Agency pay rates

[stevieboy308]

foxy stars:
we all have more than one skill set - most construction workers do — bricklayers that do joinery, plastering, laying concerete etc…

i said this to bonnie lass - you gotta get yourself more skills so that if you’re getting shut out by the prices you’ve already got a spare skill set that’ll pay what it is that you need to keep living.

i drive telehandlers first and foremost but i’ve got a class I in case (1) i want a change (2) in case the work dries out like it did a few years ago — it’s about giving yourself the most opportunities and not just in transport although i know hell of a lot of c/b flt operators that have class I and they staty in the warehouse cos they get as much if not more driving forks - average rates for warehouse forks where i live is just over £7p/h.

i quite agree, i’ve spent all day today driving a telehandler as it happens! for the past 2 years i’ve worked on a farm and whilst not at the start, i’m earning more than my last 2 class 1 jobs, i’m also an experienced chef and a qualified, but limited experience engineer.

but most people will be doing the job that pays them the most out of their options unless they hate / love one, how many people when faced with a “no” as an answer to a pay rise based question will then go and take a pay cut by doing something else?

[winseer]

orys:

Winseer:
A bit suspicious, that he didn’t have his head kicked in, etc. from the ‘attack’,

Well, if someone put me at gunpoint or there would be three well build fans of the american sport that is most popular in Europe with bats, I would not wait to have my head kicked but nicely give up to them, no matter if stuff was main or not, as I value my health more than any material goods. So actually this one is not an argument in my opinion.

You’ve got a high value load. You don’t take liberties going to places where you’re likely to be jumped by three of ANYONE.
I’ve read in the “agency packs” they give you at more than one firm that “if threatened, then just hand it over”. WTF?
I’ve never agreed with this policy, because it encourages inside jobs in my opnion.
If you can just say to the boss on arrival at destination “Sorry bud, my lorry got highjacked, the curtain is slightly torn, my face hasn’t been kicked in, but otherwise everything is just peachy, albeit minus my £480k load” then offers are going to be made at the home addresses of drivers with such known high value loads by organised crime MORE often, rather than less often. Ultimately, the firm realises that this driver appears to be “jinxed” at best, “inside jobber” at worst, and you’ll end up either losing your job, or being jailed, or left as a corpse in some ditch somewhere when the “other firm” realises you are no longer of any use to them in future.
People will murder you for a lot less than £480k in this example, especially if they are from impoverished, anglophobe, and/or war-torn countries to start with.
Yes, this includes Scotland and the Irish Republic - he says, donning the tin hat.

Are you going to go to the police every time you’re threatened? The criminals simply won’t turn up, and you’ll have cried wolf already once to often for the authorities to take you seriously the NEXT time someone makes you an offer you cannot refuse…

Maybe there’s a world of drivers out there that would call a gangster’s proberbial “all in” with high card jack

• but I’m not ever going to be one of them. I’d rather just avoid being put in a compromised situation in the first place, and excercise my “discretionary route” to the max, so no one knows where I’m going to be at any appointed time, except at final desintation around the time contracted for.
  I happen to like being in communicado whilst in transit.

[orys]

Winseer:
You’ve got a high value load. You don’t take liberties going to places where you’re likely to be jumped by three of ANYONE.

Exactly. And yet if they decide to approach me in place like fuel station etc, with all this CCTV cameras etc. that means that they are ready for everything.

I’ve read in the “agency packs” they give you at more than one firm that “if threatened, then just hand it over”. WTF?

It means, that you are required to do a job of driver. You are not expected to Bruce Willis’ style actions.

I’ve never agreed with this policy, because it encourages inside jobs in my opnion.

For all I care, it might encouraging ■■■■■■ a pope. I am not willing to give my health or live for that “if statistically all robbery victim will do the same, then the statistically speaking the load will be slightly safer”. And from two evil, I prefer loads to be stolen by insiders than by shooting innocent people for example.

If you can just say to the boss on arrival at destination “Sorry bud, my lorry got highjacked, the curtain is slightly torn, my face hasn’t been kicked in, but otherwise everything is just peachy, albeit minus my £480k load”

You cannot. Your job was to deliver THE LOAD. If the load was stolen, you can’t do your job any more, so you have to call the guys who’s job is to look into that things. They are called “the police”.

then offers are going to be made at the home addresses of drivers with such known high value loads by organised crime MORE often, rather than less often. Ultimately, the firm realises that this driver appears to be “jinxed” at best, “inside jobber” at worst, and you’ll end up either losing your job, or being jailed, or left as a corpse in some ditch somewhere when the “other firm” realises you are no longer of any use to them in future.

Well, there is one option you seem to be missing: you DON’T get involved with the “other firm”, and just do the job you are expected to do properly. Then you are not going to be shoot by the “other firm” either by getting involved with them, or by trying to fight with them. Simples.

People will murder you for a lot less than £480k in this example, especially if they are from impoverished, anglophobe, and/or war-torn countries to start with.

If they murdering people because they are ANGLOPHOBES, then I should be safe

Are you going to go to the police every time you’re threatened? The criminals simply won’t turn up, and you’ll have cried wolf already once to often for the authorities to take you seriously the NEXT time someone makes you an offer you cannot refuse…

If it would be serious, yes I would.

I’d rather just avoid being put in a compromised situation in the first place, and excercise my “discretionary route” to the max, so no one knows where I’m going to be at any appointed time, except at final desintation around the time contracted for.

That’s my tactic as well.

[atjt]

Agencies are making between £0.90 and £1.20 ph after holiday pay and NI.

If they made more in the past as was stated before (which I truly doubt at those figures) believe me they aren’t making it now.

[winseer]

orys:

Winseer:
You’ve got a high value load. You don’t take liberties going to places where you’re likely to be jumped by three of ANYONE.

Exactly. And yet if they decide to approach me in place like fuel station etc, with all this CCTV cameras etc. that means that they are ready for everything.

Why are you stopping at a fuel station? - Security breach. If you’ve got a high value load, you’ve already got it fully fueled. If your load is over the top range of the vehicle, then you’re crossing borders, and in that case the risk factor alas goes with the job. There’s no need to introduce this extra risk element UNLESS this is the case however.

I’ve read in the “agency packs” they give you at more than one firm that “if threatened, then just hand it over”. WTF?

It means, that you are required to do a job of driver. You are not expected to Bruce Willis’ style actions.
I’m not talking about action stuff, just avoiding everyone because you don’t trust anyone at all out on the road.

I’ve never agreed with this policy, because it encourages inside jobs in my opnion.

If a driver is not punished for a serious breach of security, they’ll be left to breach it more often.

For all I care, it might encouraging ■■■■■■ a pope. I am not willing to give my health or live for that “if statistically all robbery victim will do the same, then the statistically speaking the load will be slightly safer”. And from two evil, I prefer loads to be stolen by insiders than by shooting innocent people for example.
I agree, £240k doesn’t make much difference to £480k, the same as one bullet in the back of the head in a ditch doesn’t make much difference than two.

If you can just say to the boss on arrival at destination “Sorry bud, my lorry got highjacked, the curtain is slightly torn, my face hasn’t been kicked in, but otherwise everything is just peachy, albeit minus my £480k load”

You cannot. Your job was to deliver THE LOAD. If the load was stolen, you can’t do your job any more, so you have to call the guys who’s job is to look into that things. They are called “the police”.
The first thing the police will do is consider the aspect of an insider job, and arrest the driver - If the losing firm gives them the goahead.
Having a victim of violence present is more likely to bring the police in on the side of the driver, but that “victim” driver might be seriously wounded or dead, so when is the driver actually going to be better off here?

then offers are going to be made at the home addresses of drivers with such known high value loads by organised crime MORE often, rather than less often. Ultimately, the firm realises that this driver appears to be “jinxed” at best, “inside jobber” at worst, and you’ll end up either losing your job, or being jailed, or left as a corpse in some ditch somewhere when the “other firm” realises you are no longer of any use to them in future.

Well, there is one option you seem to be missing: you DON’T get involved with the “other firm”, and just do the job you are expected to do properly. Then you are not going to be shoot by the “other firm” either by getting involved with them, or by trying to fight with them. Simples.
You didn’t ask to get involved with anyone. Word got out that you are carrying a high value load, and criminal elements approach you at home, because of lax personal data security at the workplace that allowed the villans to so easily track the driver of the particular vehicle down.

People will murder you for a lot less than £480k in this example, especially if they are from impoverished, anglophobe, and/or war-torn countries to start with.

If they murdering people because they are ANGLOPHOBES, then I should be safe
Everyone over here fiddling the system is an anglophobe. They hate us brits, and laugh at us over every fiddle they get away with over us.
Top of the shop in the “Anglophobe” department, is the “Brudder” of course. Don’t pay tax, Claim full benefits, steal from every decent tax paying brit they meet given the chance.
I’m not a xenophobe. I’m a malaphobe.

Are you going to go to the police every time you’re threatened? The criminals simply won’t turn up, and you’ll have cried wolf already once to often for the authorities to take you seriously the NEXT time someone makes you an offer you cannot refuse…

If it would be serious, yes I would.

I’d rather just avoid being put in a compromised situation in the first place, and excercise my “discretionary route” to the max, so no one knows where I’m going to be at any appointed time, except at final desintation around the time contracted for.

That’s my tactic as well.

[orys]

Winseer:
Why are you stopping at a fuel station? - Security breach. If you’ve got a high value load, you’ve already got it fully fueled. If your load is over the top range of the vehicle, then you’re crossing borders, and in that case the risk factor alas goes with the job. There’s no need to introduce this extra risk element UNLESS this is the case however.

Because I am driving sprinter van, and it does not have 1600 l tanks? And I do it for really long distances?

I agree, £240k doesn’t make much difference to £480k, the same as one bullet in the back of the head in a ditch doesn’t make much difference than two.

That’s why you are doing everything to avoid even that one bullet. Fighting with the armed robbers is not the best way to do so.

The first thing the police will do is consider the aspect of an insider job, and arrest the driver - If the losing firm gives them the goahead.
Having a victim of violence present is more likely to bring the police in on the side of the driver, but that “victim” driver might be seriously wounded or dead, so when is the driver actually going to be better off here?

I prefer to be suspected to be an insider and then released when they find that I have nothing to do than shot on the spot by bandits.

You didn’t ask to get involved with anyone. Word got out that you are carrying a high value load, and criminal elements approach you at home, because of lax personal data security at the workplace that allowed the villans to so easily track the driver of the particular vehicle down.

Luckily for me, I don’t have high value load at home, so they have no point to shoot me. And after such a visit it’s obvious for me that the plans have to be changed.

[winseer]

And no one thinks there isn’t a serious difference between decent British culture that’s going out the door, and all this incoming culture that can only encourage more transport crime in the long run?

Once again, insurers paying out no quibble has a lot to answer for here.
If firms told drivers “Get highjacked, and you’re sacked pending an investigation” and the number of “highjacks” would drop quite a few percent before going any further!

I don’t agree with all this lapsadaisical attitude towards load and personal security. From the company viewpoint, if they stood to go under as a result of the shrinkage, they might take their load security a bit more seriously themselves, but small outfits don’t seem to care for some reason - maybe insurance-related again.

Clean the streets. Tax Caravans.

[orys]

Winseer:
And no one thinks there isn’t a serious difference between decent British culture that’s going out the door, and all this incoming culture that can only encourage more transport crime in the long run?

Actually, as I read media from both countries, there is much more cases of people who stand up against the robbers in Poland than here. And you know what? It usually ends badly for them (surprise, surprise!). (To anti-Polish brigade: look, I am actually saying that Poles are stupid more often than Britons in that matter )

I tell you the story. I used to have a friend who was living in very bad area of the town when I was in high school. There were gangs fighting there, robbing people etc. Once we were approached and asked to give up our money and mobile phones. I had no mobile back then, but he had a Nokia 3210 and I lost something like 20 pounds now - an equivalent of like 5-7 beers in the pub. Then we were let go.

Next time he was approached with my another friend. Other friend gave up his mobile, but he this time refused and stood agains five guys with (as it turned out) a machete.

Now he barely can use any mobile phone, as he lost three fingers on his right hand and the nerve on his left hand was damaged so he can barely move his fingers on the left hand. He also now has something similar to Glasgow smile. He used to play bass in a band. They needed new bassist after that, so they got a new guy and made some success, issued an album and were living of it for few years. But this friend of mine became alcoholic.

Apart from that my other friend, who was with him that night and was not willing to enter any confrontation was badly beaten as well, but for him it ended just on broken nose, brain shock and lost few teeths.

There is a saying in Poland: If you are not stupid, you learn from your own mistakes. But if you are wise, you learn from other people’s mistakes. I learned my lesson back there. You be hero, if you wish, I just hope to do not be on the same wagon with you when it happens.

If firms told drivers “Get highjacked, and you’re sacked pending an investigation” and the number of “highjacks” would drop quite a few percent before going any further!

If firm told me “get hijacked, and you are sacked” I would told them to shovel their job offer in their arses, just as I would do to the company who tell me “got stuck in traffic, and you are sacked” or “if your van breaks down, you are sacked” or “if you had an accident, you are sacked”.

I of course have nothing against sacking drivers who were part of the hijacking gang, who deliberately got late to their delivery, who damage their vans because they can’t drive, or who made something stupid that ended in bad accident, but I won’t work for the company who wants to blame for things I have no control over.

I don’t agree with all this lapsadaisical attitude towards load and personal security. From the company viewpoint, if they stood to go under as a result of the shrinkage, they might take their load security a bit more seriously themselves, but small outfits don’t seem to care for some reason - maybe insurance-related again.

Propably. If I will be injured while defending their load and become crippled for example, they will have to pay me a lot of money, very likely much more than your 480 000 pounds. So propably it’s much cheaper for them just to let the load go and keep driver safe.

[winseer]

I’m not advocating “having a go” and trying to be a hero without arms, and rights in law to use deadly force in this country to defend ourselves. Harm a crook, and you’ll probably be put in jail yourself, but if they harm you, the case will not be pressed too hard once it’s found out that anglophobes are to blame.

This rather scary prospect of “no support at all” means I am not going to risk my person by having anything to do with people or places that I consider in my best judgement to be dodgy.

I’ve refused to do trailer swaps in known high crime areas in the past. This isn’t considered unreasonable, so myself and the other driver just shift the swap location to somewhere mutually more suitable.

Prevention is better than cure is what I’m saying.
I’ve never been mugged, although I have been ripped off a few times on “caveat emptor” cons over the years.
The worst violence done to me was being pulled off my pushbike when I was still at school, and I’ve still never had reason to go to places like Glasgow for any reason whatsoever.

I expect risk premium to be payable when I perceive higher risk. Of course, most think I’m just daft, and can be ignored. I in turn ignore them.
Years on, I’m still alive, have a clean licence, have never been mugged whereas many who’ve laughed me down over the years have come croppers one way or another which brings little comfort for the years of “Cassandra’s Curse” that I’ve had to live with.

Life changing injuries do NOT get you 6 figure payouts in this country, unless you are already rich and famous.
The multi-million payouts one hears of are rare, and involve victims who are down to the level of dribbling in a wheelchair, braindamaged or paralyzed from the neck down.

Lose a limb, eye, or get scarred for life - you’ll be lucky to get a year’s pay by way of compensation - and even that after a long long wait in what should be an open and shut case…

[orys]

Winseer:
I’m not advocating “having a go” and trying to be a hero without arms

That’s all right then.

This rather scary prospect of “no support at all” means I am not going to risk my person by having anything to do with people or places that I consider in my best judgement to be dodgy.

My tactic as well.

Prevention is better than cure is what I’m saying.

We agree on that as well.

Life changing injuries do NOT get you 6 figure payouts in this country, unless you are already rich and famous.
The multi-million payouts one hears of are rare, and involve victims who are down to the level of dribbling in a wheelchair, braindamaged or paralyzed from the neck down.

Lose a limb, eye, or get scarred for life - you’ll be lucky to get a year’s pay by way of compensation - and even that after a long long wait in what should be an open and shut case…

That’s another argument of not sticking out against the criminals then.

[big_truck]

selby newcomer:
Say an agency pays £9 p/h, what would they be charging a client roughly??

Phone them up and ASK for a quote to supply a claas1 driver for holiday cover for a week or two, they won’t bite
I did similar a while ago and it was approx £2/hour more than I was getting paid by agency, you can also bet your arse that the likes of the big agency users like Stobbies/Supermarkets etc have screwed them down even more on their % mark up rate.