When I was in an hourly paid retail job I got a 30 min break which had to be taken on the premises and was paid for and a 1 hour lunch which we were free to go where we liked but was unpaid.
In a salaried warehouse job our 20 min break counted as part of our contracted hours but 1 hour lunch didn’t, although we could choose not to have a lunch break and finish 1 hour earlier.
waynedl:
hedg70:
The company I work for deduct 1hr if I take it or not, so I simply aim to get the truck back in the yard between 12-13:30 then walk home and take a full hour, Every day!(I realise you don’t all have this opportunity)
Would you rather get paid through and finish 1 hr earlier though? I bloody would.
The only problem with that is record keeping, manual entries on tachos etc. Your break has to be within your shift, not at the end of it, so when you fill in your manuals the next day (if on digi) you need to put an hours break then I usually just put 5mins other work after it to comply, I assume this complies anyway, only do it on a shift short enough to have not needed a 15min WTD break (under 6hrs) or one that only needed a WTD break and not a driving reset.
Darb:
I was informed by one of our day drivers yesterday that the new union man has said that it’s illegal for us to be stopped 30mins per shift for a break and also can get it back dated for two years… Where do I sign? Take my money please !!
Well if it’ illegal, your new union man needs to stop telling people its illegal and work on getting the money you owed. 
shep532:
raymundo:
So you are saying Conor that it’s OK to start unloading a tank by putting the pump on then commence a 45 break ■■ Would have thought that being ‘other work’. legally though, just askin.If you could safely leave the pump discharging without having to monitor it once you had engaged it then yes you could go get a break. The fact the pump is working makes no odds - it is whether or not the driver is working.
Disagree. Driver may well be sitting in his cab reading the paper whilst the pump is running, but the indisputable fact is that he, and he alone, is responsible for that pump running and the load discharging, and he is the one who will be jumping out of his cab to switch it off if necessary. He is therefore not “free to dispose of his time as he so wishes” as the jargon has it and is therefore classed as working.
We had this issue come up with our bulk blowers which require the PTO to be running in order to blow the feed in. Tacho examiner pulled us up for it as it shows on the digi-card trace.
That’s not quire right though Sidevalve.
Let’s just say you park up in a services and stick it on break, and get out and go and grab a cup coffee and have a crap, maybe you even go have some special cuddles with yourself too. Now in this time you have left the handbrake on the unit and the whole combination has rolled into one of steady Eddie’s finest in the car park.
You are still 100% at fault for the accident, and you were 100% responsible for the vehicle too. But you were on a break.
The simple fact of the matter is, if you can safely set the truck to do some work, and you know that said work would take at least the time of your break and would in no way require any interaction from you, then yes you can be on break.
The fact that in this case you are talking about tanks and blowing, something I have no working knowledge of, makes no difference.
Nor does the fact that the PTO is working (tacho will just show engine on, on the trace) make any difference either, otherwise you couldn’t sit there and run your air con and be on break at the same time either.
Tacho examiner that you used in your example Sidevalve pulled up on it because he suspected whoever was working while on a break. All you as a driver needs to do is be able to give some sort of credible explanation of how your break was taken, and all will be well.
Back to the op and we have another Union tool spouting total rubbish, and they wonder why people don’t bother with them.
BillyHunt:
Back to the op and we have another Union tool spouting total rubbish, and they wonder why people don’t bother with them.
Like 99% of the CPC trainers…yes i went there and started a CPC discussion. 
F-reds:
Tacho examiner that you used in your example Sidevalve pulled up on it because he suspected whoever was working while on a break. All you as a driver needs to do is be able to give some sort of credible explanation of how your break was taken, and all will be well.
I daresay. I wouldn’t like to be explaining it to a VOSA inspector if he happened to drop onto me whilst I was unloading though. One of those grey areas where nobody can offer a definitive ruling and much would depend on the attitude of the official.
mrginge:
BillyHunt:
Back to the op and we have another Union tool spouting total rubbish, and they wonder why people don’t bother with them.Like 99% of the CPC trainers…yes i went there and started a CPC discussion.
I would tend to agree but then again, you have to do the dcpc, you aren’t forced to join a union.
Sidevalve:
shep532:
raymundo:
So you are saying Conor that it’s OK to start unloading a tank by putting the pump on then commence a 45 break ■■ Would have thought that being ‘other work’. legally though, just askin.If you could safely leave the pump discharging without having to monitor it once you had engaged it then yes you could go get a break. The fact the pump is working makes no odds - it is whether or not the driver is working.
Disagree. Driver may well be sitting in his cab reading the paper whilst the pump is running, but the indisputable fact is that he, and he alone, is responsible for that pump running and the load discharging, and he is the one who will be jumping out of his cab to switch it off if necessary. He is therefore not “free to dispose of his time as he so wishes” as the jargon has it and is therefore classed as working.
We had this issue come up with our bulk blowers which require the PTO to be running in order to blow the feed in. Tacho examiner pulled us up for it as it shows on the digi-card trace.
Rest not break 
If you’re not driving, not working, then you can be on break, whether on a bay, whether a pump is putting the crap into a tank or whatever. If however, you have to monitor gauges, pressure, pipes for leaks etc, that’s work.
Engine running showing on tacho, how’s that different from running the aircon whilst on a break in a services?
I don’t know whether a PTO shows on the tacho seperate, can’t see how it can, but any work I’ve done using a PTO has required either monitoring or moving forwards, so has been other work.
waynedl:
Rest not breakIf you’re not driving, not working, then you can be on break, whether on a bay, whether a pump is putting the crap into a tank or whatever. If however, you have to monitor gauges, pressure, pipes for leaks etc, that’s work.
Engine running showing on tacho, how’s that different from running the aircon whilst on a break in a services?
I don’t know whether a PTO shows on the tacho seperate, can’t see how it can, but any work I’ve done using a PTO has required either monitoring or moving forwards, so has been other work.
That’s the point I’m making. You, the driver, are operating that machinery and even if you’re sitting in the cab reading the paper you’re still monitoring it. Our rules now state that the driver has to be at the controls all the time he’s blowing; sensible really because the pipes can block and/or detach from the inlet pipe with very messy results, and it has the added benefit that we no longer have to go up into lofts to hold the pipe because the farmer can’t be arsed to.
As for the PTO; my guess is that it shows up on the rev-counter trace as you’re running the engine under load at a constant fast idle, similar to if you’re working a HIAB. No doubt someone more tech-savvy than I could clarify this.
I’m pretty sure when the PTO is engaged on my truck, it will stay on break, its as soon as you move it will revert to other modes. (only done it once, returned from lunch and forgot to move it from break to work, and used the crane for about 10 mins)
Also the comment where you said I would be better off going home 1hr early, Not a chance my company kick up a fuss if you try to leave 2 mins to five 
Also its only 07:30 - 17:00 not that hard…
Sidevalve:
it shows up on the rev-counter trace
Rev counter trace? On a tacho?
isaac hunt:
Sidevalve:
it shows up on the rev-counter traceRev counter trace? On a tacho?
As I pointed out earlier, it was picked up by the people who do the tacho analysis; it wouldn’t show on an analogue but perhaps it does on a digital? I don’t know, I only drive the lorry; can someone better informed confirm?
Edit; it occurs to me that the PTO runs off the gearbox. Maybe that’s how it flags up?
Maybe isotrak or some similar system can tell if the engine is running and pto is in,
don’t think digi tacho can. In any case there is nowt to stop you having the pto
in while on break.
Would the driver of a loaded mixer turn off the drum if he needed to stop.
Erm, chaps, an analogue tachograph shows whether engine is on or not, so I’m sure a digital one will. (Although I have never bothered to check.)
As for can it tell the difference between PTO or not, I’m not sure, nor do I really care.
So in your case Sidevalve, company policy wouldn’t allow you to be on break while you’re “blowing your load” (is that a euphemism for some special time??) Because by monitoring you are in fact working, so you can’t be on a break, as you are not exclusively recuperating.
But the tachograph rules don’t.
I would have thought that ’ rest ',by its very definition, is indeed that.
ie; Not involved in working, or working related actions. (even ’ visually monitoring ').
eagerbeaver:
I would have thought that ’ rest ',by its very definition, is indeed that.ie; Not involved in working, or working related actions. (even ’ visually monitoring ').
What has this got to do with a break?
I was just making the point Wayne, that a break MUST be used exclusively for recuperation.
I thought one of the post’s suggested watching dials, or something like, whilst on a break. Might have got it wrong though.