Enjoy your swim

[scaniaultimate]

Conor:

ScaniaUltimate:
From today we are helping to pay for the heating of the swimming pools, stables & mansions of the millionaires & billionaires of this country; you are most welcome.

The ones that pay more income tax in total to HMRC than the bottom 50% of earners do who are funding state benefits you get they don’t get (they don’t even get child benefit which everyone earning under £50,700 is entitled to), the NHS they don’t use, the public schools they don’t use which you and your family do?

You make a lot of entirely incorrect assumptions about me.
Most of your comments have been well debated by others, but I had to look up child benefit to see how much the millionaires & billionaires were missing out on for it to be worth mentioning…

…poor things.

If you are happy to be chipping in for the heating of Rishi’s swimming pool then I would prefer it to be a voluntary contribution from fools rather than a compulsory contribution; especially from the pockets of people with more compassion towards those who are actually struggling right now.

As I stated, a simple solution to prevent taxpayers paying towards the heating of the swimming pools of the very rich would be to subsidise a limited number of units.
Of course that method was never going to be used as the people who are benefiting most from the unlimited subsidy are the ones who make the rules & they never make them to work against their own financial interests.
I did a very rough calculation of the size of the benefits that the price cap will provide in this topic…
trucknetuk.com/phpBB/viewto … 5&t=173240
Most relevant part being:
“Someone in a small house using 970 units a month for a gas bill of £100 will cost taxpayers 970 X 4.7p = £45 per month.
Someone in a mansion using 9,700 units a month for a gas bill of £1000 will cost taxpayers 9,700 X 4.7p = £455 per month.
Someone heating stables & swimming pools as well as their mansion (Rishi) using 97,000 units a month for a gas bill of £10,000 will cost taxpayers 97,000 X 4.7p = £4,559 per month.
Annually those figures are: £540, £5,460 & £54,708 respectively.”

Seems like it won’t be long before they make up all the years they have been missing out on in child benefit over poorer workers (& they won’t even have to have a child to make the difference up!).

[scaniaultimate]

Conor:
I made money last week from the pound falling, most people who have pensions did. Because most of my S&S ISA and SIPP is invested in the US, about 65%, every 1% Sterling drops against the USD puts several hundred quid in my pocket just in FOREX. However when the pound recovered on Friday I lost over £1800 in a single day, along with those rich people who would have lost a lot more which funnily people like yourself tend to choose to ignore.

Investing 101:
Unrealized Gains and Losses: No, you didn’t “lose” or “win” anything unless/until you sell or buy.

[sploom]

What’s all this got to do with trucks.
Its supposed to be a truck forum

[trevorking1964]

Sploom:
What’s all this got to do with trucks.
Its supposed to be a truck forum

Does that mean all the posts must be about trucks and trucking…?

[franglais]

trevorking1964:

Sploom:
What’s all this got to do with trucks.
Its supposed to be a truck forum

Does that mean all the posts must be about trucks and trucking…?

Most of us drive to earn money. How much we get in our pockets, and how far it goes is surely relevant to us all?

(And earlier it wasn`t a problem)

Sploom:
We need to grow the economy,thats the reason

[adam277]

Personally, I do not think we need to grow the economy lol. We need to pay off the completed un-needed debt we raked up over the past 3 years by paying people to stay at home. Also now peoples fuel bills.
But that aside…

There is a strong argument for cutting the top rate of tax. For example, why do so many millionaires basically live abroad?
But our top rate of tax is still significantly higher compared to the USA for example.
Personally, I think the biggest issue is the middle tax bands. For example if I earn 80k a year I will lose 25k of that to tax and NI which I think is far too much. Or if I earn 105K a year I take home 67k a year lol. crazy. Close to half.

If you want people like Elon Musk to invest in this country though, you can not tax the rich into the ground. As they will just go elsewhere.

Either way, as usual the media is focusing on the wrong things. Apparently it will cost us about £2Billion a year which could well be offset by their investment. They real issue is the hundreds of billions they are throwing around.

[franglais]

adam277:
Personally, I do not think we need to grow the economy lol.

So, you disagree with just about every political party out there?
You think all the economic commentators are wrong?

Thank you…

adam277:
For example, why do so many millionaires basically live abroad?

wionews.com/business-econom … ity-365961

adam277:
There is a strong argument for cutting the top rate of tax.
But our top rate of tax is still significantly higher compared to the USA for example.

The USA?
Highest cost of health care in the world?
Private health insurance that makes many congenital diseases a death sentence?
By law: zero paid holiday per year. Although after 5 years in the same job, 3/4 of employers offer 10days.
Unemployment payments that only 29% of unemployed qualify for?

Yeah. They pay a bit less in tax, and get one hell of a lot less for what they do pay!

The Scandinavian countries have higher taxes than the UK or the USA.
They are also the happiest countries in the world.

Low tax doesn`t mean more money for most people, and it certainly does not mean a happier life.

[win-stone]

Sploom:
We need to grow the economy,thats the reason

The Wooden One seems to think that ‘trickle down’ economics is the answer.

2 things…

1/ Never, ever, in the history of economics, has trickle down worked as envisaged and there is absolutely zero reason to think that things will be any different this time around.

2/ About a dozen individuals in this country have more wealth than everyone else put together so… Instead of trickle down economics, I suggest Pinata Economics; Get the super rich and just beat them with sticks until they give us all their money.

Just a suggestion

[adam277]

Franglais:

adam277:
Personally, I do not think we need to grow the economy lol.

So, you disagree with just about every political party out there?
You think all the economic commentators are wrong?

Thank you…

adam277:
For example, why do so many millionaires basically live abroad?

wionews.com/business-econom … ity-365961

adam277:
There is a strong argument for cutting the top rate of tax.
But our top rate of tax is still significantly higher compared to the USA for example.

The USA?
Highest cost of health care in the world?
Private health insurance that makes many congenital diseases a death sentence?
By law: zero paid holiday per year. Although after 5 years in the same job, 3/4 of employers offer 10days.
Unemployment payments that only 29% of unemployed qualify for?

Yeah. They pay a bit less in tax, and get one hell of a lot less for what they do pay!

The Scandinavian countries have higher taxes than the UK or the USA.
They are also the happiest countries in the world.

Low tax doesn`t mean more money for most people, and it certainly does not mean a happier life.

All true. Yet, I have many American friends. They all seem happier with having private medical insurance (which for all of them seems to be included in by their employer) and paying less tax.
The Scandinavian countries are often used for comparison compared to our country or the USA. Yet, it is inaccurate.
For example, Norway has a population roughly equivalant to New York yet has vast oil reserves. Which allows them to spend huge amounts on individuals. Which is why there are prisoners that have their own houses and saunas. Sweden managed to avoid WW2 saving it billions.

Also, on the US healthcare issue I need to look into it more but people who have cancer and can not afford healthcare treatment for example still receive treatment. But that is beside the point.

Personally, I think the NHS needs to be scrapped. It costs something like £200 billion a year. Although I am in favour of keeping drug prices regulated or bought by a central body with a greater purchasing power such as the NHS to keep prices reasonable. As in the USA lobbyists have profited massively over inflated drug prices. But this is kinda getting off-topic

Franglais:

adam277:
Personally, I do not think we need to grow the economy lol.

So, you disagree with just about every political party out there?
You think all the economic commentators are wrong?

Yep because this is not the 19th century anymore. We are too heavily influenced by global events. Global markets largely dictate growth. Sure, growth would be great but how do you achieve growth right now in the current global climate? Lower taxes, maybe but your not giving people more money for them to spend as you can not cut taxes enough to match the rise in inflation.
What does growth mean? More demand for products and goods which results in more energy and oil usage - something we are already lacking.
More demand for labor - in a market where there is already not enough workers which would result in more inflation
Its like trying build a house and starting with the roof.

[adam277]

Win-Stone:
2/ About a dozen individuals in this country have more wealth than everyone else put together so… Instead of trickle down economics, I suggest Pinata Economics; Get the super rich and just beat them with sticks until they give us all their money.

Just a suggestion

If we spread say £10 billion between everyone in the UK it would just create huge inflation tbh : D. Even if it was robbed from the richest dozen people.

[franglais]

adam277:

Franglais:

adam277:
Personally, I do not think we need to grow the economy lol.

So, you disagree with just about every political party out there?
You think all the economic commentators are wrong?

Thank you…

adam277:
For example, why do so many millionaires basically live abroad?

wionews.com/business-econom … ity-365961

adam277:
There is a strong argument for cutting the top rate of tax.
But our top rate of tax is still significantly higher compared to the USA for example.

The USA?
Highest cost of health care in the world?
Private health insurance that makes many congenital diseases a death sentence?
By law: zero paid holiday per year. Although after 5 years in the same job, 3/4 of employers offer 10days.
Unemployment payments that only 29% of unemployed qualify for?

Yeah. They pay a bit less in tax, and get one hell of a lot less for what they do pay!

The Scandinavian countries have higher taxes than the UK or the USA.
They are also the happiest countries in the world.

Low tax doesn`t mean more money for most people, and it certainly does not mean a happier life.

All true. Yet, I have many American friends. They all seem happier with having private medical insurance (which for all of them seems to be included in by their employer) and paying less tax.
The Scandinavian countries are often used for comparison compared to our country or the USA. Yet, it is inaccurate.
For example, Norway has a population roughly equivalant to New York yet has vast oil reserves. Which allows them to spend huge amounts on individuals. Which is why there are prisoners that have their own houses and saunas. Sweden managed to avoid WW2 saving it billions.

Also, on the US healthcare issue I need to look into it more but people who have cancer and can not afford healthcare treatment for example still receive treatment. But that is beside the point.

Personally, I think the NHS needs to be scrapped. It costs something like £200 billion a year. Although I am in favour of keeping drug prices regulated or bought by a central body with a greater purchasing power such as the NHS to keep prices reasonable. As in the USA lobbyists have profited massively over inflated drug prices. But this is kinda getting off-topic

Finland and Sweden have no such oil reserves. They are happy.

When you lose your job in the US, as you point out, you often lose your full health insurance too…
Think it through.

Yes, some charities in the US provide cancer treatment funding for those who need it.
It isn`t a right for their citizens, as it is here.

The NHS is about £170b this year. (10.2% GDP)
A lot of money…but …is it a lot for what we get?
The USA, your example spends 16.8% of it`s GDP on health, but gets no better outcomes.

I`ll repeat that…
The USA spends over 50% more than us…for nothing…

Now, what is so bad about the NHS, and so good about the USA?

[adam277]

Franglais:
Now, what is so bad about the NHS, and so good about the USA?

Not being able to see a GP. Or having to wait weeks after spending ages getting through on the phone via their tiny window for calling.
Long ■■■ wait times.
Dismissive Doctors’ who just want you out the door as fast as possible.
I’ve had to go private on two occasions due GP surgeries over-reacting in their measures to stop the spread of covid.
I wont even start with Dentists who were forced to close due to covid and are now massively over-run. Haven’t been to a dentist in ages now.

So, I ask you why should I have to go private why I am paying for the NHS. Would it not make more sense for me to just get private medical insurance and stop paying for the NHS? Because as it stands I am having to pay twice.
This is true for many people. Some having to wait months for procedures.

What’s good about the USA system?
If a Doctor does not give you a good service then you do not go back as they are driven by market forces. So, you tend to get better care. You’re also not paying for other peoples healthcare as much. (Although, Obama-care is still operating somewhat which is funded by taxes)

[zac_a]

adam277:
Personally, I think the NHS needs to be scrapped.

I’ve seen you say many whacky things but that has got to be THE one that takes the biscuit.

I’m guessing you’re not a parent. The biggest reason I had for moving back to the UK after living in a country where medical insurance was every bit an essential fact of life as it is in the US, was access to the NHS for my children, both of whom have had more life-threateningly essential need of it in their relatively short lives than I have done in the entirety of my six decades. If the top earners have to pay a bit more tax than me to make that option available to other parents, I’m more than content to let them pay.

Incidentally, the wealthiest of people pay more to their accountants than they tend to pay in tax, and I don’t think I need to spell out the link there.

[franglais]

adam277:
Not being able to see a GP. Or having to wait weeks after spending ages getting through on the phone via their tiny window for calling.
Long ■■■ wait times.
Dismissive Doctors’ who just want you out the door as fast as possible.

adam277:
What’s good about the USA system?
If a Doctor does not give you a good service then you do not go back as they are driven by market forces.

In the US you may get a better service as a private patient.
The USA as a whole is paying 50% more than us for their service. And they don`t all benefit equally.

Give the NHS £270bn and we would have a bloody Rolls-Royce of a service!
And we would all benefit from it.

But no, the Gov are running down the National service, to get you to call for privatisation.
And the Tory party funders get to make extra money from you.

[zac_a]

Conor:
I made money last week from the pound falling, most people who have pensions did. Because most of my S&S ISA and SIPP is invested in the US, about 65%, every 1% Sterling drops against the USD puts several hundred quid in my pocket just in FOREX. However when the pound recovered on Friday I lost over £1800 in a single day, along with those rich people who would have lost a lot more which funnily people like yourself tend to choose to ignore.

This is so good I’ve had to come back and read it multiple times, I’m still chuckling at TN’s very own Warren Buffett

If anyone spots Conor parked up and on his phone, don’t disturb him, he’s speaking to his stockbroker

“Yeah yeah, buy at two and a half points and sell when it gets to five”

[adam277]

Franglais:
Give the NHS £270bn and we would have a bloody Rolls-Royce of a service!
And we would all benefit from it.

And then 300bn then 400bn.
I think the NHS already gets too much money. I think we are already at the point of diminishing returns for investing in the NHS. e.g. for every 10% extra funding they get they do not provide a 10% better service.
The issue in the NHS is fundamental and systematic.

bbc.co.uk/news/health-63080462
bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-43794816

There is far too many managers in the NHS and it is far too bureaucratic. What I’d like to happen is someone who is extremely knowledgeable and capable to be appointed as head of the NHS for 5-10 years by a cross-party vote to put in place a long-term strategy to fix the NHS.
I do not think giving money to the NHS is the solution. It needs optimizing and improving massively. I am not against giving funds to the NHS by the way. But, I just have a feeling the money will be spent on stuff to cover the poor running of the NHS.
We need to get back to a place where people are seen by GPs on the same day and waiting times at hospital are less than two hours.

You may well be right about the government running the NHS down to call for privatization that same argument could of been said of British Rail.
That being said, no blank cheque for the NHS please.

[franglais]

adam277:

Franglais:
Give the NHS £270bn and we would have a bloody Rolls-Royce of a service!
And we would all benefit from it.

And then 300bn then 400bn.
I think the NHS already gets too much money. I think we are already at the point of diminishing returns for investing in the NHS. e.g. for every 10% extra funding they get they do not provide a 10% better service.
The issue in the NHS is fundamental and systematic.

bbc.co.uk/news/health-63080462
bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-43794816

There is far too many managers in the NHS and it is far too bureaucratic. What I’d like to happen is someone who is extremely knowledgeable and capable to be appointed as head of the NHS for 5-10 years by a cross-party vote to put in place a long-term strategy to fix the NHS.
I do not think giving money to the NHS is the solution. It needs optimizing and improving massively. I am not against giving funds to the NHS by the way. But, I just have a feeling the money will be spent on stuff to cover the poor running of the NHS.
We need to get back to a place where people are seen by GPs on the same day and waiting times at hospital are less than two hours.

You may well be right about the government running the NHS down to call for privatization that same argument could of been said of British Rail.
That being said, no blank cheque for the NHS please.

I CBA to reply to all of this propaganda you are repeating, but since you put up a couple of links,

First link:
Nurses etc are leaving the NHS. Yes. Why?
Because there aren`t enough of them. They are underpaid for the exacting work they do. They are under strain.
More funds would mean more staff, and shorter shifts. (NB: shorter shifts means less of the excessive overtime they regularly put in, not actual short shifts)
Lack of funds!

Second link:
More administrators being recruited than nurses? Yes. See above.
A gross failure since 2018 to recruit nurses. They have been underpaid for years.

Since the Tories took over and chose austerity, they chose to cut in real terms NHS funding wait times have increased.
(You linked the BBC, I`ll do the same)
bbc.com/news/health-60305502

So, less funds mean longer waits.
You want shorter waits, so suggest even less money?

Yeah, sure.

[scaniaultimate]

For those who believe that growth is the only answer to today’s problems I suggest a good read for a little bit of enlightenment (pun intended)…

Less is more by Jason Hickel.

jasonhickel.org/less-is-more

[franglais]

ScaniaUltimate:
For those who believe that growth is the only answer to today’s problems I suggest a good read for a little bit of enlightenment (pun intended)…

Less is more by Jason Hickel.

jasonhickel.org/less-is-more

0

I havent read the book... But there is indeed an argument to stop to global expansion. *(I note Russell Brand recommends it....but all the same, its probably worth a look)*

[scaniaultimate]

Franglais:

ScaniaUltimate:
For those who believe that growth is the only answer to today’s problems I suggest a good read for a little bit of enlightenment (pun intended)…

Less is more by Jason Hickel.

jasonhickel.org/less-is-more

0

I havent read the book... But there is indeed an argument to stop to global expansion. *(I note Russell Brand recommends it....but all the same, its probably worth a look)*

I was more worried about the authors of the foreword giving cause for rejection!