Just tried to get a few days off as have to take eye drops after Optician found severe eye strain and hence not allowed to drive this weekend.
I am told I have lost it all as the recalculation date was the 4th August (anniversary of agency contract start date). Also been told as it is in the drivers handbook there is no appeal and that from ACAS. Great lot of help they have been to me in the past as well.
ADR have refused to carry over which I believe is allowed under certain circumstances.
Anyone any suggestions? Any agency driver remember the exact start date they started for their particular agency?
Being registered with financial agency, plus 3 electrical agencies as well, I have no idea of those dates either.
Seems no protection at all for the employee. After all, ADR insisted we signed these contracts or no work.
cherkhan:
Any agency driver remember the exact start date they started for their particular agency?
Being registered with financial agency, plus 3 electrical agencies as well, I have no idea of those dates either.
The dates are usually written on those contracts you signed when you joined the agency.
Oh hang on, I forgot … No one ever reads them, or keeps them
cherkhan:
Seems no protection at all for the employee. After all, ADR insisted we signed these contracts or no work.
Your not an employee when you work for an agency, your just a casual worker on a zero hours contract.
So there is no “protection” as you put it. Nor is there any obligation for the agency to find you work, or for you to have you arm twisted into accepting any job placement
I’m not 100% myself in all honesty but given you’re not sure when you registered, if it has been over a year and you haven’t claimed it then yeah, not a lot you can do. Ultimately it’s not really the agency’s responsibility, nor in their favour to be like “Hey cherkan, take two weeks off, we’ll make sure you’re paid your holiday!”. Whether that’s morally right or not is down to you, but ultimately if I don’t take my annual leave, I lose it. Situation is no different.
Are you paid through an umbrella, or PAYE? {ensue umbrella-bashing}
Appealed it through my agency office (Bristol), honoured the 2 days I requested so all good. Appears it is at the discretion of the particular office to pay.
I have though, set my computer to give me a ‘nudge’ 45 days before end of year now.
Regards full time employment, as I have worked for some large companies (electrical such as Bae, BT etc) each company always advised of holiday time left before it was too late. Also smaller companies (again not haulage) always offered notice.
Agencies I have used for financial and electrical positions also honoured all holiday pay and advised when end of year was approaching.
Seems just haulage that are a little ‘iffy’.
Still, after a near smash on M5 yesterday on the Wales lane (driving for Morrisons) - (it was close-just managed to pull the unit away from the barrier and bridge stanchion avoiding 2 women in their car that suddenly turned to me lane from stationary traffic), I am considering giving up my artic license. It isn’t worth dying for. Then there was the Tesco driver jct 24 M4 that changed lanes to my lane 10 feet in front of me and not forgetting that idiot that turned 90 degrees across the motorway Jct 18 (M48m junction) (Avonmouth/SouthWest) from the hard shoulder to get the the Avonmouth lane. Nearly had a car buried in my trailer there.
It has nothing to do with the date you start and everything to do with what the holiday year is of the agency.
For example:
Agency holiday pay year runs Jan 1st to Dec 31st.
You start work for the agency on 4th August 2012. If you don’t use up your holidays from August to December by Dec 31st you lose them as you cannot carry them over to the following year however if you then don’t go on to take any holiday from 1st January 2013 to September you don’t lose the holiday pay from 1st Jan to 4th August as its in the same holiday pay year.
Pierre, you’re wrong. Agency workers on zero hours have the same protection as fulltime workers. The problem isn’t the law but people like you spreading ■■■■■■■■ so people believe they don’t have rights.
I don’t understand why “not working” some days (for which you don’t get paid for by an agency anyway?) means you lose your “holiday pay” which they don’t actually pay you, because it’s made up by a deduction from your wages, and put into a pot - at least it was when I applied to ADR myself…
If you HAVE paid wages into a holiday pot, then it’s theft if they then say you’re “not entitled to it”.
If you have been “punished for throwing a sickie” - WTF? You don’t get sick pay, so are they refusing to let you have 2 days off paid out of your holiday pot containing your own money?
Either way, contract or no, it looks as if someone has got their hand up your skirt doesn’t it?
Winseer:
I don’t understand why “not working” some days (for which you don’t get paid for by an agency anyway?) means you lose your “holiday pay” which they don’t actually pay you, because it’s made up by a deduction from your wages, and put into a pot - at least it was when I applied to ADR myself…
If you HAVE paid wages into a holiday pot, then it’s theft if they then say you’re “not entitled to it”.
If you have been “punished for throwing a sickie” - WTF? You don’t get sick pay, so are they refusing to let you have 2 days off paid out of your holiday pot containing your own money?
Either way, contract or no, it looks as if someone has got their hand up your skirt doesn’t it?
cherkhan:
Just tried to get a few days off as have to take eye drops after Optician found severe eye strain and hence not allowed to drive this weekend.
I am told I have lost it all as the recalculation date was the 4th August (anniversary of agency contract start date). Also been told as it is in the drivers handbook there is no appeal and that from ACAS. Great lot of help they have been to me in the past as well.
ADR have refused to carry over which I believe is allowed under certain circumstances.
Anyone any suggestions? Any agency driver remember the exact start date they started for their particular agency?
Being registered with financial agency, plus 3 electrical agencies as well, I have no idea of those dates either.
Seems no protection at all for the employee. After all, ADR insisted we signed these contracts or no work.
I sympathise but as I have said before DON’T USED AGENCIES ! all they do is rip off drivers and take everything they can, giving nothing in return, sooner you all black them and put them out of business the better.
Winseer:
If you HAVE paid wages into a holiday pot, then it’s theft if they
then say you’re “not entitled to it”.
.
.
It’s actually written into employment law that paid holidays cannot be
carried over from one holiday year to another, either by the employee
or the employer. * * * (SEE BELOW)
The idea of this is to protect the employee so that they are “properly rested.”
The holiday year can be anytime chosen by the employer and notified to the
employee. The onus is then on the employee to know when the holiday year is.
One escape route is to terminate your employment on “Holiday Year’s Eve” and
then you are entitled to cash in lieu.
Someone on PAYE working five or more days per week is entitled to 28
days paid holiday. In certain circumstances the eight days MAY be carried over to
the next holiday year but this is a very complex area and even ACAS advise that
independent legal advice be sought.
.
.
Pat Hasler:
Seems no protection at all for the employee. After all, ADR insisted we signed these contracts or no work.
I sympathise but as I have said before DON’T USED AGENCIES ! all they do is rip off drivers and take everything they can, giving nothing in return, sooner you all black them and put them out of business the better.
[/quote]
I had no problems using agencies for over a decade. I gained a vast range of experience in a short amount of time. Never once had any problem getting holiday pay.
And given the nature of business in the UK in the 21st century, agencies aren’t going away.
Winseer:
I don’t understand why “not working” some days (for which you don’t get paid for by an agency anyway?) means you lose your “holiday pay” which they don’t actually pay you, because it’s made up by a deduction from your wages, and put into a pot - at least it was when I applied to ADR myself…
If you HAVE paid wages into a holiday pot, then it’s theft if they then say you’re “not entitled to it”.
If you have been “punished for throwing a sickie” - WTF? You don’t get sick pay, so are they refusing to let you have 2 days off paid out of your holiday pot containing your own money?
Either way, contract or no, it looks as if someone has got their hand up your skirt doesn’t it?
You seem to be confusing S/E, Umbrella and PAYE
I didn’t do any work there, because of the pressure to NOT be PAYE, which I was insisting upon. I asked about how the holiday pay system worked, and basically I was told that as a SE contractor, “you won’t get any, but we deduct 6% of your gross pay as SE/Ltd/Umbrella and pay it into a pot”. This means the pot contains your money, regardless of whatever other contractual conditions you are on. “I must let the firm steal my wages” is probably not a clause in any contract that will stand up in court I’m reckoning…
I.e. the defence “Our driver agreed on a signed contract to forfeit the money paid into their holiday pot, if and when it suited us to take it for any number of a variety of reasons, representing their breach of contract with us”.
I said I want £15ph minimum (2011) to sign up to any deals like that, or alternatively the lower rates (£8.33-£14.00 range given me) can be applied to myself as PAYE… Of course I was told “The rates are the rates”, so I ended up walking away, and also turning down the so-called “£50 bonus for attending a shift in Harlow” a little while later, when I asked for that in an email confirm… Bent practices all, so I’m guessing I won’t be darkening their door again. I’ve since heard that not all of adr’s outlets are like that, but down here it’s all push push push for the high-overhead stuff on minimal pay. I was also under pressure to take a 12 hour contract with no definition of WHAT those twelve hours would be… So there’s me after nights and weekends, and likely to get given 2x6 hour shifts Tuesday & Wednesday 8am starts thus qualifying for the bottom-end £8.33 rate, and causing me the maximum commute overhead to boot, and disqualifying me from even doing the school run at both ends! No f-in thanks! I want to work the hours that are good for me for as much as I can get, not the exact opposite, with the £14ph stuff only going to the hallowed few that have put in 40 hours of that crap, and then get offered it on overtime. Most people I’ve met that like Monday-Friday breakfast time starts don’t LIKE doing “overtime” or “weekends” anyway, so that’s already known to me as a reason for not just offering the hours to those that want them, rather than trying to palm everyone off with crap all the time.
Client firms that want ONLY contractor drivers might like to use this agency, but it’ll get crushed in the next economic upturn - unless it manages to con a large enough pool of drivers on an ongoing basis… Who’s coming up to fill the ranks required there do you think? I don’t imagine too many drivers rushing to sign up with them right now whilst the downturn is still in progress, let alone when it comes to an end!
“Too big to fail” is “Too big”.
If there is any agency out there that represents the stereotype that so many drivers here have of agencies - Agency Drivers Network has to be it.
There’s even some obscurity over this firm being referred to as “Adr” rather than ADN which might be what you expect in an honest world.
I was also under pressure to take a 12 hour contract with no definition of WHAT those twelve hours would be… So there’s me after nights and weekends, and likely to get given 2x6 hour shifts Tuesday & Wednesday 8am starts thus qualifying for the bottom-end £8.33 rate, and causing me the maximum commute overhead to boot, and disqualifying me from even doing the school run at both ends! No f-in thanks! 