trouble is that loads will break free under extreme circumstances, no matter how secured they are. and normally if a load moves or is spilled its due to an extreme event (accident etc.).
I do admit that nowadays when knowledge is shared less and less yes a certain amount of ‘education’ is required, however I still think we go way ott with how many rules and regs we now have (unless and I am sure your more likely to know this than me) it has been proven to be rising considerably and the main cause is lack of security. I did advise the chap to secure until either confident or certain the load wont move etc. by the way.
The European best practice guidelines and BSEN 12195 standard works on the principal that loads are restrained to 0.8 of the load weight forward, 0.5 sideways and rearward because tests and trials have shown that in expected driving conditions a truck cannot and will not generate that much force.
Expected driving conditions allow for emergency stops, emergency swerves or a combination of both. Unfortunately this means a collision as you say may create greater forces than even the recognised standards allow for.
I used to be of the same frame of mind as most. I thought I knew what I was doing and often wondered how come some items still shifted. I’ll say I was ignorant. Then I came across certain publications, this prompted me to attend a course held by the HSL in Buxton, that course pointed me towards further research and publications and I now believe I actually understand the issue meaning when securing a load I can make an informed decision instead of guessing and hoping I was right.
I doubt the number of lost load issues are rising, but as we gain better knowledge of the whys and how’s then each death or serious injury seems even more of a waste. In the days of roping and sheeting we didn’t have the knowledge or equipment we have now - we didn’t know any better and couldn’t do any better.
However - I think standards have dropped since the rope and sheet days because drivers believe curtains and internal straps do the job. Most weeks we hear ‘a lorry has lost its load’ or ‘a lorry has overturned’ on the traffic news - a shifting load will be a common cause.
Even if we ignore lost loads - how many on here have had hassle over damaged loads or vehicles, a close call with something falling during unloading or even had to stop at the side of the road to re-secure a load or tighten straps putting ourselves in danger. These are all consequences of load shift - which can be avoided.
I’ve been busy and doing a lot of travelling this week - what I see on the motorways worries me at times, and that’s just the ones I can see. The ones with closed curtains are the biggest worry.
You are right that you advised to make sure he was certain the load wouldn’t move. The problem is what does he base his decision on? In most cases a guess.
war1974:
its all ifs buts and maybes has anyone challenged these plebs who decide this? so despite having had no issues with paper because someone you know had 2 accident its automatically unsafe, most rollovers or loads shifting is driver error be it speed clipping a kerb loading wrong etc. we ran pallets for years in curtainsiders with no issues. people roped and sheeted loads for years with no issues, but we cant have accidents anymore, someone needs to be blamed and we wont stop with pathetic courses, rules, regulations until every driver is doing 20mph with 100 straps on his trailer and every accident is erased.
I have run with steel strapped way beyond what would be classed as ‘safe’ and trust me when I had to hammer the breaks on the A1 because some ■■■■ thought the gap was big enough for his landrover to pull out slower than a tractor it moved and moved a lot.
As you said yourself we had ‘roped’ and sheeted loads.IE the sheet wouldn’t hold it just like we had just ‘roped’/chained/strapped loads on tilts and curtainsiders and even flats where weather protection wasn’t an issue.
As for longitudinal load security that,like box bodies,is a grey area as it stands.Arguably both being over reliant on improvisation regards head boards and body sides in terms of securing provision.
Carryfast:
war1974:
As you said yourself we had ‘roped’ and sheeted loads.IE the sheet wouldn’t hold it just like we had just ‘roped’/chained/strapped loads on tilts and curtainsiders and even flats where weather protection wasn’t an issue.
As for longitudinal load security that,like box bodies,is a grey area as it stands.Arguably both being over reliant on improvisation regards head boards and body sides in terms of securing provision.
I don’t think it helps that in the UK we don’t officially use the EN 12642 standard for body construction and although most trailer manufacturers will build to the EN 12642 L standard how many drivers or operators know what that minimum standard is?
I.e a headboard to EN 12642 L will only need to withstand a maximum of 5t. Therefore with a coefficient of friction of 0.3 (average damp pallet and unswept floor) the headboard should withstand a total of 10.1t. So most 17/18 tonners the headboard should take the full load as long as there are no gaps. But as the vehicle gets bigger the headboard doesn’t get beefed up (usually) so by the time we have a full size trailer with a 28t payload the headboard is soon gonna give way unless restraints/blocks are used.
shep532:
Carryfast:
war1974:
As you said yourself we had ‘roped’ and sheeted loads.IE the sheet wouldn’t hold it just like we had just ‘roped’/chained/strapped loads on tilts and curtainsiders and even flats where weather protection wasn’t an issue.
As for longitudinal load security that,like box bodies,is a grey area as it stands.Arguably both being over reliant on improvisation regards head boards and body sides in terms of securing provision.
I don’t think it helps that in the UK we don’t officially use the EN 12642 standard for body construction and although most trailer manufacturers will build to the EN 12642 L standard how many drivers or operators know what that minimum standard is?
I.e a headboard to EN 12642 L will only need to withstand a maximum of 5t. Therefore with a coefficient of friction of 0.3 (average damp pallet and unswept floor) the headboard should withstand a total of 10.1t. So most 17/18 tonners the headboard should take the full load as long as there are no gaps. But as the vehicle gets bigger the headboard doesn’t get beefed up (usually) so by the time we have a full size trailer with a 28t payload the headboard is soon gonna give way unless restraints/blocks are used.
A lot of the problem with longitudinal securing is the lack of longitudinal anchorage points.IE ideally we should be looking to secure a load in the longitudinal plane just as in the sideways one.It’s only mostly an anchorage point issue that stops that. 
Shep252 you write interesting and sensible advice/info on here.
I was recently expected to take a load on a curtainsider that was not properly secured imo. Only internal straps were being employed but I realised that due to the weight and type of load that ratchet straps were necessary and I refused to take it. Much debate and criticism ensued with fork lift, transport and some managerial staff and I was told that so and so takes loads like that all the time with no strapping at all. Then their best fork lift driver said “remember Dave a few months ago, he did the same as so and so and deposited the load into a farmers field and you sacked him”.
Anyhow I ended up with the trailer being reloaded with less so I could ratchet strap it as I saw fit to my satisfaction after stating that it’s me that’s responsible for lorry load et al and it’s my licence.
I worked for them for one week and despite them asking for me to go back there I’ve refused; yes I am one of those bloody awful crap agency drivers that everyone seems to hate on here.
BTW that’s not the only load I’ve refused to take due to non-compliance with regulations and that I’ve deemed to be unsafe and I must add with third party confirmation and support that my judgement and actions were correct. It’s quite strange though that in all cases I always get asked back to drive for them again!
My experience is that when a driver won’t take a load they always say that so and so does and he’s never lost a load YET. You did right to stick to your own standards.
Most of the time the manager/planner/warehouse bod has absolutely no idea so how can then query your decision?
It is each individual drivers choice. If they take the load they must be happy with it. Nobody can be made to take a load. If they have secured it themselves and think it is ok then that is their choice. I believe a vast majority of drivers are unfortunately lacking in the required technical knowledge to actually make an informed decision.
During DCPC courses I try to give them enough information to be better informed and be able to make a calculated decision/assessment, but of course I meet a good few who clearly know better - most however have a story or two to tell about shifted loads. 
shep532:
Own Account Driver:
Or just put one strap in an enormous loop round the lot to the headboard to save time. If you’re pulled they’d struggle to get anywhere if the load hasn’t shifted and you’ve made an effort.
If only that was correct. Whether the load has shifted or not - if it is clear the restraints are insufficient they can issue a £100 fixed penalty. A simple calculation confirms insufficient or not - there are at least 3 commercially available Apps to do the calculation for them. Of course you could contest it and have your case heard in court.
They aren’t doing any calculations at roadside pulls, trust me.
Own Account Driver:
They aren’t doing any calculations at roadside pulls, trust me.
I’ll agree with you but I know what training some of them have had and they know full well that ‘x’ ratchet straps doesn’t secure ‘x’ weight.
But - as far as I can fathom they are really only after those loads with no restraint, those loads that have shifted. If the driver has tried there normally isn’t an issue.