Franglais:
On Ro-Ro trailers. Juddian and Conor have listed some good reasons in favour of them.
But.
Dover alone has been handling 2.6million freight units a year. It relies on getting it ferries in and out quickly. There simply isn’t the time to empty and load those ferries. There isn’t the land there to marshal the numbers of droppers needed to make a significant difference.
Humber Ports region actually handles several times more tonnage from the EU than Dover does. Dover may not have the capacity or the ability but other ports do. Humber ports region for example has plenty of space so for stuff that is heading up north, to the west or is coming from the northern end of the EU and where an extra few hours on a boat makes little difference it can be diverted to ports other than Dover. Dover could then remain focussed on the more JIT stuff.
For regular traffic, so units aren’t packed waiting for a return, from North or East EU to North UK, that isn’t time sensitive, it may work for some.
But the extra time penalty to drop a trailer, have to shunted on board, long sea crossing, shunted off, collected again before eeven getting near it’s destination, let alone the availability of boats and tuggies to make much difference?
I can’t see it as having much take up. A truck can cross the channel and get north before the trailer left the EU quay.
Make that long sea route compulsory ?
Less fresh food, longer delivery times means lposses as the way business operates doesn’t like that.
You or anyone can argue that Just In Time is bad etc, but it is what we have. Businesses ate not faithful to one nation and are already voting with their feet.
If the long North Sea crossings are so impractical why is it impossible to get a booking on them?
For anything loading Scandinavia, Northern Germany and Holland and heading for Northern England it is quicker going through the Hook or Rotterdam and that includes drop trailers, it is not just the crossing time but drivers hours to factor in, start a card at seven in the morning in Hamburg use the Hook and the following morning you have a full card to deliver in the UK, Hamburg to Calais is a full card so do you park in Calais or 4 hours away to keep the load safe and then struggle to make Northern England the next day.
Can’t speak about the time penalty for drop trailers in Portsmouth as I don’t use that crossing but the crossings that I do use there is no time penalty for a drop trailer if it is booked on then it will go just the same as if it was a runner. The majority of movements across the North Sea are already drop trailers so it is a perfectly practical way of moving all goods
Please go back and look at the previous posts. Don’t set up straw men.
No where has anyone said North Sea Crossings are impractical for all.
I do suggest that those who currently use the sort crossings probably do so far a reason.
Previous posts were speculating whether they would be an increase in drops. The biggest volume of traffic is Dover and the Tunnel. About 4 million units a year.
Dover has 17 Ro-Ro vessels, Humberside has 2 and a half !
They are bigger vessels on the North Sea, but look at load and tip times, look at journey times…No comparison on scale of operations.
.
You are quite right to say trucks from the North may already use those Nortern routes, but how many are there compared with those from Southern Europe bringing fruit, veg, salad, etc? Why would they move north?
As you say those vessels are already full so not much scope for increased traffic anyway.
Tell Conor that. [emoji3]
Please go back and look at the previous posts. Don’t set up straw men.
No where has anyone said North Sea Crossings are impractical for all.
I do suggest that those who currently use the sort crossings probably do so far a reason.
Previous posts were speculating whether they would be an increase in drops. The biggest volume of traffic is Dover and the Tunnel. About 4 million units a year.
Dover has 17 Ro-Ro vessels, Humberside has 2 and a half !
They are bigger vessels on the North Sea, but look at load and tip times, look at journey times…No comparison on scale of operations.
.
You are quite right to say trucks from the North may already use those Nortern routes, but how many are there compared with those from Southern Europe bringing fruit, veg, salad, etc? Why would they move north?
As you say those vessels are already full so not much scope for increased traffic anyway.
Tell Conor that. [emoji3]
[/quote]
You made a number of assertions about drop trailers, saying why they won’t work, having used those routes as both a runner and lifting and dropping trailers I can say they work perfectly well for both dry loads and fridge loads
You say there is no capacity yet if there is demand then the capacity will be put in place you only have to look at the direct sailings out of Ireland to France to see how quickly capacity was put in place once the demand was there.
P&O have introduced the Calais Tilbury service for drop trailers if successful then there is no reason why this service can’t be increased. I agree that Dover and the Tunnel are always going to be the busiest crossings due to their location and crossing times, but this does not mean that other options can’t be looked at.
American Shipper: Shadow of Brexit fuels Dutch warehouse logistics boom
The race to secure logistics real estate in key parts of northern Europe has been heating up ever since the U.K. elected to leave the European Union in 2016. It is showing no signs of cooling.
Brexit’s gift
Cuno Vat, CEO of Neele-Vat Logistics, a Netherlands-based logistics provider, said that while the uncertainty around Brexit had been confusing for business, new opportunities have emerged.
“We’ve seen a five-fold increase in requests from overseas companies currently with setups in the U.K. that want to redesign their supply chain. They are considering the Netherlands as a location and want us to be their business partners,” he said.
Bye, bye Britain
However, others are making substantial, long-term commitments to shifting large parts of their businesses out of the U.K.
Stan de Caluwe, senior supply chain solutions manager of the Holland International Distribution Council (HIDC), told FreightWaves his organization was in talks “with various logistics companies” about moving from the U.K. to the Netherlands, transfers HIDC helps to facilitate.
“Many are starting with additional solutions such as a second hub here and one in the U.K., then longer term are looking to move their European distribution center here and will then service the U.K. from here.”
Please go back and look at the previous posts. Don’t set up straw men.
No where has anyone said North Sea Crossings are impractical for all.
I do suggest that those who currently use the sort crossings probably do so far a reason.
Previous posts were speculating whether they would be an increase in drops. The biggest volume of traffic is Dover and the Tunnel. About 4 million units a year.
Dover has 17 Ro-Ro vessels, Humberside has 2 and a half !
They are bigger vessels on the North Sea, but look at load and tip times, look at journey times…No comparison on scale of operations.
.
You are quite right to say trucks from the North may already use those Nortern routes, but how many are there compared with those from Southern Europe bringing fruit, veg, salad, etc? Why would they move north?
As you say those vessels are already full so not much scope for increased traffic anyway.
Tell Conor that. [emoji3]
You made a number of assertions about drop trailers, saying why they won’t work, having used those routes as both a runner and lifting and dropping trailers I can say they work perfectly well for both dry loads and fridge loads
You say there is no capacity yet if there is demand then the capacity will be put in place you only have to look at the direct sailings out of Ireland to France to see how quickly capacity was put in place once the demand was there.
P&O have introduced the Calais Tilbury service for drop trailers if successful then there is no reason why this service can’t be increased. I agree that Dover and the Tunnel are always going to be the busiest crossings due to their location and crossing times, but this does not mean that other options can’t be looked at.
[/quote]
Where is there scope for capacity at Dover? Where is there land to drop and marshal trailers? Are there enough linkspans to have boats increase their turnaround times?
You yourself said the Northern routes are often fully booked. How long to plan and improve there? And how much investment needed?
.
Ed to add.
I do agree there could very well be changes, and that may increase droppers. I don’t expect it will be a massive change, and won’t be some new golden age for traction owner drivers.
Can It Get Any Worse??
I Think We Just Need A Healing Laugh At The Destruction Of Britain - What Else Can We Do??
We’re at the stage where the plane took off without engineers doing any maintenance, the ground crew forgot to refuel and some pub bore who’s had enough of experts is acting as pilot, winging it without any qualifications or relevant experience.
whisperingsmith:
Can It Get Any Worse??
I Think We Just Need A Healing Laugh At The Destruction Of Britain - What Else Can We Do??
We’re at the stage where the plane took off without engineers doing any maintenance, the ground crew forgot to refuel and some pub bore who’s had enough of experts is acting as pilot, winging it without any qualifications or relevant experience.
What could possibly go wrong?
Wait and see what happens April 1st and thenagain in July when the next set of controls are (due to be) introduced.
“Details of these procedures will be set out on GOV.UK” (sic) Feb 2021 page 35. So, wait and see, again.
commonrail:
See you’re vocal again…after your vaccine scandal lay low
Moi?
Laying low?
If I post there are multiple calls for me to shut up, and when I do…
I do post a lot, guilty, but do have other things to do too.
Vaccine scandal?
The serious ■■■■ up by the EU over supply of vaccine and Northern Ireland border? Yeah that was a serious issue. Looks to me like the EU (I don’t know at what level) seriously cocked up there. And have since seen the error of their way/ U-turned, or whatever.
A ■■■■ up. A serious one. Not an on going problem.
.
Any other alleged “vaccine scandal” probably best dealt with elsewhere.
commonrail:
See you’re vocal again…after your vaccine scandal lay low
Moi?
Laying low?
If I post there are multiple calls for me to shut up, and when I do…
I do post a lot, guilty, but do have other things to do too.
Vaccine scandal?
The serious ■■■■ up by the EU over supply of vaccine and Northern Ireland border? Yeah that was a serious issue. Looks to me like the EU (I don’t know at what level) seriously cocked up there. And have since seen the error of their way/ U-turned, or whatever.
A ■■■■ up. A serious one. Not an on going problem.
.
Any other alleged “vaccine scandal” probably best dealt with elsewhere.
Out of interest if it had been the UK government that broke an international agreement it had just signed to cover up it’s incompetency would your response have been the same?
The EU commission headed by VDL signed a contract that they didn’t understand then tried to make out that that the company had lied, sent inspectors into the factory to prove that the company had lied then when that backfired on them, put export restrictions on vaccine exports and as part of that broke an international treaty.
VDL has a proven track record of incompetence since 2009 but hey lack of vaccines in the EU is not an on going problem? Even the US under Trump managed to put in a better vaccine programme than the EU.
commonrail:
See you’re vocal again…after your vaccine scandal lay low
Moi?
Laying low?
If I post there are multiple calls for me to shut up, and when I do…
I do post a lot, guilty, but do have other things to do too.
Vaccine scandal?
The serious ■■■■ up by the EU over supply of vaccine and Northern Ireland border? Yeah that was a serious issue. Looks to me like the EU (I don’t know at what level) seriously cocked up there. And have since seen the error of their way/ U-turned, or whatever.
A ■■■■ up. A serious one. Not an on going problem.
.
Any other alleged “vaccine scandal” probably best dealt with elsewhere.
Out of interest if it had been the UK government that broke an international agreement it had just signed to cover up it’s incompetency would your response have been the same?
The EU commission headed by VDL signed a contract that they didn’t understand then tried to make out that that the company had lied, sent inspectors into the factory to prove that the company had lied then when that backfired on them, put export restrictions on vaccine exports and as part of that broke an international treaty.
VDL has a proven track record of incompetence since 2009 but hey lack of vaccines in the EU is not an on going problem? Even the US under Trump managed to put in a better vaccine programme than the EU.
The EU vaccine programme is behind the UK one.
Yep the UK got that right. It was at the time a gamble to invest heavily in an unproven new technology, and yes, it has paid off. Well done UK.
I hesitate to say well done UK Gov and Johnson. The PPE supply and purchasing, the Test and Track, the on again / off again lockdown, somewhat dilute thinking all is well in the country.
We need a Gov that gets most things right, and ■■■■■ up occasionally, rather than one that throws a million darts at a board and cheers if one coincidentally hits the bullseye.
toonsy:
In fairness BoJo has also shown willing to break a new, freshly negotiated, international treaty.
But they pulled back at the last. A bit like the EU did.
Neither side really has any more dignity than the other in that regard.
The EU didn’t pull back they reversed the decision after breaking the treaty that they had placed so much emphasis on as to how important it was to the GFA and peace in Ireland, obviously all irrelevant if we need to cover up a ■■■■ up.
Time will tell how clever whoever was, a medical treatment (it is not a vaccine) hyped to hysterical levels to ‘encourage’ people to get treated, maybe the UK govt saved the people brilliantly, maybe when the long term effects become known the EU by not securing as many shots played a blindsider, who knows?, who will ever know when the mainstream media have got into bed with the politicians and become the govt publicity machine.
Not as any of it matters, those who designed made ordered paid for distributed and administered these treatments (the receiving of which makes no difference to the restrictions and masking you must repeat like performing seals) can’t be held responsible if it all goes pear shaped, doesn’t anyone ask why.
British Fisheries Minister didn’t read Brexit deal because she was too busy with Christmas Eve event
"British Prime Minister Boris Johnson is standing by his fisheries minister after she admitted that she did not read the post-Brexit trade deal with Brussels when it was agreed because she was busy organising a nativity trail.
Victoria Prentis faced calls for her to quit after she revealed that she was too busy on Christmas Eve to read the deal. But Downing Street said the Prime Minister is standing by the Department for Environment, Food and Rural Affairs (Defra) minister.
Protection of the UK’s fishing industry was a major concern throughout the Brexit talks and yet the fisheries minister told the Lords EU Environment Sub-Committee that when the agreement came, she was also busy with organising activies for Christmas Eve.
Asked if her jaw had dropped when she saw the deal with the EU on Christmas Eve, Ms Prentis said: “No, the agreement came when we were all very busy on Christmas Eve, in my case organising the local nativity trail.
The comments came following delays to seafood exports after the Brexit transition period ended on New Year’s Eve.
Many Scottish fishermen have paused exports after post-Brexit bureaucracy added days to their delivery times and hundreds of pounds to their costs."
How are the yellow vest movement doing after being coshed and water cannon treatment all for trying to protect hard won work and pension rights…and poor old Catalans …I am glad I voted out we will be ok
