GasGas:
The idea that occupations will dip in and out has always been nonsense. With the example of scaffolder (one of a few official examples) provided scaffolding is their main activity they are exempt.
There is an extremely low probability that a court would rule they would suddenly need to run off and do 35 hours of classroom training just because one day they get stuck in traffic and they end up doing more driving than putting up scaffolding before they can drive home again.
There’s no suggestion that if on one day a scaffolder drove more than he did other work he’d suddenly fall into scope of training.
The question is whether the items he carries are for his own use, or for someone else to use.
DVSA will use their well-published guidelines in deciding who to prosecute…it’s unlikely that a repeated assertion from the defendant that he thinks the guidelines are wrong and he is right is going to get him a not guilty verdict. Can you provide any evidence that the guidelines are clearly wrong?
This is simply not true and you misunderstand how government bodies work they typically use a combination of legal advice on the likely success of a prosecution with a consideration of if it is in the public interest to pursue it.
There is a suggestion, I’m afraid, as guidelines are implying that it’s each journey that needs to be considered. The law only talks about ‘main activity’ it makes no prescription on timeframe.
Lots in the guidelines is legally unrealistic they, like you with own use and other’s use, drag terms into the mix, in their case goods for resale, which again are in no way mention in the actual law.
It may cause problems for the authorities and the training industry but it isn’t going to take the sharpest legal minds in the country to conclude that an EU directive on training that’s title contains the words professional and driver was drawn up with the intention of being aimed at those whose occupation would be considered ‘professional driver’. DVSA can issue all the guidelines they like but legally it will be very difficult to get a court to agree someone whose driving is incidental in the course of their main occupation and is less than 50% of their working time needs to waste their time and money on DCPC.
When you don’t need Driver CPC
You might not need Driver Certificate of Professional Competence (CPC), even if you’re driving a large goods vehicle or passenger-carrying vehicle. It depends on:
the vehicle
what the vehicle is being used for
Vehicles you can drive without Driver CPC
You don’t need Driver CPC if the vehicle you drive is:
being road tested after repair, maintenance or technical development
new or rebuilt and not been put into service yet
limited to a top speed of 28mph
Vehicle uses where you don’t need Driver CPC
You don’t need Driver CPC if the vehicle you drive is:
used for non-commercial carriage of passengers or goods for personal use
used to carry material or equipment you use for your job - but driving the vehicle can’t be the main part of your job
used for driving lessons for anyone who wants to get a driving licence or a Driver CPC
used by, or is under the control of, the armed forces, civil defence, the fire service and forces responsible for maintaining public order
used in states of emergency or for rescue missions
driven to or from pre-booked appointments at official testing centres
driven within 50 km of your base, is not carrying passengers or goods, and driving a lorry, bus or coach is not your main job
Is there an OFFICIAL link to back up the above please, ie. x.gov.uk site? You seem to have copied that from safetrainingservices . co.uk site which is not an official source.
Thanks but I’ve seen that link already. I want hard facts “you can/cannot” law etc, not wishy-washy examples please.
The only way you will get that is in a court or by consulting an expensive barrister
To get what you want from the internet is impossible IMO
Why is it “impossible”? Surely the current legislation should be available online somewhere, specifically stating who it does and does not apply to etc, and under what conditions etc. I find it hard to believe that there is not an official link/page detailing the exemptions.
Thanks but I’ve seen that link already. I want hard facts “you can/cannot” law etc, not wishy-washy examples please.
The only way you will get that is in a court or by consulting an expensive barrister
To get what you want from the internet is impossible IMO
Why is it “impossible”? Surely the current legislation should be available online somewhere, specifically stating who it does and does not apply to etc, and under what conditions etc. I find it hard to believe that there is not an official link/page detailing the exemptions.
If you can find it then you are better than me at searching the internet for laws on the statute
Thanks but I’ve seen that link already. I want hard facts “you can/cannot” law etc, not wishy-washy examples please.
The only way you will get that is in a court or by consulting an expensive barrister
To get what you want from the internet is impossible IMO
Why is it “impossible”? Surely the current legislation should be available online somewhere, specifically stating who it does and does not apply to etc, and under what conditions etc. I find it hard to believe that there is not an official link/page detailing the exemptions.
If you can find it then you are better than me at searching the internet for laws on the statute
You could’ve just said “sorry, haven’t got time to spend looking for it” then rather than basically saying it doesn’t exist and I should consult “an expensive barrister”. It’s got to exist in legislation somewhere otherwise none of us would be bothering to do it.
Note to self: Phone RSPCA and ask if baked beans are still buy one get one free at ASDA
Why Dafuq ask ROSPA about the DCPC?
Ring DVSA if you need more clarification, ask to speak to a Vehicle Examiner as they are the guys that pull you over and will be able to give a definite answer.
So this - legislation.gov.uk/uksi/2013/2667/made (as provided by you) is the legislation that states mechanics don’t need DCPC (generally speaking). This could do with ‘stickying’ in the law forum so it can be referred to should the question come up again.
You already have a thread in that forum where I put the same link so if you edit the title of that thread to something like - driver cpc mechanics exemption - then it can be found easily
I work in the planning office - my job title is traffic planner.
If I need to take a lorry for service to our service centre 8 miles away, I don’t need a driver CPC??
Not an exemption :
“(c)
which–
(i)
is undergoing road tests for technical development, repair or maintenance purposes;
(ii) is being used for the purpose of submitting it (by previous arrangement for a specified time on a specified date) for a relevant test, or of bringing it away from such a test; or
(iii)
is a new or rebuilt vehicle which has not yet been put into service;”.
Your service centre is not a “relevant test”, presumably referring to MOT tests.
I work in the planning office - my job title is traffic planner.
If I need to take a lorry for service to our service centre 8 miles away, I don’t need a driver CPC??
Not an exemption :
“(c)
which–
(i)
is undergoing road tests for technical development, repair or maintenance purposes;
(ii) is being used for the purpose of submitting it (by previous arrangement for a specified time on a specified date) for a relevant test, or of bringing it away from such a test; or
(iii)
is a new or rebuilt vehicle which has not yet been put into service;”.
Your service centre is not a “relevant test”, presumably referring to MOT tests.
I was going on the fact it’s not my main occupation and i’m not carrying goods nor travelling beyond 50km of my base??
On the basis of sloppy legal wording there is a fairly strong legal argument he would be exempt provided he took his laptop with him to the service centre.
You could’ve just said “sorry, haven’t got time to spend looking for it” then rather than basically saying it doesn’t exist and I should consult “an expensive barrister”. It’s got to exist in legislation somewhere otherwise none of us would be bothering to do it. 