suffered with roadblocks by your countrymen. All well and good for us if you obey them and do what they request but I remember trucks with lamb aboard being stopped and there load thrown out on the road and burned with diesel and that is not so long ago so how did the French society with laws allow this behaviour, or is it just put down to your Gallick attitude and then move on and say no more as its just the way it is in France.
At the end of the day todays environment is vastly different than when I started out in my driving abroad in the early 70’s as in France a minor offence then a ten franc bung would suffice and you where on your way, life was far better back then and we just got on with the job with far less rules and regulations, Buzzer.Well if you were to mention a few of these so-called Brussels laws that the Brits are obeying and the French ignoring I may be able to answer your post intelligently, but you really shouldn’t believe everything you read in the papers or hear on the news, so a dose of reality from someone who is here, travelling around on the ground may enlighten you.
As far as the Gilly Joans are concerned, the day it started It took me an hour to get through Dreux/Nonancourt and I was pretty ■■■■■■ off, but as I’m sure you know, that sector is a notorious pinch point anyway due to multiple lanes narrowing to one, and at the only other serious holdups later, near Nimes, I was allowed priority because I was carrying live animals. Since then I have seen nothing just a few lost souls huddled round a fire at the side of the road, taking no notice of me at all.
The lorry blockades that you speak of were many years ago and while I was still driving for Gauthier. Sarko stopped all that by threatening to make the blockages traffic offences thus drivers would very quickly reach their limit and lose their HGV licences. No backing down there.
Oh, and btw, I am British citizen, not French, and they are not my fellow countrymen and I am not Gallic but English.
Spardo no where in my post did I say you were a French citizen and even though you have chosen to reside in France it could be said that they were your fellow countrymen as you live there or do you ignore them and have nothing to do with them. As for the Gallick mention this was directed at the French people its just that you read it and interpreted your way, at the end of the day I was just commenting in general not having a go at you so please no more knit picking, thanks Buzzer.
Buzzer:
Spardo no where in my post did I say you were a French citizen and even though you have chosen to reside in France it could be said that they were your fellow countrymen as you live there or do you ignore them and have nothing to do with them. As for the Gallick mention this was directed at the French people its just that you read it and interpreted your way, at the end of the day I was just commenting in general not having a go at you so please no more knit picking, thanks Buzzer.
It is not nit picking, I only read what you say and perhaps this may help you in understanding my reply:
a fellow countryman is a male citizen of the same state as the person speaking, writing, or being referred to. Collins English Dictionary.
Thus I am your fellow countryman, not the French, but that does not exclude me from being friends and having affinity with them.
On the contrary, it is you who are nit picking, why not answer my question instead:
Well if you were to mention a few of these so-called Brussels laws that the Brits are obeying and the French ignoring I may be able to answer your post intelligently, but you really shouldn’t believe everything you read in the papers or hear on the news, so a dose of reality from someone who is here, travelling around on the ground may enlighten you.
Hi Spardo, quote from your post “The lorry blockades that you speak of were many years ago” many years ago is fake…three years ago is fact and it was nasty.
pressandjournal.co.uk/fp/ne … in-france/
Oily
oiltreader:
Hi Spardo, quote from your post “The lorry blockades that you speak of were many years ago” many years ago is fake…three years ago is fact and it was nasty.
pressandjournal.co.uk/fp/ne … in-france/
Oily
Not fake, just a misunderstanding, I thought that Buzzer was referring to lorry drivers’ blockades, and, although I can’t read your link because a great big white banner blocks (a blockade in Scotland?) most of the text, I could see enough to realise that that was a farmers’ blockade.
You hardly ever intervene in this thread Oily, but on each rare occasion it has been to have a go at something I have said. Do you have a problem with me for some reason?
Sorry, I seemed a bit paranoid there. But what that has got to do with a thread about membership of the EU is beyond me.
Do you seriously think that those disruptions are an EU thing? And do you seriously think that they will magically come to an end when Britain leaves? I can just imagine the scene.
Farmer one ‘quick, stop that truck, it is full of Scottish lamb’
Farmer two ‘hang on a minute, they’re not in the EU’
Farmer one, ‘Oh yeah, of course, carry on then mate’
followed by cheery Gallic wave.
Yeah right.
Spardo:
oiltreader:
Hi Spardo, quote from your post “The lorry blockades that you speak of were many years ago” many years ago is fake…three years ago is fact and it was nasty.
pressandjournal.co.uk/fp/ne … in-france/
OilyNot fake, just a misunderstanding, I thought that Buzzer was referring to lorry drivers’ blockades, and, although I can’t read your link because a great big white banner blocks (a blockade in Scotland?) most of the text, I could see enough to realise that that was a farmers’ blockade.
You hardly ever intervene in this thread Oily, but on each rare occasion it has been to have a go at something I have said. Do you have a problem with me for some reason?
This is what I have a problem with “Not fake, just a misunderstanding, I thought that Buzzer was referring to lorry drivers’ blockades” when challenged, you “misunderstood”, also quite convenient that you are unable to read the link. On the rare interventions you mention I also stated how I enjoyed your tales of lorry/truck driving especially your time in Oz, and will continue to do so. On the other hand we have nothing in common with regard to Brexit.
Oily.
oiltreader:
Spardo:
oiltreader:
Hi Spardo, quote from your post “The lorry blockades that you speak of were many years ago” many years ago is fake…three years ago is fact and it was nasty.
pressandjournal.co.uk/fp/ne … in-france/
OilyNot fake, just a misunderstanding, I thought that Buzzer was referring to lorry drivers’ blockades, and, although I can’t read your link because a great big white banner blocks (a blockade in Scotland?) most of the text, I could see enough to realise that that was a farmers’ blockade.
You hardly ever intervene in this thread Oily, but on each rare occasion it has been to have a go at something I have said. Do you have a problem with me for some reason?
This is what I have a problem with “Not fake, just a misunderstanding, I thought that Buzzer was referring to lorry drivers’ blockades” when challenged, you “misunderstood”, also quite convenient that you are unable to read the link. On the rare interventions you mention I also stated how I enjoyed your tales of lorry/truck driving especially your time in Oz, and will continue to do so. On the other hand we have nothing in common with regard to Brexit.
Oily.
Strewth, you are taking nit picking to a whole new level. Also you seem to be calling me a liar about the link. I think I saw enough behind the white banner to know that it was about farmers, not drivers, but if you know different why don’t you cut and paste the article instead of throwing out wild accusations which are well off the point and nothing to do with this thread?
On 2 previous occasions you have accused me of being snidy, whatever that means in this context. My understanding of the word is ‘mocking’. If so you should be employed full time monitoring this thread. Have you not noticed others doing it too?
So France has a different attitude to civil-protest than the UK has?
As Spardo says little to do with being in a common trading block.
Having been delayed a little in the farmer’s protests, and knowing some who were delayed a lot, I won’t defend their attitude, but since it’s their country, can I really condemn it?
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And if we have a dispute with the French, for example, on trade or whatever, should we go to Paris or expect them to come to London.
Hmmm, maybe we could all agree to a common system to iron out any difficulties? Why hasn’t any one thought of that yet?
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Hi all, just watching the scaremongering on the new’s again. There will be a shortage of lettuce ,tomatoes,cucumber for a few month’s. all i can say is good let’s get back to eating fruit and veg that we grow here when it,s in season and stop eating force grown in glasshouse totally tasteless imported food like we always did year’s ago, we did OK then. 
Not only that story but also 2 brother’s one a fruit and veg importer who is worried to death what he will do if he can’t import his brother is a farmer he is not worried at all he said bring it on and let the British farmer’s feed us. When will it all end. 
I turn off the BBC as soon as they start with yet more project fear .It is getting bad now ,How are we forced to fund such tripe ,I am yet to here any positives from the BBC .What a joke .
gerbil sb152:
Hi all, just watching the scaremongering on the new’s again. There will be a shortage of lettuce ,tomatoes,cucumber for a few month’s. all i can say is good let’s get back to eating fruit and veg that we grow here when it,s in season and stop eating force grown in glasshouse totally tasteless imported food like we always did year’s ago, we did OK then.
OK, and when all those things are out of season? Tinned and frozen I suppose. You haven’t fogotten about all the workers needed to pick all that stuff, in season, and where they come from, have you? 
Beetlejuice:
I turn off the BBC as soon as they start with yet more project fear .It is getting bad now ,How are we forced to fund such tripe ,I am yet to here any positives from the BBC .What a joke .
So that explains why you don’t get all the information. You listen until you get to a bit you don’t like, then switch off. Why am I not surprised? 
Spardo:
gerbil sb152:
Hi all, just watching the scaremongering on the new’s again. There will be a shortage of lettuce ,tomatoes,cucumber for a few month’s. all i can say is good let’s get back to eating fruit and veg that we grow here when it,s in season and stop eating force grown in glasshouse totally tasteless imported food like we always did year’s ago, we did OK then.OK, and when all those things are out of season? Tinned and frozen I suppose. You haven’t fogotten about all the workers needed to pick all that stuff, in season, and where they come from, have you?
Beetlejuice:
I turn off the BBC as soon as they start with yet more project fear .It is getting bad now ,How are we forced to fund such tripe ,I am yet to here any positives from the BBC .What a joke .So that explains why you don’t get all the information.
I don’t take fake news as gospel like you or the other undemocratic whiners in here .
The BBC is a properly negative corporation.
To ad as you quickly edited after i replied .
No i just post facts inbetween all the fake tripe remainers grasp at ,Usually from fake new outlets like the BBC
Beetlejuice:
To ad as you quickly edited after i replied .
No i just post facts inbetween all the fake tripe remainers grasp at ,Usually from fake new outlets like the BBC
And where do you get all these, oh so true, facts from? Please tell us so we can all at last see the light.