Can anyone help me with a query I have,with regards my neighbour. He is self employed and has a Renault traffic master pick up,he sells gases to pubs and restaruants. The type of gases he carries is class 2 compressed and inflammable however most of the gases are cellar and balloon.
My problem is that he keeps the van on the road outside his house which is opposite my side window at night loaded with these gases,even though he has got a yard to keep it in overnight,but does not want to waste petrol by using his car to get to and from yard so keeps his van at house.
He also keeps some of these bottles in his garage at home and round the back of his house,his van does not display any orange plates front or rear and he says that he does not need to,the size of the bottles vary from small dumpy ones to large tall ones.
Is he in breach of any Dangerous goods law,I think he must be but just cant find out what,any help would be appreciated.
I’m sorry to hear of your concerns, but there are two different areas of law at work in this situation.
As far as parking a vehicle loaded with gases, storing the gases in a garage or around the back of the house are concerned, those are outside my remit, so I’d advise that a call to your local council might get you the info you need.
What I can tell you for sure is that gases in cylinders are definately dangerous goods when carried by vehicles on the roads. However, from your description, I’d say it’s not likely that your neighbour will need an ADR licence or orange boards.
In order to give you an accurate answer, I will need a bit more info please…
What are the UN numbers of the gases?
(A UN number has the letters “UN” and a four-digit number, which must be written on the cylinders.)
What sizes are the cylinders?
(The size in kgs or liters will also be written on them.)
How many of each type of cylinders are carried on the vehicle?
If you can get this info (accurately for each UN number) I will be able to tell you for sure whether an ADR licence or orange boards are required.
I’m sorry to hear of your concerns, but there are two different areas of law at work in this situation.
As far as parking a vehicle loaded with gases, storing the gases in a garage or around the back of the house are concerned, those are outside my remit, so I’d advise that a call to your local council might get you the info you need.
What I can tell you for sure is that gases in cylinders are definately dangerous goods when carried by vehicles on the roads. However, from your description, I’d say it’s not likely that your neighbour will need an ADR licence or orange boards.
In order to give you an accurate answer, I will need a bit more info please…
What are the UN numbers of the gases?
(A UN number has the letters “UN” and a four-digit number, which must be written on the cylinders.)
What sizes are the cylinders?
(The size in kgs or liters will also be written on them.)
How many of each type of cylinders are carried on the vehicle?
If you can get this info (accurately for each UN number) I will be able to tell you for sure whether an ADR licence or orange boards are required.
I hope this helps.
If nothing should he not be showing a green dimond with comp gas on the van ■■ we had to on the ambulance
Diesel dave= I will try and get the UN numbers but as you appreciate at the moment when he comes home it is dark and I dont want to go mooching around his vehicle. I will try and get them and let you know if you can wait a while thanks.
Stefluc
nick2008:
If nothing should he not be showing a green dimond with comp gas on the van ■■ we had to on the ambulance
Hi nick2008, An ambulance isn’t subject to ADR, so it doesn’t actually need to display any kind of dangerous goods vehicle markings.
The reason for this is that the ambulance isn’t transporting the gas(es) as ‘haulage,’ but rather for use by the crew.
Even without the above exemption, there’s nowhere near enough gas on board an ambulance to trigger ADR in any case, due to another exemption based on the amount loaded on the vehicle.
The ‘diamonds’ that are placed on the rear of many ambulances and builders’ vans are actually package labels (100mm x 100mm) and therefore aren’t required by ADR under any circumstances.
IMHO, I doubt that you “had to” have them on an ambulance.
Stefluc:
Diesel dave= I will try and get the UN numbers but as you appreciate at the moment when he comes home it is dark and I dont want to go mooching around his vehicle. I will try and get them and let you know if you can wait a while thanks.
Stefluc
Hi Stefluc, Thanks for pointing that out.
I suggest a slightly different approach now…
Can you see the colours of the labels (red or green?) or the name(s) of the gases without getting too close?
As a rough guide…
If you can see red labels or the words “propane” or “butane” the ADR limits are much smaller for these flammable gases than they are for gases which have a green label such as CO2 or helium.
If there are red labels, this could get to be interesting.
If the labels are green, you probably don’t have an argument that the guy needs orange boards or an ADR licence.
Either way up, you might get some advice about any gas storage safety concerns that you have by speaking to Health &Safety or environmental people at your local Council.
nick2008:
If nothing should he not be showing a green dimond with comp gas on the van ■■ we had to on the ambulance
Hi nick2008, An ambulance isn’t subject to ADR, so it doesn’t actually need to display any kind of dangerous goods vehicle markings.
The reason for this is that the ambulance isn’t transporting the gas(es) as ‘haulage,’ but rather for use by the crew.
Even without the above exemption, there’s nowhere near enough gas on board an ambulance to trigger ADR in any case, due to another exemption based on the amount loaded on the vehicle.
The ‘diamonds’ that are placed on the rear of many ambulances and builders’ vans are actually package labels (100mm x 100mm) and therefore aren’t required by ADR under any circumstances.
IMHO, I doubt that you “had to” have them on an ambulance.
i saw them on an ambulance and ask why he said its just to let someone you that gas is on the vechile for safety reasons in case of fire.
You would be able to get some advice from your local Fire brigade HQ as to the regs regarding the storage of these gases as they will come under the regs for storage of flammable gases, also under as has been said the HSE / Local council as storage of gases is also licensed by the council as well.
Remember in the unlikely event of a fire the Fire brigade will need to be informed what is in the building as in a garage repair shop fire they would expect to come across propane or acetylene in storage / use but not usually in a garage at a home address!
From what i can see on the back of his vehicle,he has them all lay flat and on top of one another,the orange coloured large bottles i would say about 6 or 7 are weight of about 25kg. there are smaller ones i think about 15kg,they would appear to be in the flammable range but cant quite see them properly.
The others are all mainly large 25kg balloon and cellar gases about 25 of these bottles in total but again viewed from a distance which is dark.
So,the total weight of these cyllinders carried are about between 800kg and 1000kg this is only small considering what he usualy has on.
I will try and get exactly what you are looking for as I appreciate it is hard to give advise based on guesses or assumptions.
Stefluc
Hi stefluc, WELCOME. 
