Do we make it hard for new drivers?

[mrflibble]

scanny77:
all im saying is that you should always give the wagon a quick once over to make sure its all working and you are happy with what you are required to use. its not just the safety aspect. you will look like a bit of a spanner if you get to a tip and cant tip it because you didnt check before you left. i bet quite a few drivers here have learned that one the hard way.

Yep. I don’t think I’ve ever been completely unable to tip, but I did have one drop where I couldn’t work out how to operate the tail lift from anywhere other than the outside controls.

(I worked out about half-way through tipping that it had buttons on the floor of the tail-lift that only worked when the switches on the control panel were in particular positions.)

I always make sure I can raise and lower the tail lift before I leave the yard.

As for the original question, there are good and bad places. Some of them seem to treat you like dirt and act as if it’s a major imposition if you ask them for any advice or info. Many of them will assume that you’re experienced and know (or can work out) what you’re doing, but if you tell them that you’re new will be pretty helpful, and some will actively ask. On my first days at both Somerfield and Sainsbury’s I was given a 15-minute intro into what to do (where to find the units, trailers, etc., how to fill in the paperwork, and all that sort of stuff.) Of course, they didn’t go into the basic stuff like tachos since I was already vaguely experienced by that point.

In the case of talisman getting given the worst run, they might not have realised that you were a newbie. Most places tend to be biased towards their own drivers over agency ones (understandably, as they want to keep their own drivers, but agency ones are easily replaced, particularly the short-term “I need a driver for tomorrow”-type bookings). One of their regular drivers probably asked to switch to get an easier run, and in some ways, you can see why the office might agree - after all, they don’t really care whether you’re happy or not.

Coffeeholic:

Traz:
when i got back they said how did it go…i said i took my time and didnt hit anything, good they went u’ve passed or test as its a bloody hard place to get to…what plonkers!!!

Why plonkers? They gave you a wee test to see how good you are You proved you are good and got the job done so now they know they don’t have too much to worry about with you and can give you more artic work. Seems to me everyone’s a winner.

Also, they gave you a test in what was probably a reasonably safe location - a quiet farm where you can relax and take your time without getting flustered, and where you’re unlikely to cause any serious damage if you hit anything.

Much better to find out that you can’t cope with close-quarters manouevring in that sort of situation than when trying to reverse into a narrow alleyway off a busy High Street with impatient pedestrians and cars flying at you from all angles.

[scanny77]

gsm31:
Scanny,have you done a delivery for Iceland at the Davidson Mains store(Edinburgh)?

yes. should be on a small trailer. back into the yard. the loading bay is the only one behind you

i think quality street is limited so use corbiehill road
Maps.Yell.com
when you get to the bottom, swing left and back in on your good side

(edited your url to bring the page width down a bit. Simon)

[bones]

scanny77:
i
all im saying is that you should always give the wagon a quick once over to make sure its all working and you are happy with what you are required to use. its not just the safety aspect. you will look like a bit of a spanner if you get to a tip and cant tip it because you didnt check before you left. i

Think the DSV subbie who tipped at our place on saturday should have read that…since he couldnt find reverse for the life of him…the fact he didnt speak a word of english also made things very difficult. But we got him sorted in the end

[kenny1975]

In induction for Somerfields was warned to always check tail lifts, even just to make sure you have an anderson lead.

Kinda lead to believe if you don’t check and you end up at a shop and tail lift doesent work and your agency prob won’t be working there again. Espec if its because you don’t have a anderson lead.

[simon]

I did a shift for that “number of the beast” place, from their Newbridge depot, when they still had their old name, many years ago.

The run I got was 22 drops, round Glasgow city centre, on the 22nd of December. The run had to be done in the order laid out in the run sheet.
!st problem was that a lot of the addresses were wrongly typed out.
2nd problem was that I’d only been back in the UK for 6 weeks, after living abroad for 10 years, so didn’t have a clue about how Glasgow city centre was laid out. I had my own map, but no numbers so had to guess which cross street would put me in the right place to be able to reach the number on the up/down street.
As my run was laid out for me, I couldn’t do all the drops on say, Bath Lane then all the ones on West Regent street. I had to chop about all over the place.

One example was a chippy on Port Dundas Street. There is no such road in Glasgow, however there is a Port Dundas Road, so this one wasn’t that difficult really. This one was my first drop. As you can imagine, their extreme competence filled me with confidence.
Another one, the address I had was for a company called Compass, on Springfield Quay. Springfield quay is where the Post Office sorting office for Glasgow used to be. I eventually found out that Compass was the catering contractor for the sorting office. But not until I’d been up and down Springfield Quay several times, asking several people, including posties, for directions. I decided to try the next quay down, eventually ending up at the Gorbals Fire Station . I eventually found it by phoning the transport office, who contacted Compass, who then phoned me.
When I eventually got back to Newbridge, I’d been to 20 of the 22 drops and delivered to 17 of them. The three I got to but didn’t deliver, was because I couldn’t find the goods I was supposed to deliver on the back of the wagon.

I wasn’t told their procedures either (so nothings changed there then) and due to that there was a screw-up in their ‘end of shift business’. Due to the screw-up the company refused to pay the agency who in their turn refused to pay me. When the agency phoned me a week later to do a shift, I agreed but stayed tucked up in my nice warm bed. When they phoned to enquire of my whereabouts I told them I was still in bed. But your supposed to be at so 'n so’s place they said. Do you really expect me to carry on working for nothing?, I said. I never got another phone call from that agency << as you can see, I’m heartbroken.

[irizarkid]

I am totaly with you on this one - i have been driving coaches for seven years (double deckers all over europe) carrying upwards of seventy people at a time and in march of this year i passed my class 1 because i wanted to drive artics.
However - since march i have applied for 27 jobs and been refused on every one in fact out of those 27 i have had 2 interveiws - all because i dont have at least 2 years experience - er, maybe i`m being a bit thick here but how do you get experience? obviously driving an 18 ton, 14 meter, tri axle DD with rear wheel steering and being responsable for over seventy human lives dosnt count for much - it would appear that tins of beans are more valuble!!!
I live in Bracknell Berkshire - if anyone can help on my quest for a class 1 job my email is irizarkid@yahoo.co.uk

[flying_fenman]

irizarkid:
i have had 2 interveiws - all because i dont have at least 2 years experience - er, maybe i`m being a bit thick here but how do you get experience? obviously driving an 18 ton, 14 meter, tri axle DD with rear wheel steering and being responsable for over seventy human lives dosnt count for much - it would appear that tins of beans are more valuble!!!
I live in Bracknell Berkshire - if anyone can help on my quest for a class 1 job my email is irizarkid@yahoo.co.uk

I have a lot of sympathy for your predicament mate. I think the problem you face is that the jobs are different. Granted - a Century or an Alizee with 57 pax and a boot full of luggage handles a lot like an 18 tonner. But truck driving as not just about driving as much as coach driving is.

Truck driving has loads more stuff that we all have to get to grips with for example - load security, ancillary equipment (such as tail-lifts, tipping equipment, fridges, walking floors etc), safe loading and unloading techniques, knowledge of safe overnight parking etc. These are just a few examples that aren’t relevant to coaching. There’s loads more to this job than the driving bit. I certainly don’t know it all yet, and probably never will.

Most PCV work involves the load loading itself, securing itself, sitting in place for the duration of the journey (unless it’s kids ), releasing itself before finally unloading itself. This is maybe over-simplifying it a touch - I am well aware that the job has it’s problems (Father’s in the business ) and I do not mean to make the job sound easy because it isn’t in lots of ways.

The responsibility on a coach driver is immense - taking a Skyliner with 75 kids over the Alps requires huge skill and concentration - it is not a time you want to have an accident. Imagine explaining to 75 sets of parents that their child won’t be coming home. Even if it was one of their little darlings that threw the football at your head which caused you to lose control.

I really wish you well in your search - to my mind you certainly have some advantage over someone upgrading from a car licence. Don’t be put off - keep at it. If an advert requires two years experience - give them a ring anyway and explain your personal circumstances. Go visit some companies and take your licence and work bag with you. You may find someone willing to give you a shot there and then - especially if they’ve been let down that morning. Try the big boys as well as the smaller firms too.

Good luck - please keep us informed.

[scania245]

simon had the same thing ie were not paying you (but i got it when i should have due to my charm and the fact i would be in to get it personally id done all the drops i wanted payed ) so imagine my surprise and delight over a year later when they called me again and they really wanted me so after 6 calls id got the money up £2 per hour on their rate i just forgot all about the shift i love agenceys

[pettaw]

Yeah gotta agree with that sentiment. I’ve got my Class 1 but only had it a few months and I work in another job during the week so I do weekend shifts on agency. I was on my 4th or was it 5th job with this company today. Second with a Class 2.

Was sent out on a multidrop run in an 18t fridge. Couldn’t believe it was only 18t, cos the size of the box on it was big and it had a long rear overhang.

Anyhow, the drops were in the West End, and Soho/Covent Garden area.

You’re supposed to have a Van assistant with you who knows the route and will help you navigate round and also with the unloading. Anyway, this guy had only done this run himself a couple of times and wasn’t too sure of the route, and didn’t really care anyway. So out with the Tomtom and the maps to try and find the way round.

We got lost so many times, and I touched lamposts several times reversing trying to get round corners cos for some reason this MAN lorry didn’t seem to have a very good steering lock. Luckily no visible damage so far, just dented pride…Can I drive this vehicle at all. I even took advantage of my training schools artic and booked myself in for a days extra artic training to try and improve my skills.

Unfortunately it didn’t end there. I cracked the back end of someone’s wing mirror with the back end turning left out of a narrow road into another narrow road. I don’t remember if I reversed into it or whether the outswinging rear came round and clipped it. I didn’t even notice, but he came chasing after me as I parked up in the next drop round the corner. So now really feeling gutted. Then we end up going down yet another road that was far too narrow and a left turn onto one of the main roads, but this time with a large pedestrian crossing in the middle. Managed to avoid the black post on the corner, just…but in doing so, really clattered a yellow plastic bollard on the traffic island crossing.

I phoned up the transport office to tell them about the accident with the van the guy on the phone seemed quite nice about it…these things happen etc…When I got back about three hours late, there was only one guy left in there and he wasn’t so nice, particularly as I reckoned even though you see loads of these bollards knocked over I should own up about that one as well. What■■? Can’t you use your [zb] mirrors. Explained that we got lost several times as didn’t know the route and found ourselves down many very tight roads, [including the correct road that we should have used but they’d changed the roadworks so now no longer could negotiate that corner. Found another driver working for a haulage firm to see me back…he wondered out loud how the [zb] we got the vehicle round that corner in the first place…which we did, coming one way but couldn’t do it coming back.]

I’m hoping I’ll get back into that company, cos although the work is hard, and food multidrop is lots of heavy lifting, its all valuable experience, but I have a feeling the agency might not be phoning up so often now

I realize I’m hanging myself out to dry here but I thought I should share my experiences.

Lesson’s learnt, don’t try it and see…it won’t work…and second, don’t rely on Assistants to watch you back.

Oh, also should I report the bollard incident to anyone else apart from the transport office? I filled out an accident report form but do I need to do anything else. There’s loads of cameras along there so there’s a good chance I was on TV. Surely if I’ve put it on the paperwork then the firm and their insurance company should sort out all the relevent details.

[saratoga]

My difficulty is reversing. It used to be easier with the other trucks I worked with in my previous job, but it just seems harder, especially in the dark

I’ve tried putting my hazards on, but it doesn’t always help. I’ve tried “heated mirrors” but they don’t work either. Reversing into tight spaces isn’t a good thing for me, or blindside reversing or anything. But, even so, I am kinda glad I’m out of the cherrypicker work. Things were going downhill for me there

The last company I was at, a two day job. The first day I asked “what was this funny shaped key for” “Oh, that’s a tail lift control key - let me show you”

I was also shown about making manual entries on a tacho and getting a printout from the digi machine

“Oh, you can do this for the 15 days before you get your digicard…”

I could mention a few bad words here, but I wasn’t planning to get a digicard for a while until work had picked up as such, and the Agency KNEW I didn’t have a digicard. It seems that their HGVs were on a mix of tacho and digi’s but all the 7.5s are on digi… That’s they’re excuse anyway.

However, they’ve got me in work. On Friday they tried to send me on a week of vans with DHL, which i refused for 7.5 work. Even if they didn’t manage to get me in work on Monday, it’s not the end of the world.

The only thing i have to worry about now is keeping track of the hours I work, the rest periods and breaks and everything. I’ve done myself a small spreadsheet to keep a track of everything…

And I’m reading up here on TNUK

[henrys_cat]

Saratoga:
I could mention a few bad words here, but I wasn’t planning to get a digicard for a while until work had picked up as such, and the Agency KNEW I didn’t have a digicard. It seems that their HGVs were on a mix of tacho and digi’s but all the 7.5s are on digi… That’s they’re excuse anyway.

My advice would be to send off for one ASAP, I know its 38 quid, but once you’ve got it it may open up several door, not only with the agency but also if your applying for a perminant job.

I’ve got mine, even though my truck doesn’t need one and isn’t due to be changed for a couple of years, but you never know whats around the next corner.

[kenny1975]

Digi cards are a must for an agency driver. I passed my class 1 a months before they came out. I was struggling to get class 1 work, getting it here and there.

A lot of guys were and still are refusing to get a digi card, plus was some talk that a lot of companies where goign to upgrade their fleets before they came in so they could hold off as long as possible moving to digital tachosgraphs.

When they came out a large contract the agency i was with replaced their trucks, i enjoyed working for them doing class 2 but was told wouldn’t be able to without a digi card. So i got one. That company wouldnt allow me to drive their class 1’s because i hadnt had my licence long enough but a few weeks after they got their new trucks they changed their mind.

After that got loads of class 1 work even tho i had only had my licence a few months because the agency was struggling to get drivers with digi cards. Went from being lucky to get one class 1 shift a week to driving only class 1’s full time with agencies in a matter of weeks. Plus its always nice to drive brand new trucks

Even just now a few agency have been texting me about having higher rates of pay for digi card drivers, they still seem to be struggling to get a hold of drivers with digi cards.

[saratoga]

Thanks for that Henrys Cat and Kenny

I had kinda already decided to get a digi card. I’ve just gotta get the bits together and everything. Hopefully send it off today

Just gotta remember to comb my hair this time before my licence photo and stuff

Still, my drivers licence isn’t as bad as my passport photo

Having driven the digi trucks I can see where it helps and makes things easier, especially where it tells you how much drive time and stuff you’ve got left

[pettaw]

Yeah I’ve got a digi card. If you’ve got a photo licence then you don’t need to do anything hard, just send off a form you can get from your local DVLA office. I know the cost is a matter of principle for some drivers, but I pay more than that filling up my car every week As Kenny said, a digi card is something you really need on agency, every one I’ve signed up with has been glad I’ve got mine.

[pettaw]

OK well after feeling pangs of guilt and chatting to someone on here about what to do next, I decided to ‘turn myself in’ and phoned up Westminster Council. The guy just put it through as a report, he said they don’t bother chasing up these type of bollard accidents, too much bother.

Anyway, I’ve got a report reference number, in case anyone accuses me of not reporting the incident at all.

[wildgoose]

Pretty honourable to let them know, the amount of people you see hitting bollards, traffic signs etc around there. But its no surprise to hear they werent too fussed, they have enough to do as it is.

I feel for you, driving a truck that size around Soho and Covent Garden. Along with the City it is possibly the most frustrating experience to be had driving in the capital. Although to be honest, nothing above a van size is easy anywhere in London. Delivering food, drink or supplies to restaurants/eateries/shop fronts, you are guaranteed a day of headbanging on the wall.

Sat nav would be next to useless around there as well, as the prohibited turn signs and one way streeets, change round on almost a daily basis.

If you take a wrong turn, then that is it. Anyone who has ended up on High Holborn, mid afternoon on a Friday, after making a wrong decision in Covert Garden will know exactly what I mean . It could take you weeks to get back, 10-15 drops suddenly starts to feel more like 65.

The roads are designed such, that even if there wasnt a single car on them, you still wouldnt be able to get a LWB sprinter safely through, let alone 7.5t or bigger. More often than not you will round a corner, to find somebody parked in the most ridiculous place, with no sign of the driver, and you have to somehow get yourself out. Meanwhile a ten car queue has formed behind you. In the city, those nice chunky City of London branded bollards are the bain of my life.

Still, despite all this, do it for long enough, and you will be going backwards through gaps that school run mum wouldnt take her chelsea tractor through forwards.

[wildgoose]

Looking at where you live, if you ever want to go full time driving 7.5t all over the postcodes. I happen to know an opening

[pettaw]

Haha, this wasn’t even a 7.5t, and yeah you’re dead right a 7.5t is hard enough. This was an 18t rigid, and a large one at that, with a fairly long overhang at the back. There are so many roads and corners that you just cannot get around without going over the pavement. I hit two things badly, but touched a great many other things without damage and came so close to hitting many many other things. Probably would have been easier if I had an assistant that had some clue about the route so we didn’t get lost every 5 minutes… Of course, I’m the driver so I hold the ultimate responsibiliy but still…

Nothing honourable about it tbh, there’s so much CCTV that I thought I’d better own up and face the consequences rather than face a prosecution for failing to report. Not only that. Looking at my tacho disc this morning, I’ve discovered that the half hour break that I took two thirds of the way through the shift (I’d already taken a couple of 15s earlier) was, in fact 25 minutes so I’ve not reset my driving time counter so I’m over my driving hours…

I can’t have a full time job driving I’m afraid, because I already have a full time job, and am driving for a change of scenery. I would say ‘fun’ but this run wasn’t fun at all. If I could find a nice regular Saturday job, provided the shift ended by 11am so that I could still get my full rest in, then that would be so fantastic, otherwise its every other weekend only.

[simon]

WildGoose:
The roads are designed such, that even if there wasnt a single car on them, you still wouldnt be able to get a LWB sprinter safely through, let alone 7.5t or bigger. More often than not you will round a corner, to find somebody parked in the most ridiculous place, with no sign of the driver, and you have to somehow get yourself out. Meanwhile a ten car queue has formed behind you. In the city, those nice chunky City of London branded bollards are the bain of my life.

Still, despite all this, do it for long enough, and you will be going backwards through gaps that school run mum wouldnt take her chelsea tractor through forwards.

You seem to know London pretty well

Quite a few years ago, I had a fairly regular job through the agency, doing holiday cover for the 1 driver at a local cheese company.
I’ve had to look around on an on-line map of London for this and I’m not 100% sure I’ve got the right addresses, but it looks about right.
This particular delivery was to a dairy. They had a shop on Hackney Road, 2 shops or so before the turn off onto The Oval. Their actual dairy was on Emma Street. There was a Postal Sorting Office opposite the dairy on Emma Street. The posties cars would be parked on both sides of the street and all the way round the junctions. It made little difference which direction you came from, it was a [zb] to get into.
I always had 2 or 3 mixed pallets to deliver there.
It took a 3 point turn (at least) just to get my wagon round the bollards into Emma Street. I was driving a 17t MAN 232 fridge, not renown for a tight turning circle. Lots of horses at that time, for a 17 tonner.
Does any of that sound familiar, or don’t you do Hackney ?

Emma St Map Link.

P.S. Going straight backwards is easy in a rigid. You’ve got those big mirrors and the length of the wagon, to line up that gap with