Hi all, am trying to find out if there are any laws/rules on bonus payments and hgv drivers,as firm are trying to change pay structure to mainly collection bonus,obviously to get more done and pay less but i feel will be pushed to max to earn decent wage and probably end up with more infringements.any advice welcome.
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Welcome sjb72 .
sjb72:
trying to find out if there are any laws/rules on bonus payments and hgv drivers,as firm are trying to change pay structure
As far as I know, there is no such specific law.
The company cannot change the pay structure without the consent of the employee or by collective agreement by law as it would be deemed as breaking your contract, whether that contract be written or verbal.
You might need a Union rep or if not got one go to Citizens advice or contact ACAS.
Forum with some useful stuff and Forum for questions on drivers hours
i might of mis-read this topic but thought VOSA frowned upon that sort of pay scheme 
EDIT
i thought it was ILLEGAL if it put the driver undrer pressure to run illegal to get the job done quicker to earn more money, like bulk tippers USED to to, pay per load so the highway code and RTD went straight out the window but companys usualy pay a minimum wage so they cant be accused of actively encouraging driver to run bent - its up to the driver if they want to earn more. if that makes sense 
better ROG 
The usual is some minimum wage plus a bonus calculated on whatever idea they have to measure performance (could be miles, profit or even share price).
If they bring it in then study it carefully because, in my experience, they will usually get it wrong so that a canny driver can make a lot more than they expected.
Cruise Control:
i thought it was ILLEGAL if it put the driver undrer pressure to run illegal to get the job done quicke to earn more money
Looking above and below there seems to be a contradiction…
Cruise Control:
if i remember lucy’s thread they have to pay you a minimum wage regardless of what you collect
Santa:
The usual is some minimum wage plus a bonus calculated on whatever idea they have to measure performance (could be miles, profit or even share price).
The only bonus scheme that would ensure safety is one where the driver gets a bonus for fuel economy
Having a minimum wage and then telling the driver that to make a decent living they will need to get this or that bonus as described in the quotes above is bound to tempt some drivers to ‘push it’
ROG:
Cruise Control:
i thought it was ILLEGAL if it put the driver undrer pressure to run illegal to get the job done quicke to earn more moneyLooking above and below there seems to be a contradiction…
Cruise Control:
if i remember lucy’s thread they have to pay you a minimum wage regardless of what you collectSanta:
The usual is some minimum wage plus a bonus calculated on whatever idea they have to measure performance (could be miles, profit or even share price).
o.k o.k re-reading it… i’m half asleep, i’ll edit it.
Cruise Control:
o.k o.k re-reading it… i’m half asleep, i’ll edit it.
No need to - the point was clearly made.
The authorities have outlawed being paid on total bonus but allowed it on a partial bonus so in effect it has the same possible temptations - unless i’ve read that wrong…
sjb72:
Hi all, am trying to find out if there are any laws/rules on bonus payments and hgv drivers,as firm are trying to change pay structure to mainly collection bonus,obviously to get more done and pay less but i feel will be pushed to max to earn decent wage and probably end up with more infringements.any advice welcome.
Hi sjb72 welcome to the TruckNetUK asylum.
I BELIEVE, but stand to be corrected, that any pay structure that encourages the employee to break the law, and this could be drivers hours or H&S laws, would be frowned on by the relevant official bodies (VOSA, Traffic commisioner). That is not to say that incentives would always be outlawed as there are companies that have strong check processes in place to prevent such missuse. I understand that Lucy has such a pay scheme at her employer though the detail isn’t known to me.
ROG:
The only bonus scheme that would ensure safety is one where the driver gets a bonus for fuel economy
And wouldn’t an accident free scheme also be acceptable? Or an attendance payment for companies with a high level of absenteeism? That could also be in the thinking of sjb72’s boss as these impact on customer deliveries/collection if vehicles are off the road.
Santa:
If they bring it in then study it carefully because, in my experience, they will usually get it wrong so that a canny driver can make a lot more than they expected.
That I woud agree with. At our company we used to have a salary based on “Standard” hours which were the hours planned to do a particuar run. The sharp could make lots of inroads into that planned time an do, for example, 15 hours planned in 10 or 11. On rest days it was common to see folks working for 12-13 and getting 17-18 paid. Some of those inroads were made by using highly questionable/illegal methods, methods not to be repeated on an open forum though likely to be known to anyone with more than a month in the transport industry. Needless to say that has now been stopped and our salary is now paid on attended hours with the expected drop in “productivity” as the incentive now is to maximise the time at work rather than the time working…
Have a search of Lucy’s posts about bonuses and pay schemes, if I remember there are many posts as she is a keen proponent of the system, and they need all the money they can get to rebuild Bertha
ROG:
The only bonus scheme that would ensure safety is one where the driver gets a bonus for fuel economy
Wiretwister:
And wouldn’t an accident free scheme also be acceptable? Or an attendance payment for companies with a high level of absenteeism? That could also be in the thinking of sjb72’s boss as these impact on customer deliveries/collection if vehicles are off the road.
I agree - any scheme that does not have the POTENTIAL of encouraging a driver to do things they would no normally do if paid only by the hour.
Of course, with any sort of bonus scheme, it is ultimately down to the driver in how, if at all, they let it influence them.
I don’t think it matters how you are paid. If you think that drivers who are paid mileage or bonus related are tempted to break the law then you could easily argue that those on an hourly rate would be tempted to work excessively long hours to get the overtime up.
You also can’t argue that those who are paid by the hour will not speed. Not everyone wants to drag the job out simply to get an extra few quid in their pay cheque. That’s why Friday rules were invented. As a VOSA guy once said to me, it’s amazing how many ‘excuses’ written on tachos happen on a Friday. Sure, the law abider may get an extra hours overtime, but the guy with the boot to the headlight or tipping on rest will be home an hour earlier groping the wife. I know what I prefer doing.
maurice:
I don’t think it matters how you are paid. If you think that drivers who are paid mileage or bonus related are tempted to break the law then you could easily argue that those on an hourly rate would be tempted to work excessively long hours to get the overtime up.You also can’t argue that those who are paid by the hour will not speed. Not everyone wants to drag the job out simply to get an extra few quid in their pay cheque. That’s why Friday rules were invented. As a VOSA guy once said to me, it’s amazing how many ‘excuses’ written on tachos happen on a Friday. Sure, the law abider may get an extra hours overtime, but the guy with the boot to the headlight or tipping on rest will be home an hour earlier groping the wife. I know what I prefer doing.
your wife or theirs 
maurice:
I don’t think it matters how you are paid. If you think that drivers who are paid mileage or bonus related are tempted to break the law then you could easily argue that those on an hourly rate would be tempted to work excessively long hours to get the overtime up.You also can’t argue that those who are paid by the hour will not speed. Not everyone wants to drag the job out simply to get an extra few quid in their pay cheque. That’s why Friday rules were invented. As a VOSA guy once said to me, it’s amazing how many ‘excuses’ written on tachos happen on a Friday. Sure, the law abider may get an extra hours overtime, but the guy with the boot to the headlight or tipping on rest will be home an hour earlier groping the wife. I know what I prefer doing.
Hence the reason many Dutch companies wouldn’t pay fines on a Friday
ROG:
ROG:
The only bonus scheme that would ensure safety is one where the driver gets a bonus for fuel economyWiretwister:
And wouldn’t an accident free scheme also be acceptable? Or an attendance payment for companies with a high level of absenteeism? That could also be in the thinking of sjb72’s boss as these impact on customer deliveries/collection if vehicles are off the road.I agree - any scheme that does not have the POTENTIAL of encouraging a driver to do things they would no normally do if paid only by the hour.
Of course, with any sort of bonus scheme, it is ultimately down to the driver in how, if at all, they let it influence them.
Hi ROG,
I’m surprised that you haven’t come up with the answer to the OP’s question yet. 
sjb72:
am trying to find out if there are any laws/rules on bonus payments and hgv drivers …
There IS law about the kind of payments made to drivers and it’s in 561/2006 Article 10 as follows:
Article 10(1)
- A transport undertaking shall not give drivers it employs
or who are put at its disposal any payment, even in the form
of a bonus or wage supplement, related to distances travelled
and/or the amount of goods carried if that payment is of such
a kind as to endanger road safety and/or encourages
infringement of this Regulation.
Article 10(4)
4. Undertakings, consignors, freight forwarders, tour operators,
principal contractors, subcontractors and driver employment
agencies shall ensure that contractually agreed transport
time schedules respect this Regulation.
In Article 10(1) and (4), “this Regulation” means the whole of 561/2006.
So ROG, what’s agreed by a driver and a boss in an employment contract is completely invalid if it infringes any statute law, and an invalid contract cannot be enforced in a court.
Once Article 10 has been complied with, a boss and workers can make whatever agreements they find … err… agreeable. 
encourages infringement of this Regulation.
The interpretation for that is wide open as I noticed that they did not define WHAT would encourage and what would not
ROG:
encourages infringement of this Regulation.
The interpretation for that is wide open as I noticed that they did not define WHAT would encourage and what would not
Hi ROG, Surely you can tell that this means that the boss isn’t allowed to pay a bonus for driving 11 hours without any breaks, or a bonus incentive for only having an hour’s kip in a 24 hour period.
PLEASE tell me that you’re not looking for a fully exhaustive and definitive list of what can or can’t be done??
It doesn’t exist, because there is enough info in Article 10
You only have to read the whole of Article 10, and it’s not that big or complicated.
Once you understand the ‘O’ licencing system, you’ll know that a boss who pays dodgy bonuses won’t last very long if VOSA discover what’s going on, cos that would be reported for consideration of prosecution and the TC would probably close down whatever is left of the firm after any fines are paid.
sjb72:
Hi all, am trying to find out if there are any laws/rules on bonus payments and hgv drivers,as firm are trying to change pay structure to mainly collection bonus,obviously to get more done and pay less but i feel will be pushed to max to earn decent wage and probably end up with more infringements.any advice welcome.
i would like to add to the other posts mate
if your employer pays you these bonuses and takes away wages and states that on you pay slip you still have to be paid the national minimum wage for all hours work done
so for example you currently get paid a say 400 pounds per week and do 55 hours that would be £7.27 per hour ok meets NMW( national minimum wage)
but say you boss cuts your pay to 250 for 55 hours and gives you £15 drop bonus and you do 10 per week that would not be OK as that works out at 4.54 you do not count any bonus payments or night out money to work out you minimum wage
there are extras and must not be counted towards you hourly rate
It’s my experience as a TM and a driver that bonus shemes can be more trouble than they are worth. Rewarding “good” drivers sounds great but, as always, the devil is in the detail.
A local firm here pays part of the wages according to how profitable the truck is - This causes endless arguements about favoured drivers getting the good runs, whether the calculation is honest, etc etc. Another one pays a bonus for not being in and accident. Drivers are in small groups and any one can lose the money for the whole group. My company pay an annual bonus but dont tell us how it is calculated - just based on overall profits they say.
The point has been made that, as with any rules, the crafty will soon work out how to make it work for them; even to the extent of giving the traffic clerk a backhander for the better jobs.
I don’t believe that VOSA will take any interest unless a driver stands up in court and says “I commited this offence because of the bonus scheme.”
I drive an 8 wheel tipper, I get paid a basic wage then a percentage after the truck has earned £200 each day.
Yes it does encourage you to speed hence my 6 points.
I have also driven artics for 7 years for a well known us parcel firm with brown trucks
and there wages didn’t touch what I can earn on the tipper.
If we were paid by the hour there would be a lot of people doing less work in a longer day.
Cheers peeps,think they gonna shaft me by the sounds of it!!! puttin us on minimum wage with a productivity bonus for collections.going on previous earnings wage will be made up of 50-60% bonus.thought i might of found an angle to work on them but not looking good. will have to get a brief to check b4 they force me into something im gonna regret,thanx again for feedback folks. 