if working for a agency are they responsable for asking you for taco’s or is it down to the person you have been sent to .
my inital thinking is that if a company gets investigated by vosa and there is missing mileage with no taco’s to prove who was the driver.
i no most of the big companys download your digi and take photocopy of your taco .
thanks
I’ve been wondering this - and I’ve been with agencies for over a year now!
I’m sure someone can give a more accurate answer than I can.
Only one of the companies I’ve been to seems to care but I think it’s down to the driver - send it to either the agency or client after 28 days but you’d probably be better off holding on to them and giving them to the client next time you’re there (that’s what I do) if you’re pretty sure you’ll be there again.
Hope someone gives you a better answer though, I’d like to know the best thing to do too…
The tachos must go to the company you did the shift with. Typically with an agency you send the tachos to them who pass them onto the company.
Only good thing about digi tachos no more having to do that, saves me having to post them.
If i can get away with it, i’d rather give them direct to the company i worked for, but depends what kinda work you are doing, with some agencies i’m in different places all the time, so its not practicle for me to try to give them all back directly to the company so saves hassle giving them to the agency.
In law the driver is responsible for handing the tacho charts to the vehicle’s operator within the specified time period (42 days at the present time).
In practice the majority of agency workers seem to hand them in via the agency. In this case if the agency manage to lose them I would guess that technically the driver would be in the ■■■ as they are responsible for ensuring the operator gets them.
Paul
psv8:
if working for a agency are they responsable for asking you for taco’s or is it down to the person you have been sent to .my inital thinking is that if a company gets investigated by vosa and there is missing mileage with no taco’s to prove who was the driver.
i no most of the big companys download your digi and take photocopy of your taco .
thanks
I’ve always gone by the rule that the driver keeps the charts and then hands them over to the employment agency.It’s then the firm’s responsibility to get the records back from the agency for filing.It’s a similar situation with maintenance records when an outside contractor does the firm’s maintenance instead of the firm’s own workshops.But I don’t know anything about digi tachos because have’nt used one yet.Rog should be able to give an answer?.
well to be honest neither of asked me for such things and i no the agency is a load of toss and dont no there arse from there elbow .
juust getting bit of amo for when give them a visit for been tw@ts 
Carryfast:
Rog should be able to give an answer?.
Not his time - I cannot find the relevant law on this - I would suggest that coffeeholic might be able to help 
I am sure its been covered before, its the drivers responsability to give it to the operator.
If the agency loose the cards your still liable.
Carryfast:
I’ve always gone by the rule that the driver keeps the charts and then hands them over to the employment agency.It’s then the firm’s responsibility to get the records back from the agency for filing.
That must be one of those MMTM rules cos the actual legislation says nothing of the sort…
The legislation is quite clear. It is the driver’s responsibility to hand the charts to the vehicle’s operator. If the operator doesn’t receive them, the driver is liable, and “the agency lost them” is unlikely to be accepted as a valid excuse.
Paul
but said company could lose them to cover exses mileage even when given to them which i think may turn out to be the case .
i asked the company if they wanted a photo copy and they said they didnt need any but there also known to be flexible with driving hrs so probaly makes drivers a escape goat
A digital card must be downloaded every 28 days, drivers records must be kept by the operator, that is, the bloke who holds the operators licence, not Tamsin, Willow or Dominique at the recruitment company
i try to give mine to the company directly 
Argos want me to give them to the agency 
related
Argos now download digi card even when you use analogue
but only post shift
repton:
Carryfast:
I’ve always gone by the rule that the driver keeps the charts and then hands them over to the employment agency.It’s then the firm’s responsibility to get the records back from the agency for filing.That must be one of those MMTM rules cos the actual legislation says nothing of the sort…
The legislation is quite clear. It is the driver’s responsibility to hand the charts to the vehicle’s operator. If the operator doesn’t receive them, the driver is liable, and “the agency lost them” is unlikely to be accepted as a valid excuse.Paul
So the driver works for a different operator each day and then has to go round every day handing each chart in to each and every different operator at the end of each chart’s retention period.Yeah right.So when does he get any work done?.
In the event of “a visit” especially after a silent check, although they do not call it that now.
VOSA ask for the cards for ABC124D for April. If the company have to start ringing round 17 agencies and casual drivers, it will turn into much more than “a visit”
Carryfast:
repton:
Carryfast:
I’ve always gone by the rule that the driver keeps the charts and then hands them over to the employment agency.It’s then the firm’s responsibility to get the records back from the agency for filing.That must be one of those MMTM rules cos the actual legislation says nothing of the sort…
The legislation is quite clear. It is the driver’s responsibility to hand the charts to the vehicle’s operator. If the operator doesn’t receive them, the driver is liable, and “the agency lost them” is unlikely to be accepted as a valid excuse.Paul
So the driver works for a different operator each day and then has to go round every day handing each chart in to each and every different operator at the end of each chart’s retention period.Yeah right.So when does he get any work done?.
its one of these things where the right thing to do and the actual thing that happens is two different things. Your right when i worked for various different companies day in day out, some companies maybe only visit once every few months there is no chance i’m going to go round visit them all.
Same with agencies even though techincally you shouldnt give them the tachographs, you won’t be with the agency for very long if you refuse to hand them over.
Guess it comes down to a good faith thing where you hope the agency does return the tachographs. If i can get away with it i will give them directly to the company ive been working for.
Ive no idea how ■■■■ the courts or VOSA would be over this issue since they must know its common practise for agencies to take the tachographs off the driver, say the agency caught fire and a months worth of tachographs vanish for say 40 drivers, i doubt whether in reality VOSA would go after every single driver over it.
in the (analogue) past, the agy driver returned their tachos to the agency, then the agency forwarded the tachos along with the relivant invoice for the work, for payment by the haulier. This completed the cycle.
any tachos missing or lost in the post used to be covered by an excuse me note explaining the problem, this was kept on file by the haulier always offer the transport office the chance to photocopy your anologue tacho at the end of your shift so they can cross check your hours etc, so that any equiries between the agency & haulier abour your hours can be resolved, & ensuring you get paid on time. Nower days depending upon the agency, analogue tachos are returned *DIRECT* to the haulier within the required time scale. with digital tachos, most agencys DONT have either a card reader or the relivant software to download your card at their office, and dont care about whats on your digi card. but some agencies (driverhire etc) do ask you to forward a copy of your digi print **always ask your agency what their policy is regarding returning tachos when you sign on** if in doubt ask!
different agencies have different policies about tacho`s
I`d always take at least 1 print off of the digi tacho before I eject the card,in case the agy wants a copy, & 1 spare which I staple to my timesheet, AND I always take a final copy of the print off when prompted and stick that into a (day to a page) diary which I write down my trip details, start/finish - times, mileage. run times, time in/out of drops etc etc.
If I keep a copy of my digi print every time I drive, in case of either dispute over my hours/pay, or and fines/infringements that may arise
Wheel Nut:
In the event of “a visit” especially after a silent check, although they do not call it that now.VOSA ask for the cards for ABC124D for April. If the company have to start ringing round 17 agencies and casual drivers, it will turn into much more than “a visit”
Can’t see the connection with those casual drivers and 17 agencies and the operator not having any cards in his possession which should be at the time of the visit.If the operator can’t come up with any relevant records which should be in his files then it’s the operator who’s in the brown stuff assuming that the driver can show that he’s handed them in to the operator’s contractual agent?.Which is why as an employed driver it’s best to keep hold of photocopies of charts and get a signed receipt for charts handed over to the employer.So what’s the difference between handing the charts into the relevant company employee/driver supervisor if the driver is directly employed by the operator or the operator’s agent in the case of an agency supervisor assuming that those charts went missing between that driver handing them in and when vosa come calling?.But as for digi tacho records that’s a totally different story.So exactly how and when do agency drivers get them downloaded to all of the different operators that they’ve worked for in the case of agency employment.But it’s possible that vosa could find itself having to chase up multiple casual/agency drivers for records still legally held by those drivers within the driver retention period.It seems to me that everyone’s getting mixed up between an employed driver’s responsibilities in keeping and then giving records to his employer and an owner driver’s responsibilities when keeping and filing his records?.
The Transport Act 1968 as modified by Statutory Instrument 2008/198 the catchily titled; The Passenger and Goods Vehicles (Recording Equipment)(Downloading and Retention of Data) Regulations 2008, makes it the drivers responsibility to return tachograph charts, printouts (where they were a legal requirement) and manual records to the Transport Undertaking (Operator) under whose orders they were driving the vehicle. There is nothing in the legislation about returning charts etc via the agency you’re working for, although in reality, we all know that is the usual way it happens.
It is also the Transport Undertakings’ responsibility to ensure that they download the data from a drivers’ digital tachograph card no later than 28 days after the day in question. Many operators download their permanent drivers cards on a weekly basis, however, they seem to have problems remembering to do agency drivers cards. If you’re with a particular operator for a prolonged period, then the card usually gets downloaded each week. However, agency drivers are often only with a particular operator for a single or a couple of shifts. The wording of the Statutory Instrument covers this by saying that a driver card must be downloaded immediately when a driver ceases to be employed as a driver by an operator. Generally this means at the end of the shift for the agency driver, so that is when the card must be downloaded by the operator. Have advised loads of companies about this, some listen some don’t, guess which ones will be prosecuted when they cannot produce the data? There are two possible charges; fail to download data within the required time period and fail to produce data when required.
With regard to operators failing to produce tacho charts and downloaded data. The request is made in written form and a time to produce, usually in the order of 10 days is given. You just word the letter so that the production period does not include any records that drivers may legally have with them i.e. if I wanted charts upto 1st November 2009 I wouldn’t send the letter until at least 14th December, that way all charts should already be back with the operator.
With owner drivers the situation is broadly the same, although there is nothing to stop an O/D keeping all the records in the vehicle cab, if that is his / her place of work. However, O/D’s are also responsible for ensuring they download the VU as well as their driver cards, just like any other operator. Keeping records in the vehicle is fraught with danger, saying that that the cab was broken into just before the ‘producer letter’ arrives is usually treated with some suspicion by Traffic Examiners, Magistrates and Traffic Commissioners.
geebee45:
…makes it the drivers responsibility to return tachograph charts, printouts (where they were a legal requirement) and manual records to the Transport Undertaking (Operator) under whose orders they were driving the vehicle. There is nothing in the legislation about returning charts etc via the agency you’re working for, although in reality, we all know that is the usual way it happens.
If the driver does hand charts to the agency and they get lost, who is liable and what could the driver expect as punishment ?
geebee45:
Keeping records in the vehicle is fraught with danger, saying that that the cab was broken into just before the ‘producer letter’ arrives is usually treated with some suspicion by Traffic Examiners, Magistrates and Traffic Commissioners.
Does that suspicion stretch to unruly dogs and frequent traffic office fires too?