Digital Tacho download, is it work?

UK PROFESSIONAL DRIVERS FORUMS THE UK PROFESSIONAL DRIVERS FORUM (INTERACTIVE)
1

I"m currently working under domestic rules, so I don’t need to use my card. However my employer has stated in company policy as it’s a legal requirement for “me” to download my card every 2 weeks. Whilst this is all fine and dandy the catch is, the only card downloader is 2 hours away in another depot.

Company policy is I have to do this in my own time. I was working under EU rules for 10+ years before taking this employment, and still have 3 years left on my digi card. Do i plan on being with this company in 3 years time, I don’t know. Company have offered me 2 options,

  • Surrender my card to them to return to DVLA.
  • Every fortnight make the 4 hour round trip to download my card

I know under EC 561/2006 4(i)

A transport undertaking which uses vehicles that are fitted with recording equipment complying with Annex IB of Regulation (EEC) No 3821/85 and that fall within the scope of this Regulation, shall:

(i)ensure that all data are downloaded from the vehicle unit and driver card as regularly as is stipulated by the Member State and that relevant data are downloaded more frequently so as to ensure that all data concerning activities undertaken by or for that undertaking are downloaded

That it’s listed as the Transport undertakings responsibility to download the card, but as our vehicles are not fitted with any recording equipment, where does the responsibility fall?

I also know that its a legal requirement for me to carry it at all times whilst driving professionally, which I do. I also know its thought that bringing that card to work, would/could translate to making the card available for the Transport undertakings to download. It’s listed on several blogs, several sites, related to such topics on the internet that this is the only legal obligation for the driver to do(with no links to any legislation), but as my currently employment falls under domestic rules is this still the same?

Wouldn’t doing something stated in company policy be classed as working time, and thus have to be compensated? I mean what’s to say that you have to check your vechile in your own time to be legal to do the job.

please find attached a image of a letter threatening to put me on unpaid leave in 13 days time, I’m looking for some legal help/advice and advice from you all that have delt with these big companies in the past.

Many thanks

Tommymanc

EDIT: spelling and ■■■■■■ grammer

unpaidleave.jpg
unpaidleave.jpg906×1092 173 KB

2

They are a shower of ■■■■ to work for frankly. They can provide a tacho reading machine of various sorts that can do what is required at any depots they have. To expect you to do this in your own time and tavel 2 hours each way is frankly totally unaceptable, not to mention encouraging you to surrender your digi card is frankly none of their business if you wish to have one or not. They are doing all this for their benefit and not yours. I would personally email a copy of that letter to DVSA and request clarification on it from them, then drop the company right in it and leave. They are taking ■■■■ legalities or no legalities.

3

Hi, I totally agree with simcor. They are taking the zb. You don’t need to surrender it and shouldn’t. Also if its company policy that you have to download it every 2 weeks at another depo then that is classed as working time as its not your fixed place of work. So make sure you tell them to include the time as working time towards your WTD. Also because its work ask them to reimburse costs of travel as its a business expense.

Give them a little grief and they will soon back off.
Its good you got it in writing as they clearly have messed up by saying you have to go to the other depo in your own time which is not the case as that time is classed as working time. So use it to your advantage and request payment or expenses and also make sure they include this time towards your WTD.

They will get fed up soon.

You can also say you sent it off dvla and keep it at home :slight_smile:
It could have got lost in the post:)

4

If it’s a really good job, and you’re on a thousand quid a shift? Do it.
If it’s a poor to average job, on basic money, then ask for pay. It clearly is part of your duty, and should be paid as such.
.
Tacho card downloaders are cheap as chips now, and supplying you with one would be cheaper for the company than paying 4 hrs a couple of times.
Point that out to them, and you’ll keep your time off, plus get brownie points.

5

simcor:
They are a shower of [zb] to work for frankly. They can provide a tacho reading machine of various sorts that can do what is required at any depots they have. To expect you to do this in your own time and tavel 2 hours each way is frankly totally unaceptable, not to mention discouraging you to surrender your digi card is frankly none of their business if you wish to have one or not. They are doing all this for their benefit and not yours. I would personally email a copy of that letter to DVSA and request clarification on it from them, then drop the company right in it and leave. They are taking ■■■■ legalities or no legalities.

^^^^^
Exactly this, all day long.

2 hours of your own time,.and unpaid?..■■■■ that ! :unamused:
I’d sooner spend 2 hours of my own time unpaid, polishing my tank and blackening my tyres. :laughing:

6

Simple answer call in the other depot on your way back from a run,it makes no difference when the download takes place as long as its done a day or so is not going to make any difference

7

If you where under EU, its the company’s responsibility to down load it, not yours, you would do it in company time.
They are telling you to do it, that’s like an order, = work time.
Which ever way you look at it, they want/need it, it should be done in works time, may be an exception if as above its a mega good job, and there are ways to get 4hours back :wink:
£50 - £60 would get them a downloader with a display, they only want to see if you been driving, not analysing it, as above again, suggest this.
If they reject buying a downloader, or paying you to do it, they are either a tight arse company, or the idea was thought up by a pointy shoe non-job, trying to justify their existence with the bonus of not costing the company money (read arse licker), or both.

8

First of all I agree with other posters that the company are making unreasonable requests.
Possible solution, give the card to someone else who will be visiting the other site and let them download it for you.

9

The only legal obligation you have as a driver is to present your card for downloading. It is up to the company to ensure they have the facilities. So if you walk into your transport office and say “here’s my card for downloading” you’ve done your part.

10

Thank you all so far for the advice and comments, at this time I have gone ahead and follow what simcor suggested and have touch base with DVSA currently awaiting a response.

11

“As a business we strongly discourage employees not to have a digital tachograph card…”

It is such a negative business it is getting lost in it own double negativity.
If they want you to take advice from them it should at least make sense.

12

I am slightly confused by the seemingly nonsensical sentence in your employer’s letter, it seems like they meant “encourage” rather than “discourage”.

I am unsure of the rights or wrongs, but almost certainly if the card was going to be returned there is no requirement for this to be done through the employer.

13

If you don’t have to use your card. Why does it need to be downloaded? As there be nothing on it to downloaded.
Scenario your out of work For a a month or so you don’t go best Just download my card every few weeks.just in case.
No point in my eyes as be nothing on it

14

Conor:
The only legal obligation you have as a driver is to present your card for downloading. It is up to the company to ensure they have the facilities. So if you walk into your transport office and say “here’s my card for downloading” you’ve done your part.

This ^^^^ every time. Simple as that, no argument.

15

Agree with Simcor and Conor. It is the company’s responsibility to download the driver card not the driver’s. Travelling to another site to do so is a company instruction and thus ‘other work’, which should be paid. The way to deal with this is to look up the company on the gov’t website “check Operators licence” enter the name of company and the nominated Transport manager’s name(s) will come up. Then do as suggested and contact DVSA enclosing the letter and report the TM as requiring investigation since this evidence suggests he is either incompetent or being overruled by ignorant more senior management. The failure to supply downloading equipment also suggests that there may be insufficient funds to carry on the business of operating goods vehicles safely.

16

Conor:
The only legal obligation you have as a driver is to present your card for downloading. It is up to the company to ensure they have the facilities. So if you walk into your transport office and say “here’s my card for downloading” you’ve done your part.

While I don’t often agree with Conor, lol, as I am a current TM, he is absolutely correct.

If we didn’t have the equipment, that is not the employees problem, it would be ours as a company. And as others have said, to have you go to their other premises to download it, is doing it in work time, for which they would have to pay you, and it would have to be logged as ‘other work.’

As for downloading it in 14 days, the law is quite specific insofar as it only requires a download every 28 days. They cannot force you, but merely ask you.

Ken.

17

dave19544:
.
Possible solution, give the card to someone else who will be visiting the other site and let them download it for you.

Absolutely not.

The card is your property, and your responsibility, and how would you know if the card wasn’t used while out of your site?

Ken.

18

Under no circumstances give your card to any one else even the TM unless it’s for downloading with you present and it’s given straight back to you .
Leaving or giving card to TM for any other purpose is against the law and could see you either g fined or prosecuted by DSVA for allowing an other user to use your card fraudulently

Sent from my iPad using Tapatalk

19

Of course there is another way to deal with this as a group which gets over the issues surrounding the weekly rest period . All travel together and ring up your transport manager at 10 am on the Monday morning…From the other depot that is a 2hr drive away… to let him know that you’ll all be in at around midday to start the week’s work. :imp:

20

Is there any legal requirement to download a card if it hasn’t been used? I retired nearly a year ago, but my digi card is still valid for another year but obviously hasn’t been downloaded since then. I’m thinking the reason your employer wants you to do it is so they can check if you’ve been driving for anyone else. Making you surrender it would also be a way for them to stop you.