I see stobarts are advertising for a driving examiner.Its in their interests to train and get as many people through the tests.When I was a bus driver,you only needed a car license to apply.They trained you up for the psv licence,maybe that’s the way this industry is heading
Here we go again , you need a union to get you a decent
Pay rise , so how are all these agency drivers getting there pay rises ? There not in a union , they’ve just got a backbone & are capable of asking
For a decent rate , whereas reading this on here the company drivers need a bloody union to do it for them , and the amount of upset / going to jump ship company
Drivers on here , it seems these unions arnt doing a very good job of it .
Here’s a thought , all these company drivers , grows some balls , come out of hiding behind the union & do what the agency lads are doing , ask for a pay rise yourself !!!,
The trouble is that the Government are acutely aware of the fact that they are only in power (and Brexit only happened) because working-class people were fed up with their wages stagnating and conditions deteriorating due to imported labour from low-wage economies. So if they did try to solve the problem by going back to this model they would lose the huge advantage they have over Labour.
JeffA:
This idea that they will pay £16 an hour but drop it to minimum wage next year - is that based on anything more than a paranoid imagination? Has it ever happened in any other line of work?
I have seen a notice saying pay will go up to x but if and when the ee’s come back or there is no shortage the wage will be dropped back to what it is currently.
how legal this is i have no idea.
dozy:
Here we go again , you need a union to get you a decent
Pay rise , so how are all these agency drivers getting there pay rises ? There not in a union , they’ve just got a backbone & are capable of asking
For a decent rate , whereas reading this on here the company drivers need a bloody union to do it for them , and the amount of upset / going to jump ship company
Drivers on here , it seems these unions arnt doing a very good job of it .
Here’s a thought , all these company drivers , grows some balls , come out of hiding behind the union & do what the agency lads are doing , ask for a pay rise yourself !!!,
Brilliant idea, how did doing that work out for you at Stobbies, what special rates did you negotiate for yourself.
Company drivers with #bloodyunion are already on decent terms and have had decent rises every year, said unions are recognised by company for collective bargaining.
Agency lads are doing fine at the moment and good luck to them, make hay while the sun shines because you can be sure this happy agency state of affairs won’t last forever.
Juddian:
dozy:
Here we go again , you need a union to get you a decent
Pay rise , so how are all these agency drivers getting there pay rises ? There not in a union , they’ve just got a backbone & are capable of asking
For a decent rate , whereas reading this on here the company drivers need a bloody union to do it for them , and the amount of upset / going to jump ship company
Drivers on here , it seems these unions arnt doing a very good job of it .
Here’s a thought , all these company drivers , grows some balls , come out of hiding behind the union & do what the agency lads are doing , ask for a pay rise yourself !!!,Brilliant idea, how did doing that work out for you at Stobbies, what special rates did you negotiate for yourself.
Company drivers with #bloodyunion are already on decent terms and have had decent rises every year, said unions are recognised by company for collective bargaining.
Agency lads are doing fine at the moment and good luck to them, make hay while the sun shines because you can be sure this happy agency state of affairs won’t last forever.
I think this proves you cant be sure of anything - is there any hgv driver on earth 12 months ago who thought pay would gp through the roof? The average age is 56 - if I was running a haulage company I wouldnt be confidently sitting back and thinking the Ees or young drivers will save me. I would be panicking. Hard.
dozy:
Here we go again , you need a union to get you a decent
Pay rise , so how are all these agency drivers getting there pay rises ? There not in a union , they’ve just got a backbone & are capable of asking
For a decent rate , whereas reading this on here the company drivers need a bloody union to do it for them , and the amount of upset / going to jump ship company
Drivers on here , it seems these unions arnt doing a very good job of it .
Here’s a thought , all these company drivers , grows some balls , come out of hiding behind the union & do what the agency lads are doing , ask for a pay rise yourself !!!,
Why do you think agency guys have any say in what they are paid? The only reason rates have gone up is the shortage. If they had “asked” for a payrise 2 years ago the agency boss would still be doubled up in hysterical laughter to this day.
And forming a union in todays times is incredibly difficult - its taken them 40 years to dismantle the unions - reforming them in the face of utter hatred from employers is no walk in the park. I think peoplw deserve sympathy not condemnation.
JeffA:
So you think in two years they will all be paying minimum wage again? Wouldnt that cause another driver shortage?Wont ir35 put off east europeans when they can earn a fiver an hour more in Europe?
Can you think of any other jobs this has happened in? When plumbers started earning more did more people become plumbers so rates fell back lower?
I didn’t say it would be min wage (although with inflation and labor proposal for £10 per hour NMW who knows lol), it’ll prob be £10-11 for class 2 and £12-13 for class 1 starting rates
I don’t think ‘‘europeans’’ are coming back for reasons not entirely related to £.per hour. I’d wager a week’s money that most if not the vast majority of those who left due to IR35 already had or could’ve obtained easily settled/pre-settled status if they wanted to.
Absent unions/gov’t protectionists policies the market will find a solution it always does. I don’t see HGV driving as a unique profession… I think there are plenty of people here willing to drop whetever they’re doing (picking/packing, laboring, sitting at home, tending gardens/bars etc. etc.) and borrow £1500 on their credit card for a week’s course to get their class 2 license and start earning, say £15 an hour. So far we’ve seen the gov’t playing along and trying to ‘‘help’’ by relaxing hours, planning to eliminate class 2 license so straight to class 1 who knows what else they’re going to come up with but they’re definitely not pro-status quo as it is now with soaring wages, that’ll put even further pressure on prices (if bosses are to be believed) and they don’t want that
JeffA:
dozy:
Here we go again , you need a union to get you a decent
Pay rise , so how are all these agency drivers getting there pay rises ? There not in a union , they’ve just got a backbone & are capable of asking
For a decent rate , whereas reading this on here the company drivers need a bloody union to do it for them , and the amount of upset / going to jump ship company
Drivers on here , it seems these unions arnt doing a very good job of it .
Here’s a thought , all these company drivers , grows some balls , come out of hiding behind the union & do what the agency lads are doing , ask for a pay rise yourself !!!,Why do you think agency guys have any say in what they are paid? The only reason rates have gone up is the shortage. If they had “asked” for a payrise 2 years ago the agency boss would still be doubled up in hysterical laughter to this day.
And forming a union in todays times is incredibly difficult - its taken them 40 years to dismantle the unions - reforming them in the face of utter hatred from employers is no walk in the park. I think peoplw deserve sympathy not condemnation.
The unions have lost a lot of their power over the years, now is the time to join one to join to try to hold on to the better wages and conditions your now getting. If you haven,t got one where your working join your local area branch and most of all attend meetings and make your feelings heard. It will take a hell of a lot of organising and there,s to many complacent drivers who won,t do anything but still moan about things.
What it needs is someone like Alan Law who did more for drivers wages and conditions than anyone I can think of. The transport bosses in the west mids. during the 195o,s to early 70,s quacked in thier boots at the mention of his name. You either loved him or hated him but he sure improved the job. Google him.
Sploom:
We complain about cheap labour which is fair enough,but it’s not just lorry drivers.We don’t mind using low cost airlines or cheap clothes made in third world countries.I think the whole capitalist system needs looking at,ok not communism,I don’t know what the answer is,but the rich are getting richer and the working is at the bottom up to his neck in debt to pay his mortgage to pay for his house that house only cost a small fraction to actually build, just some thoughts I had,I’m no expert on this
Agree 100%
The system is Friar Tucked.
Sent from my M2007J3SG using Tapatalk
Sploom:
We complain about cheap labour which is fair enough,but it’s not just lorry drivers.We don’t mind using low cost airlines or cheap clothes made in third world countries.I think the whole capitalist system needs looking at,ok not communism,I don’t know what the answer is,but the rich are getting richer and the working is at the bottom up to his neck in debt to pay his mortgage to pay for his house that house only cost a small fraction to actually build, just some thoughts I had,I’m no expert on this
Treat them mean keep them keen…
WaggerWagger888:
What it needs is someone like Alan Law who did more for drivers wages and conditions than anyone I can think of. The transport bosses in the west mids. during the 195o,s to early 70,s quacked in thier boots at the mention of his name. You either loved him or hated him but he sure improved the job. Google him.
For anyone who can’t be bothered Googling: archive.commercialmotor.com/arti … ock-troops
Alan law couldnt exist today - it like saying what we need is another arthur scargill - the balance of power today is so one sided a 70s union guy couldnt even comprehend it.
ETS:
JeffA:
So you think in two years they will all be paying minimum wage again? Wouldnt that cause another driver shortage?Wont ir35 put off east europeans when they can earn a fiver an hour more in Europe?
Can you think of any other jobs this has happened in? When plumbers started earning more did more people become plumbers so rates fell back lower?
[/quote. I don’t see HGV driving as a unique profession… I think there are plenty of people here willing to drop whetever they’re doing (picking/packing, laboring, sitting at home, tending gardens/bars etc. etc.) and borrow £1500 on their credit card for a week’s course to get their class 2 license and start earning, say £15 an hour. So far we’ve seen the gov’t playing along and trying to ‘‘help’’ by relaxing hours, planning to eliminate class 2 license so straight to class 1 who knows what else they’re going to come up with but they’re definitely not pro-status quo as it is now with soaring wages, that’ll put even further pressure on prices (if bosses are to be believed) and they don’t want that
Hgv driving is unique in the sense its the only profession I can think of in this position. I dont think its as attractive as you might think - shelling out thousands is very offputting to the vast majority.
And in 10 years automated trucks will put them all on the scrapheap anyway.
I’ve posted in the past about the concept of “Price Discovery” known to economists…
It appears to be in full swing via the agency market right now
…But has yet to appear in the full time jobs market.
You don’t get a pay rise by “asking” these days…
You get it by saying NO.
First you say NO to working 84 hours or anything else beyond a 60 hour week.
Then you say NO to working more than the WTD average of 48 hours
…Next you say NO to working overtime at flat rate, nights at day rate, or 15 hours at 12 hour rate.
Finally you say NO to everything, until someone comes up with the price discovery deal of "If you drop your current £14ph job - would you come and work my job for £18ph?
No? OK - how about £20? Yes? Then we have a deal. You start monday.
Full time employers - just don’t want to do it. They are like cars that cannot sit behind a truck for longer than 0.1 seconds before getting impatient, and having to overtake, never mind the blind bend coming up, no room in the next lane, or the scrawly rain making visibility well-nigh impossible…
Price Discovery.
Only those who have the will to destroy something “A job offer you surely cannot refuse in this economy…” - truly ever had any control over it. 
When the gap between plentiful agency rate and standard full timer rate - reaches critical differential - THAT is where the fun really starts…
See the other thread “Where have all me drivers gone”…
The day cometh when Full Timers who only a year ago said “"I wouldn’t be seen dead working for an agency”… Everyone has a limit at which point even the biggest die-hard agency avoider is going to go… “Well Yeh. I’d do that basic pick-up and drop x 3 for £28ph…”
Once full timers reach that tipping point when they all resign en-masse, not senior enough to make it worth hanging on for a redundancy package, which will unlikely ever come… To go and earn near double what they were earning in their “secure job” that “mustn’t be chucked in this economy, as there’s simply no demand for drivers out there at the moment.”…
Well something is happening folks… Even my phone has been ringing off the hook this past month…
It is nice to be in demand again - for sure. But it is the fact I am refusing to take any work I remotely don’t like the sound of - that gets me now offered some of the more decent stuff: Dead Man’s shoes work - just as I always liked it. 
Winseer:
Once full timers reach that tipping point when they all resign en-masse, not senior enough to make it worth hanging on for a redundancy package, which will unlikely ever come… To go and earn near double what they were earning in their “secure job” that “mustn’t be chucked in this economy, as there’s simply no demand for drivers out there at the moment.”…
Keep taking whatever strong medication you’re on.
JeffA:
dozy:
Here we go again , you need a union to get you a decent
Pay rise , so how are all these agency drivers getting there pay rises ? There not in a union , they’ve just got a backbone & are capable of asking
For a decent rate , whereas reading this on here the company drivers need a bloody union to do it for them , and the amount of upset / going to jump ship company
Drivers on here , it seems these unions arnt doing a very good job of it .
Here’s a thought , all these company drivers , grows some balls , come out of hiding behind the union & do what the agency lads are doing , ask for a pay rise yourself !!!,Why do you think agency guys have any say in what they are paid? The only reason rates have gone up is the shortage. If they had “asked” for a payrise 2 years ago the agency boss would still be doubled up in hysterical laughter to this day.
And forming a union in todays times is incredibly difficult - its taken them 40 years to dismantle the unions - reforming them in the face of utter hatred from employers is no walk in the park. I think peoplw deserve sympathy not condemnation.
Agency drivers have always been paid more as they don’t have the ‘security’ of a perm position. However, the haulage industry simply CANNOT run without us temp heroes 
The bottom line is this, many of us limpers have our financial house in order, we don’t HAVE to work all the hours God sends, and if we don’t like a place we go to we simply foxtrot oscar 
Haulage bosses are sheet scared of us turning up for a run & then turning round and saying “No thanks mate” and getting in our cars & ■■■■■■■ off home.
MOST agency guys I have met over the years are pretty disruptive & rebellious types too, which along with with the above means we generally don’t give a toss which only serves to actually bolster our position, so Dozy is actually quite correct in what he says. I personally keep asking for my money to go up and like magic…it does
So as I always say…grow a backbone and demand more, full-time or agency and may the cash rain down upon you 
The firm (Large westcountry based)I’ve worked for for over twenty years has basically given us a £2 an hour pay rise over the last year, that and a few nice incentive bonuses mean I’m quite happy where I am.
The issue we have is being about half a dozen drivers short on multi drop pallets so our workload is above average and the last few months have been tough, once the influx of new drivers happens we’ll be ok and we’ll have benefitted from the madness.
A few drivers have jumped ship to chase the money but personally I think they’re making a mistake.
So let’s get this straight, everyone resigns en-masse, which gives Winseer the opportunity to cherry pick a dead man’s shoes job with preferred days, start time and daily hours and don’t forget top rate. Aye, good one.
JeffA:
Alan law couldnt exist today - it like saying what we need is another arthur scargill - the balance of power today is so one sided a 70s union guy couldnt even comprehend it.
The difference in the 70s is that you still had a majority of fellas around who’d fought the war, concerned themselves with politics, and stood together. They threw up such figures like Scargill and Law, and many more, to fight for their interests, instead of opting for slow decline under “moderates”.
When Scargill took the miners out on strike for a year to defend their industry from total closure and offshoring, he probably expected something similar to the 70s when the government fell.
Instead, by the 80s, not even the miners stood together. Too many thought their pits would be safe. In the end, they all hanged separately in the years following, as did the entire trade union movement.
Now their grandkids spend tens of thousands on an education then work making sandwiches and serving coffee for minimum wage.