As many of you know, this has been one of my pet hates for quite a while.
Since the Lockdown though, is there any sign anywhere that this “worst of both worlds” culture - might finally be coming to an end?
If you want a full time job, then surely you want regular, fixed shifts, regardless of the hourly rate…
If you don’t want to work 40+ hours per week, every week - then you don’t want to work for an agency contractor who’ll insist you work “any five from 7” when you’re only looking to do 2-4 shifts for the same money…
If you want the big bucks, then how come night work rather than early doors - is what appears to be drying up out there first?
Assuming that hourly rates are going to stagnate this coming year, wouldn’t it make sense for firms to be a bit more “hours friendly” in the work shift patterns they offer both their regular full time staff, agency contractors, and casual agency alike?
…Is it possible that “Part Time Driving” might make some kind of comeback again? - Not “You drive 10 hours from a 54 hour week”, but rather “You take a part time job, which is solid driving”…
Post your observations from the yards and regions - the next six months might be more interesting than we think!
Winseer:
As many of you know, this has been one of my pet hates for quite a while.
Since the Lockdown though, is there any sign anywhere that this “worst of both worlds” culture - might finally be coming to an end?
If you want a full time job, then surely you want regular, fixed shifts, regardless of the hourly rate…
If you don’t want to work 40+ hours per week, every week - then you don’t want to work for an agency contractor who’ll insist you work “any five from 7” when you’re only looking to do 2-4 shifts for the same money…
If you want the big bucks, then how come night work rather than early doors - is what appears to be drying up out there first?
Assuming that hourly rates are going to stagnate this coming year, wouldn’t it make sense for firms to be a bit more “hours friendly” in the work shift patterns they offer both their regular full time staff, agency contractors, and casual agency alike?
…Is it possible that “Part Time Driving” might make some kind of comeback again? - Not “You drive 10 hours from a 54 hour week”, but rather “You take a part time job, which is solid driving”…
Post your observations from the yards and regions - the next six months might be more interesting than we think!
It’s clear that the world and his dog now wants part time work.
People are suddenly realising that it’s a short life and two days off per week if you’re lucky doesn’t cut it.
Agianst that employers seem to take a psychopathic view of why employ two or three people sharing a job when one can be made to work 5-6 days per week.
Then we’ve got the problem of those of us who can afford and want to work a few hours per week have to compete for the jobs with others who want the same but can’t afford it when they’ve got it.Then go moaning to the bosses to increase the hours often made up with different usually less attractive duties to add insult to injury.Then they leave and expect us to pick up the zb which they’ve left behind them.
All moot in a job market which is starting to look very much like the early 1980’s which you obviously won’t remember but those of my age will/do.
But even then the bosses hadn’t got round to all the scams to make employees work weekends for standard time which you seem to be describing.
I’ve asked on many occasion to do mon - thurs , 4 days a week , apparently can’t get a tramper to fill the seat for one day a week , though I spoke to a driver who retired & has come back doing 4 days pw tramping , but fri - mon
Been asked about a 4 on 4 off job , done job before but 5 days , but I like my w/ends off so even though I’d love 4 days , I want mon - thurs days & not 4 on / 4 off tramping
Two of the last logistics companies I worked for had any 5 from 7 in contracts, but these were fixed weekly working patterns eg Sun to Thurs 07:00 start. It was the same hourly rate per day, no premium for weekend shifts, same for agency they got the same flat rate.
One large supermarket rdc only takes on full time drivers with shifts that include both Saturday and Sunday as their normal shift pattern with no premium.
In the present climate the race to the bottom will only accelerate.
If that flat rate across weekends is high enough, eg. like at Royal Mail - then it doesn’t matter if you’re “forced” to work weekends, as the regular rate is effectively higher than most other place’s “premium rate” anyway.
Who would want a low flat rate AND be forced to work weekends though?
The same agument applies to “Nights”.
Now I prefer “nights” - but to me, Night shift means starting between 18:30 and 20:00, meaning you can be home by breakfast, having put a good length shift in, 10 hours say.
There’s more and more places where the only “night duty” starts at stupid O’clock like 22:00-23:45 however… It might attract a premium, and even a “right through” rate, but you’re now talking about the leg home being in the morning rush hour - just as you might be getting a bit of the old nodding nogging dog!
There’s no money saved there for the firms, as far as I can see - so WHY do firms insist on such unfriendly shift starts?
I guess the any-5-from-7 if it is 07:00 for that entire week - isn’t so bad an interpretation… BUT firms can legally adjust start times by upto 2 hours per day isn’t it?
WIth a mid-week day off, it can even be a full jet-lagged change from early doors to nights…
If drivers cannot get better wages in this day and age - then can we at least have a little better “Well-Being” please?? Pretty please?
dozy:
I’ve asked on many occasion to do mon - thurs , 4 days a week , apparently can’t get a tramper to fill the seat for one day a week , though I spoke to a driver who retired & has come back doing 4 days pw tramping , but fri - mon
Been asked about a 4 on 4 off job , done job before but 5 days , but I like my w/ends off so even though I’d love 4 days , I want mon - thurs days & not 4 on / 4 off tramping
4 on 4 off does give you a rota of weekends on and off which is a win win of fair all round.Three on 4 off is a good rota too.
true any 5 from 7 work means that you are going to be working 10 days on the trot reasonably regularly. throw in the 1 day off on its own so you dont get a proper rest and you end up burnt out. I think its a way of managing a team of staff so that you have all the staff you need when its busy and dont have too many when its quiet. all the warehouses i have worked in did this and with the extra hour flex at the end of a shift if the work wasn’t completed was a killer.
cooper1203:
true any 5 from 7 work means that you are going to be working 10 days on the trot reasonably regularly. throw in the 1 day off on its own so you dont get a proper rest and you end up burnt out. I think its a way of managing a team of staff so that you have all the staff you need when its busy and dont have too many when its quiet. all the warehouses i have worked in did this and with the extra hour flex at the end of a shift if the work wasn’t completed was a killer.
Indeed. The last thing you want to be doing is 5x12-15 hour shifts on the spin!
I dunno about this “10 shifts in a row” though - is that even legal? Surely you’ve got to put a reduced 25 hour weekly rest in there half way?
cooper1203:
true any 5 from 7 work means that you are going to be working 10 days on the trot reasonably regularly. throw in the 1 day off on its own so you dont get a proper rest and you end up burnt out. I think its a way of managing a team of staff so that you have all the staff you need when its busy and dont have too many when its quiet. all the warehouses i have worked in did this and with the extra hour flex at the end of a shift if the work wasn’t completed was a killer.
Indeed. The last thing you want to be doing is 5x12-15 hour shifts on the spin!
I dunno about this “10 shifts in a row” though - is that even legal? Surely you’ve got to put a reduced 25 hour weekly rest in there half way?
sorry i meant i had done 10 days in a row in a warehouse. not done 5 in any 7 whilst driving i guess thinking about it they couldnt do that as you can only drive a max 6 days in any one block if i remember correctly
we signed a ‘any 5 from 7’ contract 10 years ago…still just work mon-fri every week. if you work o/t Saturday …that’s a 6th shift paid at time and a half
carryfast-yeti:
we signed a ‘any 5 from 7’ contract 10 years ago…still just work mon-fri every week. if you work o/t Saturday …that’s a 6th shift paid at time and a half
Obviously has the all important time premium for working weekends built in.
Also the choice of time off in lieu is good.Like work Sunday get Monday and Tuesday off.
Don’t think that is the actual idea of working ‘any’ 5 from the employers’ point of view.I think it means no premium for weekends in most cases.
I believe the latest fad is six on three off.
Again it’s about covering weekend’s, especially the supermarkets and their suppliers, since the Sunday trading hours changed in the late 90’s.
Sixties boy:
I believe the latest fad is six on three off.
Again it’s about covering weekend’s, especially the supermarkets and their suppliers, since the Sunday trading hours changed in the late 90’s.
Have to question anything more than 3 or 4 on 4 off in an environment in which there are a lot of under/un employed people that need a job and to maintain a work record.
I recently applied for a decent van job and been told my application is one of 472 applicants for it.
Zb 1980 at the start of my working life and this zb at the end of it.
