DrivingMissDaisy:
The guilty party is big business. Always is always will be. Greed leads to this.
I have to disagree with that, the only to blame is you and me and the rest of Britain.
We (don’t take it personal) want it cheaper and cheaper, we want value burgers, value bread, value this and value that.
We avoid the traditional Butcher, Bakker or even refuse to buy the quality stuff if we can get Extra value for 3 pence less.
the bread in Britain, don’t know where it made of, but a loaf of that cost 50 pence cannot be made of quality ingredients.
Neither can you expect to have top meat in a kilo sausages for GBP 1.50.
But the British public buys it and require prices to go cheaper and cheaper.
The moment we stop buying crap quality, and demand good stuff……………….and want to pay the money what it cost to produce good quality food, that’s when things can improve.
Big or small business cannot make a pound profit on a kilo sausages of GBP 1.50, they probably talk about penny’s.
"Carryfast:
Why would anyone with any sense want to eat horses in a country which can produce the best beef in the world.If you prefer eating horse that’s your choice.The fact is the problem is that the meat industry can make more money by exporting our decent beef and feeding the domestic population zb horsemeat and describing it ( and pricing it ) as beef which at best should be used for petfood.Although I doubt if many people who ( rightly ) treat horses as intelligent working animals and/or pets would want to feed their dead horse ( which is/should be humanely killed by a vet not sent to a slaughter house for food ),to their pet dog.The fact is it’s just a symptom of the fact that this country is turning into an incivilised impoverished zb hole just like many others in Eastern Europe.Not forgetting that the historic consumption of horsemeat on the continent has it’s basis in famine and poverty there not choice.
Carryfast you exceeded yourself again with spouting absolute crap.
Why would you want to eat beef, or even pork? Cows and pigs are very intelligent animals, probably as intelligent as a horse.
Ever drove live stock to the slaughter houses? Guess not, because you would know how clever they are.
Been involved for years in the Equestrian sports and the breeding of short track race horses (thoroughbred Arabian Horses)and there is a big difference in work (race) horses and horses bred for the human consumption.
Like you have show cows, milk cows and meat cows. Not every bred is too be used for producing meat.
By the way in many countries a cow is a working animal, pulling carts and ploughing the fields.
This has nothing to do with poverty, but more with what is available or is the best tool for the job.
Your ignorance just shows that you think you are superior because you are British, but you are not.
Because if you had any decency in you and had a clue where you where talking about, you would have noticed on “your travels through Europe” that the European countries average more spend on quality food than the British.
You would have noticed that the amount of traditional Butchers, Bakers, Brewers, Cheese shops, Fruit & Vegetable shops exceed by a massive difference what is available in Britain.
Why o Why would that be??
Because the rest of Europe are living in poverty? They don’t recognise a good piece of food?
No because they have a history of good food, they know that it’s pointless to use filet steak in a stew, a good piece of chuck steak, or horse beef gives it flavor and make a superb plate of food.
This includes many parts of Eastern Europe, had amazing food in Poland, Bulgeria, Czech republic, the best Gulash ever tasted in Hungary,
British Kitchen is based if you like it or not, on the French Kitchen, and boy do the French have a clue about food and wines (probably nothing else beside that).
By the way, it’s pointless to have “good” beef in Britain, as 80% of the population eats it well done + 15 minutes.
This kills the meat and makes it as tasty as my shoe soles.
Nothing beats a steak cooked “Blue” or if the quality is slightly less, Medium rare.
"Carryfast:
Why would anyone with any sense want to eat horses in a country which can produce the best beef in the world.If you prefer eating horse that’s your choice.The fact is the problem is that the meat industry can make more money by exporting our decent beef and feeding the domestic population zb horsemeat and describing it ( and pricing it ) as beef which at best should be used for petfood.Although I doubt if many people who ( rightly ) treat horses as intelligent working animals and/or pets would want to feed their dead horse ( which is/should be humanely killed by a vet not sent to a slaughter house for food ),to their pet dog.The fact is it’s just a symptom of the fact that this country is turning into an incivilised impoverished zb hole just like many others in Eastern Europe.Not forgetting that the historic consumption of horsemeat on the continent has it’s basis in famine and poverty there not choice.
Carryfast you exceeded yourself again with spouting absolute crap.
Why would you want to eat beef, or even pork? Cows and pigs are very intelligent animals, probably as intelligent as a horse.
Ever drove live stock to the slaughter houses? Guess not, because you would know how clever they are.
Been involved for years in the Equestrian sports and the breeding of short track race horses (thoroughbred Arabian Horses)and there is a big difference in work (race) horses and horses bred for the human consumption.
Like you have show cows, milk cows and meat cows. Not every bred is too be used for producing meat.
By the way in many countries a cow is a working animal, pulling carts and ploughing the fields.
This has nothing to do with poverty, but more with what is available or is the best tool for the job.
Your ignorance just shows that you think you are superior because you are British, but you are not.
Because if you had any decency in you and had a clue where you where talking about, you would have noticed on “your travels through Europe” that the European countries average more spend on quality food than the British.
You would have noticed that the amount of traditional Butchers, Bakers, Brewers, Cheese shops, Fruit & Vegetable shops exceed by a massive difference what is available in Britain.
Why o Why would that be??
Because the rest of Europe are living in poverty? They don’t recognise a good piece of food?
No because they have a history of good food, they know that it’s pointless to use filet steak in a stew, a good piece of chuck steak, or horse beef gives it flavor and make a superb plate of food.
This includes many parts of Eastern Europe, had amazing food in Poland, Bulgeria, Czech republic, the best Gulash ever tasted in Hungary,
British Kitchen is based if you like it or not, on the French Kitchen, and boy do the French have a clue about food and wines (probably nothing else beside that).
By the way, it’s pointless to have “good” beef in Britain, as 80% of the population eats it well done + 15 minutes.
This kills the meat and makes it as tasty as my shoe soles.
Nothing beats a steak cooked “Blue” or if the quality is slightly less, Medium rare.
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So after all that bollox how do you explain the difference in price between a prime cut of English beef compared to a piece of Romanian horse and you can bet that the scammers wouldn’t be trying to label horse as beef if beef wasn’t worth more and the reason why beef is worth more is because it’s better than horse…
As for the sterotypical bs that we don’t know how to cook beef just try cooking and eating a piece of chicken or pork that’s cooked as rare as I cook a piece of steak.
However,as I’ve said,like many of those Romanians,my grandad drove a team of horses on haulage before he drove a steam truck.They were working animals but looked on and treated as well as any pet show horse like a Lipizzaner and as such were ( rightly ) never looked on as food unlike beef cattle.Although as I’ve heard it horsemeat was around during WW2 but no one,to my knowledge ( rightly ) ever ate the stuff by choice.However the British generally have a better attitude in their treatment of animals than the continentals in most cases.
I think the whole issue is just another example of our membership of the EU and the continentals trying to impose their zb ideas related to food on us with a bit of help of those trying to make a few quid out of the scam.
Quite a few supermarkets have now lost a lot of customer confidence and trust.Every link in the supply chain of the cheap food will obviously make some profit,then there’s packaging and transportation.It just makes one wonder what the original cost of the raw material actually is.The only one losing out is the consumer,you’ve all heard the saying ‘Buy cheap,buy twice’ This situation really should have been buy cheap,buy once.
I can understand people eating horse although I wouldn’t personally as I consider them intelligent animals who would rather keep in a paddock than a freezer
What’s suprised me is how poor our food security really is. I know we had BSE etc but I generally thought things were ok in this country. I mean who outside of the meat industry really knows what’s in a pork pie or kebab say? Then again, if you pay next to nothing you presumably do get all sorts.
There must be some fellow TNUK’ers who have worked in slaughter houses or butcher’s shops… Care to spill the beans??
Farmers are not to blame - (declared interest I am a farmers son ) Farmers today in the UK have the highest levels of traceability and bureaucracy of anywhere in Europe. Everything the cattle are fed is recorded and all antibiotics that are used are recorded along with any withdrawal times . When a beef animal leaves our farm for slaughter I’d bet my life that animal is in the best condition of its life and we regularly put one of our own in the freezer to eat . Food miles ha ha 10 miles from the door to the slaughter house and another 15 back via the butchers .
We get around £1.50 /kg at the farm gate - so if you add in transport , slaughter ,processing / butchery,transport to the shelf anything less than £2.50- £3 / kg you want to start thinking about what else is in it.
Supermarkets demand lower and lower prices to protect their profits , processors have to supply to a price negotiated months even years in advance with no control over the prices of the base ingredients . Where do you think the problem comes from?? Supermarkets drive the price down and processors look to save money - Beef - £2000/ ton - horse £ 700 / ton . Looks the same , tastes pretty much the same and I’ll bet it has been in our food for the last 5 years and nobody has died from it .
It’s not about the horse meat - it’s about the fact that its not declared on the ingredients list . But 4 value burgers for 80 p really what do you expect - I’m only surprised that horse is all that they found in them .
beefy4605:
Farmers are not to blame - (declared interest I am a farmers son ) Farmers today in the UK have the highest levels of traceability and bureaucracy of anywhere in Europe. Everything the cattle are fed is recorded and all antibiotics that are used are recorded along with any withdrawal times . When a beef animal leaves our farm for slaughter I’d bet my life that animal is in the best condition of its life and we regularly put one of our own in the freezer to eat . Food miles ha ha 10 miles from the door to the slaughter house and another 15 back via the butchers .
We get around £1.50 /kg at the farm gate - so if you add in transport , slaughter ,processing / butchery,transport to the shelf anything less than £2.50- £3 / kg you want to start thinking about what else is in it.
Supermarkets demand lower and lower prices to protect their profits , processors have to supply to a price negotiated months even years in advance with no control over the prices of the base ingredients . Where do you think the problem comes from?? Supermarkets drive the price down and processors look to save money - Beef - £2000/ ton - horse £ 700 / ton . Looks the same , tastes pretty much the same and I’ll bet it has been in our food for the last 5 years and nobody has died from it .
It’s not about the horse meat - it’s about the fact that its not declared on the ingredients list . But 4 value burgers for 80 p really what do you expect - I’m only surprised that horse is all that they found in them .
What about the subsidies, ie the single farm payment.No other industry get this help !!!
They also get subsidies for not planting trees and not milking cows that they dont have.There are a lot of farmers in the House of Lords.that cant have anything to do with it surely.
What have subsidies got to do with horse meat ending up in beef? What about the fuel tax thats being withheld - thats a subsidy for hauliers but nobody wants to talk about that .
If you want to ■■■■■ about farmers , subsidies and Range Rovers ( lets face it we all know thats were it will go ) start another thread .
The horse wasn’t in the beef when the beef walked off the farm . It was added later after the animal was killed . It wasn’t added by the farmers. As I said - blame the processors , the supermarkets or the customers for demanding cheap food. British / UK beef is the best there is but it’s not the cheapest. Pay your money - take your choice - but don’t complain about cheap burgers that cost less than the cost of the beef thats supposed to be in them.
Most people realize that the dirty dealing has taken place in the abbatoirs and packing plants.The real joints, shoulder ,silverside etc. are not the problem where we are dealing with burgers ,pies and sausages then all sorts of dubious ingredients can find their way in.
beefy4605:
What have subsidies got to do with horse meat ending up in beef? What about the fuel tax thats being withheld - thats a subsidy for hauliers but nobody wants to talk about that .
If you want to ■■■■■ about farmers , subsidies and Range Rovers ( lets face it we all know thats were it will go ) start another thread .
The horse wasn’t in the beef when the beef walked off the farm . It was added later after the animal was killed . It wasn’t added by the farmers. As I said - blame the processors , the supermarkets or the customers for demanding cheap food. British / UK beef is the best there is but it’s not the cheapest. Pay your money - take your choice - but don’t complain about cheap burgers that cost less than the cost of the beef thats supposed to be in them.
I think it’s more case of the rip off merchants looking to get beef money from horse meat than people wanting to pay less than the cost of beef.The fact is both horses and cattle are being sent for slaughter and they’re both alive and walking at that point.Why would anyone in Britain want to allow the sending for slaughter or export or import of horses for human consumption.If the whole scam doesn’t apply from top to bottom,including the government,all they’d need to do is to make the trade totally illegal here.In which case no doubt then we’d hear all the protests from all those who are gaining from the rip off.Including the government who’ve obviously got a motive in horse being described as beef to help with the food cost inflation figures.
beefy4605:
What have subsidies got to do with horse meat ending up in beef? What about the fuel tax thats being withheld - thats a subsidy for hauliers but nobody wants to talk about that .
If you want to ■■■■■ about farmers , subsidies and Range Rovers ( lets face it we all know thats were it will go ) start another thread .
The horse wasn’t in the beef when the beef walked off the farm . It was added later after the animal was killed . It wasn’t added by the farmers. As I said - blame the processors , the supermarkets or the customers for demanding cheap food. British / UK beef is the best there is but it’s not the cheapest. Pay your money - take your choice - but don’t complain about cheap burgers that cost less than the cost of the beef thats supposed to be in them.
I don’t know any haulier that gets off without paying tax on fuel.Where are the horses reared…usually on a farm.You can’t say the farmers are blameless in this fiasco.
I don’t recall mentioning fuel or Range Rovers in my post.Don’t know any farmers this way with a Range Rover.As for fuel farmers run on rebated fuel,yet they still joined in on the fuel protests.
beefy4605:
What have subsidies got to do with horse meat ending up in beef? What about the fuel tax thats being withheld - thats a subsidy for hauliers but nobody wants to talk about that .
If you want to ■■■■■ about farmers , subsidies and Range Rovers ( lets face it we all know thats were it will go ) start another thread .
The horse wasn’t in the beef when the beef walked off the farm . It was added later after the animal was killed . It wasn’t added by the farmers. As I said - blame the processors , the supermarkets or the customers for demanding cheap food. British / UK beef is the best there is but it’s not the cheapest. Pay your money - take your choice - but don’t complain about cheap burgers that cost less than the cost of the beef thats supposed to be in them.
I don’t know any haulier that gets off without paying tax on fuel.Where are the horses reared…usually on a farm.You can’t say the farmers are blameless in this fiasco.
It wouldn’t be beef farmers though except for the price of beef being over inflated by foreign demand in which case beef is being exported for an inflated price with horse being used to fill the vacuum created in the domestic market to rig the food inflation figures.While there’s probably not an actual horse farming industry for food purposes but there is an obvious growing organised domestic horse supply and slaughter operation in addition to an import operation.The whole thing has the corrupt government’s grubby paw prints all over it or they would simply have declared all trade in horse meat for human consumption illegal.Simples.
Carryfast:
It wouldn’t be beef farmers though except for the price of beef being over inflated by foreign demand in which case beef is being exported for an inflated price with horse being used to fill the vacuum created in the domestic market to rig the food inflation figures.While there’s probably not an actual horse farming industry for food purposes but there is an obvious growing organised domestic horse supply and slaughter operation in addition to an import operation.The whole thing has the corrupt government’s grubby paw prints all over it or they would simply have declared all trade in horse meat for human consumption illegal.Simples.
You must try harder CF, somewhere along the line this must be Thatchers fault
There are more horses ,ponies and donkeys in the country now than when they were used for power and haulage. when we consider the number that are in the hands of the caravan utilisers well where might they end up.?
