This came up in another thread so I thought it worth a separate mention…
ckm1981:
I didn’t think you could drive an HGV for hire or reward whilst learning?!
You might have a good point nowadays
Before the driver cpc came in many did this quite legally
Now that commercial LGV driving requires the driver to have a current valid DQC I cannot see how a newbie can do it legally
Mods 2 and 4 can be passed before mods 1 and 3 but the DQC would not be activated and sent until all 4 mods are passed
I have called Kath at DVSA legal standards dept at Nottingham and she is going to Email me with a copy of the reply she send to another who had the very same query
When I receive that email either later today or tomorrow morning I will C&P it on here - I have her permission to do so
There would not be a problem with a pre 1997 LGV C1 doing C or a C doing C+E where they were commercially driving under L plates for a company with a LGV driver next to them as supervisor (subject to the usual supervisor rules) because they can get a DQC before doing so
Got the Email …
Pearson, Kathleen Kathleen.Pearson@dsa.gsi.gov.uk Dear Roger, Thanks for your call. The Driver CPC rules are intended to apply to drivers engaged in road transport on roads open to the public. Regulations do not prevent learner lorry drivers driving a laden vehicle, providing they are supervised by a qualified driver. Similarly, there is an exemption in the driver CPC regulations for drivers preparing for a driving licence acquisition test or Driver CPC test. But, I don’t think it was envisaged that learner drivers would be engaged in the commercial delivery of goods — something that is clearly intended to be covered by DCPC - during their initial licence acquisition training. It is therefore questionable as to whether the exemption for the learner driver should apply. It is possible for trainee drivers to take modules 2 and 4 (the DCPC Initial Qualification modules of the overall test) before they take modules 1 and 3 (the licence acquisition modules). They will, of course, need to complete all four modules if they are to be employed with a company. Ultimately, it is down to a court to make a decision on how the rules about Driver CPC are interpreted. Companies may wish to take a view in terms of their corporate responsibility and insurance liability in how much is required of unqualified drivers. Regards Kath Pearson | Policy Advisor Driver and Vehicle Standards Agency | the Axis Building, 112 Upper Parliament Street, Nottingham, NG1 6LP Phone: 0115 936 6094
This reinforces my interpretation of the rules as well.
How much they would actually be enforced is another issue; as a general rule, trucks with L plates on are left alone. But that isn’t an excuse for deliberately breaking the rules.
So even if you have mod 1,2 and 4 which covers your cpc you still unable to drive as previously discussed
Mod 1 is the theory test, Mod 2 is the case studies and Mod 4 is the practical driver cpc. So, provided the driving test has been passed (Mod 3) you’re good to go.
Sometimes folk get confused between the initial cpc (described above) and the 5 modules of periodic training that is required to keep the initial cpc in place. Those 5 modules do not have official numbers. Some trainers adopt numbers for them for their own convenience.
It can all be a bit confusing; hope I haven’t made it worse!
noney82:
So even if you have mod 1,2 and 4 which covers your cpc you still unable to drive as previously discussed
There is an exemption for vehicles being used for the acquisition of a licence but also the rules say that drivers carrying out commercial driving must have a current DQC so which trumps which? - needs a very expensive EU court case to sort that !
How about a c+e on l plates delivering commercially where the learning driver has been driving cat c for 12 months and has a valid Dqc? And would the supervising driver also require a valid dqc?
vxpenfold:
How about a c+e on l plates delivering commercially where the learning driver has been driving cat c for 12 months and has a valid Dqc? And would the supervising driver also require a valid dqc?
Most would have one in that situation as its usually a long term company LGV driver who takes the learner out
I cannot see a situation where the supervising driver would not be a regular driver with all the relevant quals
I’m wondering if I can drive on just my provisional license, I haven’t started the new diver cpc and I would be delivering furniture in an 18 tonner. My driver has been passed 8 years and I’m pretty sure my company has insurance, can anyone help?
ablake90:
I’m wondering if I can drive on just my provisional license, I haven’t started the new diver cpc and I would be delivering furniture in an 18 tonner. My driver has been passed 8 years and I’m pretty sure my company has insurance, can anyone help?
It is the driver cpc which is your only issue
Any commercial driving needs the driver to have a current valid driver cpc card (DQC)
There is an exemption for licence acquisition training
Which one trumps the other?
I have no form of cpc but my driver who would be supervising me has just fulfilled his 35 hours cpc and has his DQC, however he is not a driver trainer, would this be a problem and would I need my own taco card?
ablake90:
I have no form of cpc but my driver who would be supervising me has just fulfilled his 35 hours cpc and has his DQC, however he is not a driver trainer, would this be a problem and would I need my own taco card?
ANY LGV driver who has had the licence to drive that vehicle for over 3 years can supervise - there is no legal requirement to be a trained supervisor
(1) If you are driving on a commercial run then YOU need a DQC
BUT
(2) Then there is the exemption for gaining the licence
I suggest you get the company lawyers to find out which law trumps the other (1) or (2)
