You go in to work and there is a bulge that bad in the o/s curtain that you cant see the back of the trailer in fact all you can see is the pallet thats hanging 6 inches over the edge of the trailer.
What do you do refuse to take the load as you cant see behind you in your mirrors?.
Or when the tm has a look at the aspparent legal side of things and tells you that its an abnormal load and you are alowed 12" overhang each side before it becomes illegal and you have to take it.
I didnt take the load i refused on H+S grounds stating it was dangerous to take it on the road was i right or was he?.
The load could have been restacked it was ionly something too big for a pallet and could easily have been moved around to enable full vision.
An Abnormal Load has to be “indivisable” (ie. incapable of being split down smaller) in order to be legal, and there has to be no way of carrying it within standard Construction and Use Regulations.
Right or wrong aside, i’d have taken it. it’s no different to having a pallet move/lean during the journey. you wouldn’t park up and demand a forktruck be brought out to sort out the load. you would carry on with extra care, secure it further if you can and spout some crap at the delivery point to explain it.
For every load a british driver refuses, there will be an eastern european driver willing to do, and for less.
Roadhog:
Right or wrong aside, i’d have taken it. it’s no different to having a pallet move/lean during the journey. you wouldn’t park up and demand a forktruck be brought out to sort out the load. you would carry on with extra care, secure it further if you can and spout some crap at the delivery point to explain it.
For every load a british driver refuses, there will be an eastern european driver willing to do, and for less.
So in other words its DO IT safely or not, legally or not just to protect your job?.
The jobs not worth that much to me if i cant do it safely and legally i dont do it at all dead simple really.
I dont want to start arguing and ■■■■■■■■ like things usually do on here i was looking for some advice on doing my job safely and legally, i DO NOT take risks just to keep my job .
Are you suggesting that EE drivers will run with an unsafe or illegal load?.
The problem was NOT load security it was strapped and i was happy it would not move the problem was it was sticking out the side of the curtain so far that i couldnt see a thing behind me in my mirrors, which i personally think would be a hazard when trying to overtake.
I used to load 12 pallets of coffee beans with a curtainsider. These large pallets weighed in at 1.5 tonnes each and when the curtains were fastened I couldn’t see out of either mirror unless I moved the cab slightly from side to side as I drove along. You just had to take it that bit steadier that’s all. The load was completely safe in that it wouldn’t move and I had checked the legality of it (so had the TM) and everything was above board. The case is the same with the trailers that carry blown sawdust, you must have all seen them on the road at some time with their curtains bulging out.
I see exactly what you are saying Penfold and i understand totally but when the load can be rearranged so it doesnt cause a problem then surely an employer MUST move it to make it safer?..
jammymutt:
So in other words its DO IT safely or not, legally or not just to protect your job?.
The jobs not worth that much to me if i cant do it safely and legally i dont do it at all dead simple really.
I dont want to start arguing and ■■■■■■■■ like things usually do on here i was looking for some advice on doing my job safely and legally, i DO NOT take risks just to keep my job .
Are you suggesting that EE drivers will run with an unsafe or illegal load?.
no, and i’m sorry if my message came across a bit arsey.
as it happenes, I took 10plts to manchester today, and the curtains were bulging 3-4" each side. these had to be delivered to a unit, at the end of a track behind a school on a housing estate. narrow roads, cars parked both sides, on junctions etc. did it without a scrape. Now i’m not saying i’m better than you, but loads like that can be moved safely, but you can’t treat them like any other load.
i’ve worked on flats for a while before this job, and the number of agency drivers who came in, saw the load and walked off site. most loads were wider than the body by no more than 6", but on top of that we usually had joists overhanging by 2m at the rear and also sticking out forward by a couple of feet. some of the load had to kept dry, so needed sheeting, and these were multidrop loads to bu lding sites in and around london. it was a great job. But not everyone could do it because they hadn’t been shown how.
if you want to see behind, just ‘snake’ it a bit. it’s not risky, just watch anyone who moves portacabins. it’s just down to gaining the experience and advice.
EE drivers will move anything to earn money. I’ve seen them tripple stack pallets and not use a single strap. we won’t even double stack these particular pallets.
Right or wrong aside, i’d have taken it. it’s no different to having a pallet move/lean during the journey.
Surely if it’s secured properly to begin with it wouldnt move would it?
but what is properly secured? it all depends on the load. if you haven’t moved it before, how do you know the best way to secure it?
we had a driver who picked up 28t of paper reels. they were around 3.5t per reel and had to be loaded on their end. how do you secure them? he was going to put ratchet straps over the top of each reel. you can’t use straps, the best way of moving them is to pack them together. if you’re going to drive in a way that will cause a 3.5t reel to topple over, you shouldn’t be on the road. that’s not directed at any one person.
jammymutt:
I see exactly what you are saying Penfold and i understand totally but when the load can be rearranged so it doesnt cause a problem then surely an employer MUST move it to make it safer?..
I don’t know whether he MUST, but he certainly could. But if the load couldn’t be rearranged, would you then take it? if you would, then theres no reason why you couldn’t take it either way.
Jammy, despite all that has been said about this, by myself and others, ultimately you are responsible for the truck and its load, and if you don’t want to take it you don’t have to. Personally, based upon the information you provided and my inerpretation of it, I would have taken it.
Lucy:
In the meantime, your TM was WRONG[/i], so personally I would print off the PDF above and (politely) tell him to stick that up his arse and ■■■■ it. [/quote] Wa-hey! Go Lucy, go Lucy!! I think I’d have wanted the load ‘adjusting’ before taking it on the road. Why make life difficult and potentially have problems 30 miles down the road and have the load falling out of the trailer? I surmise that you have trained loaders loading your vehicles, so if they can’t be bothered to do their job to a certain standard - how can you do yours? It’s not about trying to cause a fuss or drop somebody in it. You are just working to the H&S that firms are always banging on about, and covering your own backside. I work for DHL - Exel Supply Chain (cool name, eh? ) and I know if I took a trailer out like that and something went wrong - the first thing the firm would say is - ‘Why did you take that out - did you not check your vehicle?’. I would be the one getting disciplined - nobody else. It’s just the way firms like this work. I’ve has a similar thing myself recently. We sometimes use tautliners to deliver roll cages. I had one the other week. I saw the whole load roll over to the off-side as I went round the first bend as I came out of the depot - at that time we were not allowed to see inside the trailer before departure. I spun around and took it straight back. The warehouse shift manager could not have been more apologetic when he saw the trailer from the outside. He assured me the loader concerned would be given a good thrashing! So I would have done exactly the same Jammy.
A motor vehicle, every trailer drawn thereby and all parts and accessories shall at all times be such, that no danger is caused or is likely to be caused to any person in or on the vehicle or on a road by reason of
· condition or unsuitable purpose
· number of passengers
· manner passengers carried
weight, distribution, packing and adjustment of load.
Hence if the mirrors were not suitable for the manner in which the vehicle was loaded, then you have every justification for not finding the vehicle acceptable.
You may also wish to look up and print off the HSE document “Driving at Work”.
Roadhog… Yes, we’ve all pulled loads like that and there are times when nothing can be done about it…the classic examples being the ones you’ve given where either something’s shifted along the way (usually thanks to a pothole or stupidly rough track up to previous drop) or the load is made up of pallets which bulge by their very nature (like the horse-feed I backloaded into a taut not long ago…it looked like a pregnant cow. )
In this case, however, it was avoidable, and Jammy works for a large firm who would have been first to lay the claim at his door if something had gone wrong. Consequently, under these circumstances, I would have had it moved before it went on the road, or at least made sure that everything possible was done to solve the problem.
It’s not an unreasonable request when you run out of a warehouse with dedicated loaders, and in this instance I’d have done what Jammy did and refused to take it as it was. There’s just no need for it.
Ps. And no matter what way you look at it, his TM’s “knowledge” of Abnormal Load rules was WRONG.
Lucy:
Roadhog… Yes, we’ve all pulled loads like that and there are times when nothing can be done about it…the classic examples being the ones you’ve given where either something’s shifted along the way (usually thanks to a pothole or stupidly rough track up to previous drop) or the load is made up of pallets which bulge by their very nature (like the horse-feed I backloaded into a taut not long ago…it looked like a pregnant cow. )
In this case, however, it was avoidable, and Jammy works for a large firm who would have been first to lay the claim at his door if something had gone wrong. Consequently, under these circumstances, I would have had it moved before it went on the road, or at least made sure that everything possible was done to solve the problem.
It’s not an unreasonable request when you run out of a warehouse with dedicated loaders, and in this instance I’d have done what Jammy did and refused to take it as it was. There’s just no need for it.
I don’t keep track of who works where etc on here, so I simply put myself in that situation at my place of work. given that, i’d still run with it if its only sticking out 6".
i’ve just been in to change trailers, and as the office & yard staff go home at 6pm, if there’s a problem, either I deal with it or I have to wait for someone else to come in and deal with it. its often easier and quicker to sort things out myself. that’s why I carry most things i’m likely to need - bulbs, straps, tools, airline and tyre inflator that connects to red line, jumpleads etc. and for me, waiting to have a pallet moved etc, could have a big impact on where i’ll run out of time and ultimately affect whether I have 2 nights in my own bed at the weekend or 3!
But if I was in jammy’s situation, with those resources to hand, theres no excuse for the load not being sorted out prior to departure.
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) and I know if I took a trailer out like that and something went wrong - the first thing the firm would say is - ‘Why did you take that out - did you not check your vehicle?’. I would be the one getting disciplined - nobody else. It’s just the way firms like this work.
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