Following on from my last post on the Strongserve thread…
I was fully loaded up to 41 tonne with frozen turkeys, came off at J24 Ainley on the M62 and headed down to Ainleys Ind Est at the bottom of the A629 into Halifax. As anyone familiar with the area will know, that’s a VERY STEEP hill [/b] and a good retarder is required down there at full weight The speed cameras (sorry, casualty reduction cameras ) kept me well below 50mph (went down nice and steady at 40-45mph), had the FH in a nice rev-happy gear to keep the retarder working hard and was braking with the foot-brake too on and off every few seconds to try not to fry the brakes. I came off at the Ainleys Ind Est sliproad which is just as steep and ends in a nasty roundabout and as I was coming down the sliproad I could feel the unit brakes had faded REALLY bad and I literally stood up in the cab on the pedal to try to stop before the white line I knew I wasn’t going to make it and as an emergency measure I jammed the handbrake on which thankfully just about did the trick although I was well onto the roundabout before I stopped and had nearly taken a van out which had come under the bridge Next thing, looks in the mirrors and my trailer is on fire and there’s smoke billowing out everywhere. [zb] the bed . The guy jumps out of his van and grabs his fire extinguisher and starts spraying my trailer wheels with it By this time I’m out of the cab and had grabbed my big water container and proceeded to douse the wheels on the other side. We eventually managed to get the fire out and after 15 mins or so the smoke stopped and I had a look-see at the damage. Couldn’t see anything visually apart from a bit of charring here and there. Belled the gaffer up and told him and he was just glad I was okay (sign of a good boss; not “okay fine whatever, the load was due there 10 minutes ago, get your skates on” ). I told him that my unit was coming up to the garage that afternoon, I’d take the spare low-roof FH and I wanted those brakes fully servicing/replacing/whatever on mine before I took it out again. Anyway, the gaffer said once the brakes had cooled to ease away gently and try them to see how they felt, which I did, and I don’t know why, but the trailer brakes have never been better Continued on with my delivery steadily and didn’t have any further problems with it. Coming down that slip-road with no stopping power was defo a pant-filling moment I can tell you I reckon I could have stopped the wagon quicker by opening the door and putting my foot out on the ground like we used to do as kids with our brake-less BMX’s Thankfully I lived to tell the tale and managed not to take anyone else out in the process. I had a similar lairy brake-fade no-stopping-power situation coming down Blue Bell Hill on the M2 last week. I’ve never been keen on the FH’s brakes and would have my stop-it-on-a-six-pence Actros back any day in that respect.
Glad your ok Rob and can tell the tale, i had a heart check in the same way when the mobile crane on a tk i was driving lossed all brakes comming down into Ashbourne from Buxton makes you need clean underwear dont it, but must have been ten times worse for you.
A while ago a new driver for a chap i know was comming down some mountain rd into Portugal and jumped on the brakes as hard as poss and fried them as quick he was pulling a tri-axle log trailer and he burnt the trailer brakes out then set about the unit, thankfully he did stop and not hit anything or hurt himself but the rig was out of of action for almost three weeks the bill for the trailer was £2500, good for me cos i get big cash and trips out to do the repairs thanks to this.
Glad your ok and its things like this that make you a better driver.
Brake failures/fading always reminds me of the tragic crash somewhere round Halifax a good number of years ago which made headline news when a tipper’s brakes failed coming down the hill. Ended up smashing straight into a shop iirc and took a few people out.
I don’t recall the exact details but my girlfriend at the time was the Traffic Commissioners “deputy” let’s say, and had the job of investigating the company responsible. I wasn’t a trucker myself back then so I’d didn’t affect me as such.
Can I have a well done turkey please.
Seriously, I can wholely support you in the requirement for clean undies, I had something similar in my early days on Artics.
I was taking a tilt past Lincoln down to Newark on the (old) A46, went round the last roundabout at Lincoln and trundled off towards Newark, unbeknown to me the yellow airline palm connector had come off.
Remember the bend and downhill bit, I saw standing traffic ahead and tried the brakes to let others behind know I was going to slow down, and I realised the was not a lot there.
I stood on the brake pedal, didn’t realise you could use the parking brake at speed, and eventually stopped on the grass verge, halfway along the lenth of the last car in the queue.
Clean undies please, this was my first time back on the road after a nasty collision two days previous, with a fire engine of all things.
Brown trouser syndrome in big style.
Dratsabasti:
…didn’t realise you could use the parking brake at speed…
Neither did I, but when you’ve 41 tonnes pushing you down the hill fighting your own attempts at trying to stop the thing with white-hot brakes at the front and on-fire non-existant brakes at the back, the former is on a guaranteed winner.
I was more concerned that entering the roundabout still doing 30mph with nowhere to go (you can’t go “over” the roundabout because of a rather big hump on earth in the middle of it) I would have to try to turn it left which, at that speed, would definitely result in the whole lot tipping over offside. Also, anyone coming under the bridge from the other side wouldn’t have the first thought that there could be 41 tonnes of wagon and turkeys hurtling down, out-of-control and it could so easily have been extremely messy.
I ragged on the handbrake as a last resort after trying it once on a wide, wet, muddy road in the past when I was empty. It locked the drive axle wheels up on the unit iirc and also the wheels on the trailer to a degree and I slid through the mud. I am aware that doing that doesn’t do the hand-brake any good whatsoever when you’re moving, but faced with the situation today, I didn’t care I needed to stop quickly
I’ve learnt a lesson from it though and it’s another notch on our ever growing experience posts.
rob the brakes werent on fire they were just very hot i take it the trailers are on drums ifuture put volvo in to 3rd use the enigine brake on stage 1 and occainally stage 2 when needed this give
one plenty of revs for the engine bake
2 stage will hold 41 tonnes back qute happily at that speed
Dratsabasti:
didn’t realise you could use the parking brake at speed,
The first portion of the parking brake is a “Progressive Brake”, your secondary braking system, generally working on most axles. It’s only when you take it ‘over the notch’ that it becomes a parking brake.
To try it for yourselves, get someone else to operate the lever whilst you watch the actuators.
Pleased you are around to tell the tale. Can we all have disc brakes on all wheels please. Too many units and trailers totally incompatable to my mind, Some have discs, some have ABS, etc. Time it was all sorted.
I passed my class 1, only 4 mths ago and have found this string and site helpful as anything. On your learning/test you run empty, on the shortest flatbed trailer/unit possible. There is no mention of using your parking brake in an emergency or come to think of it, anything that may be of use whilst driving loaded.
I must admit, the first time I took out a fully loaded curtainsider, I had severe ‘brown pants’ syndrome and on several occassions have eaten a hole in the seat!
I have learnt a lot in 4mths, on the road, talking to other drivers & on here
Thanks to all on here
alix776:
rob the brakes werent on fire they were just very hot i take it the trailers are on drums ifuture put volvo in to 3rd use the enigine brake on stage 1 and occainally stage 2 when needed this give
one plenty of revs for the engine bake
2 stage will hold 41 tonnes back qute happily at that speed
Sorry Alix, but clearly visible flames licking around the ends of the trailer axles where the brakes are suggests to me that it is on fire[/b] Maybe flames look totally different in your part of the world The FH I drive is an L-reg one and only has the rocker switch on the dash centre console so it’s either on or off. I don’t have a later model that has the 3 stage stalk although I do know what you’re referring to and agree that it is indeed very powerful when used correctly. I feel that all HGV’s should be fitted with one as powerful as standard.
Rob K:
Brake failures/fading always reminds me of the tragic crash somewhere round Halifax a good number of years ago which made headline news when a tipper’s brakes failed coming down the hill. Ended up smashing straight into a shop iirc and took a few people out.
I don’t recall the exact details but my girlfriend at the time was the Traffic Commissioners “deputy” let’s say, and had the job of investigating the company responsible. I wasn’t a trucker myself back then so I’d didn’t affect me as such.
I think thats the Sowerby Bridge crash. If I remember the tipper only had one brake on 8 wheels that was within legal limits and some that were completely unservicable. I beieve the driver was one of the fatalities and the directors were fined or even imprisoned.
Are you sure you are talking about a retarder Rob and not an exhaust brake. the retarder is a competely different entity. I have a retarder fitted to the dreaded scania and trust me it can hold 40t down that hill on the 2nd setting (there are 6) i never need to touch the brakes, never mind get them warm.
Nessa:
Are you sure you are talking about a retarder Rob and not an exhaust brake. the retarder is a competely different entity. I have a retarder fitted to the dreaded scania and trust me it can hold 40t down that hill on the 2nd setting (there are 6) i never need to touch the brakes, never mind get them warm.
Think it must be exhaust brake then Most drivers seem to refer to that switch thingy or stalk thingy that makes a burbling noise when you put it on as “the retarder” although I guess it’s actually just the zorst brake. On my FH it’s just a rocker switch in between the diff lock and the reversing bleeper rocker switches on the centre console. When you come off the gas it cuts in if it’s switched on. Does a reasonable job of holding my speed when descending the A638 into Dewsbury from J40 when I’ve an empty fridge on but it was useless going down the A629 fully loaded, as you’ve read
What you want to do, in future is, go down another full gear, check that the zorst brake switch is all the way down and keep a check on your speed with the occaisional good shove on the brake pedal for 2 - 3 seconds, no more than that.
You should be in a low enough gear to have your revs at about 22 - 2300rpm (about 1 - 200 before the red line), at a speed which stays about the same all the way down. If you speed creeps up, a good shove on the brake pedal will have all of your brake pads working, not just the ones that grab first (which can then overheat). If your speed drops off too quickly, knock it up half a gear and run down a bit quicker.
I don’t know the hill this happened on, but if I can climb over the Alps from France to Italy and drop down the other side, in an old DAF 95 360, at 40t with only the standard zorster, you shouldn’t really have much trouble on the relatively small hills over here. Granted I didn’t have a ■■■■■ at the bottom ,as I was on Autostrada but I still had to pull up pretty sharpish, it was coffee break time.
Some have discs, some have ABS, etc. Time it was all sorted.
Discs have abs drums have abs
ABS has nothing to do with brakes catching fire or working better or worse.
ABS only senses when a wheel is about to lock up and releases the pressure on that wheel momentarily. It can be linked to traction control which senses wheel spin and applies the brake to the faster driven wheel
If you come down any hill with the brakes applied in too high a gear then they will overheat and fade whether they are disc, drum cable or rubber blocks
If you have an exhaust brake drop a couple or three gears and keep the revs in the yellow with the exhaust brake on. If you have a gearbox retarder, same thing
A voith or similar on the prop will hold you back too but they are sometimes cooled by the engine oil or water and will overheat the engine.
The safest way to go down hill is slower to save brakes for stopping
Wheel Nut:
Some have discs, some have ABS, etc. Time it was all sorted.
Discs have abs drums have abs
ABS has nothing to do with brakes catching fire or working better or worse.
ABS only senses when a wheel is about to lock up and releases the pressure on that wheel momentarily. It can be linked to traction control which senses wheel spin and applies the brake to the faster driven wheel
If you come down any hill with the brakes applied in too high a gear then they will overheat and fade whether they are disc, drum cable or rubber blocks
If you have an exhaust brake drop a couple or three gears and keep the revs in the yellow with the exhaust brake on. If you have a gearbox retarder, same thing
A voith or similar on the prop will hold you back too but they are sometimes cooled by the engine oil or water and will overheat the engine.
The safest way to go down hill is slower to save brakes for stopping
Aye, but it appears from a few recent threads that others are questioning my ability descend a steep hill in a fully loaded artic.
As far as I’m concerned I was doing everything correctly. 40mph down that dual-carriageway is a plenty slow off speed to go at and I can assure you the engine revs were round 2000rpm mark which I am fully aware they need to be there for premium exhaust brake performance. However, it is clear that something wasn’t working correctly from the outcome. I never hold the brakes on constantly when coming down a long hill like that and do exactly as suggested by applying fairly hard for a second or two then releasing so as to keep the brakes as cool as possible but not allowing the heat to build up.
Both my unit and the trailer are in the garage now being inspected for defects.
I was double manned with a green horn and was at the end of the week,I normally cant sleep if sombody else is driving but this particular time I nodded off,when I awoke we were going down pamplona (a big bump) I looked in the wide angle mirror and all I could see was smoke coming off the trailer axles.
I mentioned to the driver that he may like to pull over to hard shoulder just in front of the escape lane we were approaching (although they were not the exact words I used) but do not put the handbrake on but instead turn the engine off and leave the vehicle in gear.
Upon inspecting said brakes I noticed that every drum was glowing orange.I asked why he had not used the exhaust brake to which he replied “whats that”
Before you ask yes I had told him how to use the exhaust brake on the way down to the job earlier in the week.I also gave him a piece of advice I was given by an old hand when I first started which is
“always go down a hill in the same gear you used to go up it”
That obviously doesn’t apply if you have a retarder/intarder but only to exhaust brakes.
i9 know its the veb volvo engine brake knew id remember what it was called it has 2 setting stage on and stage 2 its fitted as standard on all fhs even the early ones
i went down there a couple of months ago at 38 tonne and didnt get anywhere near 40 i not questioning your abllity rob but personally id take that hill at 20-30 absolute max without a retarder even then itd be more than 30
its only advise rob
) kept me well below 50mph (went down nice and steady at 40-45mph), had the FH in a nice rev-happy gear to keep the retarder working hard and was braking with the foot-brake too on and off every few seconds to try not to fry the brakes.
). I told him that my unit was coming up to the garage that afternoon, I’d take the spare low-roof FH and I wanted those brakes fully servicing/replacing/whatever on mine before I took it out again.
I reckon I could have stopped the wagon quicker by opening the door and putting my foot out on the ground like we used to do as kids with our brake-less BMX’s 
