When driving an Actros, you get this E “Eco drive” thing when going along that basically feels like you’ve pulled the thing out of gear, and you’re rolling along the flat/downhill with the exhaust brake cutting in automatically when the time comes. Uphill will have it pulling as normal of course.
My argument is this:
I was always told on my driving lessions that “if you trundle along out of gear, then it’s instant test fail, because you’re not in control of the vehicle. Imagine if you had to do an emergency stop?”
Just how likely is “running yourself over with a heavy loaded trailer” or “jackknifing” or “taking a longer stopping distance” because of the mechanics of an auto-gearbox…?
Then there’s trying to pull onto an uphill slope onto a roundabout sporting an adverse camber, carrying a load that’s a bit weighty/toppy…
I dunno about you folks out there, but I prefer a geared vehicle if I know I’ve got a lot of the more dodgy kind of roundabout to negotiate on my run…
TerryT not the clearest of figures although it claims 2000 to 2010 reported accidents have gone down.The chap who services my vehicle also has an extremely busy recovery business,he tells me unless
someone is injured or the Police are called no further interest is shown.
Winseer:
When driving an Actros, you get this E “Eco drive” thing when going along that basically feels like you’ve pulled the thing out of gear, and you’re rolling along the flat/downhill with the exhaust brake cutting in automatically when the time comes. Uphill will have it pulling as normal of course.
My argument is this:
I was always told on my driving lessions that “if you trundle along out of gear, then it’s instant test fail, because you’re not in control of the vehicle. Imagine if you had to do an emergency stop?”
Just how likely is “running yourself over with a heavy loaded trailer” or “jackknifing” or “taking a longer stopping distance” because of the mechanics of an auto-gearbox…?
Then there’s trying to pull onto an uphill slope onto a roundabout sporting an adverse
camber, carrying a load that’s a bit weighty/toppy…
I dunno about you folks out there, but I prefer a geared vehicle if I know I’ve got a lot of the more dodgy kind of roundabout to negotiate on my run…
Its an automated gearbox thats where you use the manual as you can see the situation that the electronics cant.
Although some firms disable this ad they dont trust the drivers.
We have Actros autos. As soon as you touch the accelerator or brake it jumps back into gear.
I’m on my phone so those figures were all I could be bothered to find. Still, interesting that accidents have come down quite a lot in the last decade. Ill look into it further when on my computer as I’d like to know too.
Terry T:
We have Actros autos. As soon as you touch the accelerator or brake it jumps back into gear.
I’m on my phone so those figures were all I could be bothered to find. Still, interesting that accidents have come down quite a lot in the last decade. Ill look into it further when on my computer as I’d like to know too.
DO you normally hit the accelerator when doing an emergency stop then?
midlifetrucker:
With an auto you cruise up to any junction purely looking if it is clear and you dont clout the kerbs or mr cyclist on your inside.
Surely you’ve answered your own question there? If you’re simply looking to see what’s coming and what’s around you, you’re more alert and switched on to what’s happening with an auto?
For the record, I don’t mind either. Each has their benefits and drawbacks.
I personally hate most of the high tech in modern trucks, especially auto boxes I would swap my 60 plate tgx man for a 10 year old scania gladly. I don’t feel in control and resent not being trusted to change gears myself.
Terry T:
We have Actros autos. As soon as you touch the accelerator or brake it jumps back into gear.
I’m on my phone so those figures were all I could be bothered to find. Still, interesting that accidents have come down quite a lot in the last decade. Ill look into it further when on my computer as I’d like to know too.
DO you normally hit the accelerator when doing an emergency stop then?
Winseer:
When driving an Actros, you get this E “Eco drive” thing when going along that basically feels like you’ve pulled the thing out of gear, and you’re rolling along the flat/downhill with the exhaust brake cutting in automatically when the time comes. Uphill will have it pulling as normal of course.
My argument is this:
I was always told on my driving lessions that “if you trundle along out of gear, then it’s instant test fail, because you’re not in control of the vehicle. Imagine if you had to do an emergency stop?”
Just how likely is “running yourself over with a heavy loaded trailer” or “jackknifing” or “taking a longer stopping distance” because of the mechanics of an auto-gearbox…?
Then there’s trying to pull onto an uphill slope onto a roundabout sporting an adverse camber, carrying a load that’s a bit weighty/toppy…
I dunno about you folks out there, but I prefer a geared vehicle if I know I’ve got a lot of the more dodgy kind of roundabout to negotiate on my run…
I queried this when I first got my Actros. It was explained to me that because it put itself back into gear as soon as I touched the throttle, brake or exhaust brake without me having to do it manually, it didn’t fall foul of that bit of legislation/rule.
We have a number of MANs on the fleet, with their autobox, one with a Comfort Shift, and my Actros. Maybe because I’m so used to it now, but I have very little argument with the Merc box - the only time it’s caught me out is when I’m hillstarting and heavy, and it decides to drop the clutch and change down just as I’m starting to move on the hill, so we get a rollback unless I hit the brake quickly. Loathe the MAN autos, but love the 10 year old Comfort Shift unit if mine is ever in for a service.
Good subject choice and some good considered responses.
I think lorries have become too easy to drive, period.
A chimp could jump into one of our auto lorries and drive it up the motorway, and they do in some cases… but seriously if lorries required some work and co-ordination and a bit of hardish work to drive then a good portion of the steering wheel attendants would hopefully bugger off or get the push when they’ve wrecked a couple of gearboxes and burnt the clutches out.
The trouble with auto boxes is that the driver isn’t aware of closing speeds or speeds they are taking corners at.
With a manual (or if they drive the auto in manual) the driver is pre planning and matching gears to revs and road speed, pre planning for roundabouts etc leads to more stable sensible cornering then just driving up to it stomping on the brakes and sticking the foot down which invariably means the lorry is entering the roundabout on a trailing throttle whilst the bloody useless box has a meeting and a short nap before selecting a gear and resuming power far too late.
Most of these boxes will also change gear without fail on every single roundabout in mid bend, again not ideal for stability.
A vehicle needs to be driven for maximum control and stability.
The more driving aids they fit to these modern things the more accidents will occur.
Winseer:
When driving an Actros, you get this E “Eco drive” thing when going along that basically feels like you’ve pulled the thing out of gear, and you’re rolling along the flat/downhill with the exhaust brake cutting in automatically when the time comes. Uphill will have it pulling as normal of course.
My argument is this:
I was always told on my driving lessions that “if you trundle along out of gear, then it’s instant test fail, because you’re not in control of the vehicle. Imagine if you had to do an emergency stop?”
Just how likely is “running yourself over with a heavy loaded trailer” or “jackknifing” or “taking a longer stopping distance” because of the mechanics of an auto-gearbox…?
Then there’s trying to pull onto an uphill slope onto a roundabout sporting an adverse camber, carrying a load that’s a bit weighty/toppy…
I dunno about you folks out there, but I prefer a geared vehicle if I know I’ve got a lot of the more dodgy kind of roundabout to negotiate on my run…
You need to learn how to drive an AMT properly and then you wouldn’t have any problems.
The clue is in the name. Automated Manual Transmission. Not Automatic, so you should still be using the manual part, the automated part just makes that easier…
When coming to a downhill slope (Actros), the damned thing drops two gears, and the rev counter goes way into the red. So I end up having to normally brake down to a speed that at least allows me to go downhill in 11th (yellow zone) with the exhaust brake chugging away.
I really don’t like the “lack of control” feel to all this eco drive rubbish.
As for the exhaust brake, my instructor told me to brake rather than use it, because a new set of brake pads is peanuts but a new gearbox is £15k.
I passed in 1991 when fuel was as cheap as ■■■■ don’t forget…
Now the MAN exhaust brake actually seems to work properly on the other hand… When you take your foot off the accelerator pedal, it’s like you’ve got inertial dampers to gently slow you down, even if you’ve got a whole wardrobe of dangling meat in the back. MUCH better feeling of control there.
…Then there’s Scania. Use one of these, and as soon as you put your foot “wrong”, you’ve blown your fuel bonus.
If you don’t want it to change down two gears then stick it in manual before the descent to prevent it.
It’s not rocket science!
You can control every shift if it’s in manual mode (unless that is disabled) if it is, let the ■■■■■■■ do what the owner of the vehicle wants it to do, if you can’t intervene, can’t be your fault if it goes wrong because some ■■■■■■ thinks they know better than you.
Winseer:
When driving an Actros, you get this E “Eco drive” thing when going along that basically feels like you’ve pulled the thing out of gear, and you’re rolling along the flat/downhill with the exhaust brake cutting in automatically when the time comes. Uphill will have it pulling as normal of course.
My argument is this:
I was always told on my driving lessions that “if you trundle along out of gear, then it’s instant test fail, because you’re not in control of the vehicle. Imagine if you had to do an emergency stop?”
Just how likely is “running yourself over with a heavy loaded trailer” or “jackknifing” or “taking a longer stopping distance” because of the mechanics of an auto-gearbox…?
Then there’s trying to pull onto an uphill slope onto a roundabout sporting an adverse camber, carrying a load that’s a bit weighty/toppy…
I dunno about you folks out there, but I prefer a geared vehicle if I know I’ve got a lot of the more dodgy kind of roundabout to negotiate on my run…
You need to learn how to drive an AMT properly and then you wouldn’t have any problems.
The clue is in the name. Automated Manual Transmission. Not Automatic, so you should still be using the manual part, the automated part just makes that easier…
If the suggestion is you can drive an AMT better than I can boot around a manual as a control freak, then more power to you.
I’ll give you “My AMT’s better than your AMT”, but that’s it.
I have already said I don’t like the feeling of “no control” when using the actros fancies. I don’t know if Fleetboard will also mark you down for doing things like touching the brakes in the roadworks because you’re drifting up someone’s arse, etc etc. I like to be safe first, worry about saving fuel later if it comes down to that. I guess most of my “waste” is tapping the brakes to put a decent distance between myself and the vehicle in front, especially when someone invariably enters the “idiot space”. AMTs are easy to handle on a deserted motorway in the middle of the night. Not so easy in London or through heavy traffic though.
Winseer:
As for the exhaust brake, my instructor told me to brake rather than use it, because a new set of brake pads is peanuts but a new gearbox is £15k.
Is this instructor now teaching DCPC then Winseer? I only ask because an exhaust brake has no direct influence on a gearbox.
Maybe you are getting mixed up with the old method of teaching students to slow down using the gears, whereas the accepted wisdom nowadays is to use the brakes for slowing.
Of course that is for car drivers, so a different set of rules apply to HGV’s. i use my exhaust brake whenever (safely) practicable and thus I’m sure that my brake pads will die of old age before wearing out.
nomiS36:
‘…resent not being trusted to change gears …’
Maybe get-over resentment and accept the egg-sucking, but it remains fair to remind ourselves that too many paid drivers (as distinct from professional drivers) rag motors on the understanding that the green bit is advisory and that a ‘good’ driver can always cane a valuable bit extra
It isn’t hard to listen out at today’s white van men (tomorrow’s LGV elders?) whilst appreciating the industry desire to cut running costs, repairs & early replacement of whacked-out motors by giving us idiot*-proof kit with Big Brother tell-tale-■■■ Telematics, etc
*Or ‘diversity’-proof, since it’s fair to be politically reminded of how weird we in the UK are (I’m told) proud to be
but seriously if lorries required some work and co-ordination and a bit of hardish work to drive then a good portion of the steering wheel attendants would hopefully bugger off or get the push when they’ve wrecked a couple of gearboxes and burnt the clutches out.
MUCH better feeling of control there. 
